Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Ground & Other Ops Forums > Medical & Health
Reload this Page >

Denied initial Class 1 Medical

Medical & Health News and debate about medical and health issues as they relate to aircrews and aviation. Any information gleaned from this forum MUST be backed up by consulting your state-registered health professional or AME. Due to advertising legislation in various jurisdictions, endorsements of individual practitioners is not permitted.

Denied initial Class 1 Medical

Old 11th Oct 2020, 11:40
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: Denmark
Posts: 2
Question Denied initial Class 1 Medical

Hi there,
I'm new to this forum and hope that this thread is not misplaced. I just recently got an answer from the danish aviation authorities saying that they would not approve my initial class 1. The problem is that i have fainted (vasovagal syncope) 3 times. All incidents have occurred after hard exercise. However, all of the episodes have happened with warning, meaning that I got dizzy and I could feel it coming beforehand. The fact that it is vasovagal syncope caused by hard exercise has been proved by a cycle test.
After having read multiple threads on this forum, I see that some have obtained a medical class 1 on their initial assesment - with an OML.
However, the danish authorities has told me that OML is not possible on an inital class 1.

Besides, they have written to me that the medical was not granted beacuse of "uncertain cause" of fainting and that it is recurrent.

In my letter to the authorities I will argue that the episodes have all been happening because of a known physiological reason. Besides I would argue that the episodes have not been recurrent, As it has happened 3 times in 24(!) years!

What would you do in this situation? any help and feedback is appreciated. Have you experienced the same thing?

Thanks!
AndreasF is offline  
Old 24th Oct 2020, 13:23
  #2 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: South Wales, UK
Posts: 29
Originally Posted by AndreasF View Post
Hi there,
I'm new to this forum and hope that this thread is not misplaced. I just recently got an answer from the danish aviation authorities saying that they would not approve my initial class 1. The problem is that i have fainted (vasovagal syncope) 3 times. All incidents have occurred after hard exercise. However, all of the episodes have happened with warning, meaning that I got dizzy and I could feel it coming beforehand. The fact that it is vasovagal syncope caused by hard exercise has been proved by a cycle test.
After having read multiple threads on this forum, I see that some have obtained a medical class 1 on their initial assesment - with an OML.
However, the danish authorities has told me that OML is not possible on an inital class 1.

Besides, they have written to me that the medical was not granted beacuse of "uncertain cause" of fainting and that it is recurrent.

In my letter to the authorities I will argue that the episodes have all been happening because of a known physiological reason. Besides I would argue that the episodes have not been recurrent, As it has happened 3 times in 24(!) years!

What would you do in this situation? any help and feedback is appreciated. Have you experienced the same thing?

Thanks!
Hi Andreas, sorry you havent had any replies yet. These threads can either take off or not at all.
I'm not too familiar with the Danish system.
I would suggest, when restrictions allow, trying to gain a UK (CAA) Class 1 as it is possible to gain one with an OML here (a friend of mine recieved his a few weeks ago with an SSL that turns to an OML when he works). Perhaps you can then convert it to a Danish Medical? Are you under the care of a specialist for these fainting episodes?
It may not be possible for you to gain even a restricted Class 1 with uncontrolled fainting with an unknown cause.
However, I'd be inclined to keep pushing to find the cause of the faining first-for your health's sake mainly.
The keys questions would possibly "What's your diet like, blood pressure and sugar levels, do you suffer from anxiety, or are you on any meds that could case these episodes."
To be given a Class 1 with an OML I believe the chance of incapacitation needs to be less than 1%, iirc.

Anyways, best of luck to you, explore all avenues and talk to every professional you can. What one doctor may not consider, another might.
rob_ste97 is offline  
Old 24th Oct 2020, 17:25
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Not Aviation House
Posts: 574
Originally Posted by AndreasF View Post
Hi there,
I'm new to this forum and hope that this thread is not misplaced. I just recently got an answer from the danish aviation authorities saying that they would not approve my initial class 1. The problem is that i have fainted (vasovagal syncope) 3 times. All incidents have occurred after hard exercise. However, all of the episodes have happened with warning, meaning that I got dizzy and I could feel it coming beforehand. The fact that it is vasovagal syncope caused by hard exercise has been proved by a cycle test.
After having read multiple threads on this forum, I see that some have obtained a medical class 1 on their initial assesment - with an OML.
However, the danish authorities has told me that OML is not possible on an inital class 1.

Besides, they have written to me that the medical was not granted beacuse of "uncertain cause" of fainting and that it is recurrent.

In my letter to the authorities I will argue that the episodes have all been happening because of a known physiological reason. Besides I would argue that the episodes have not been recurrent, As it has happened 3 times in 24(!) years!

What would you do in this situation? any help and feedback is appreciated. Have you experienced the same thing?

Thanks!
Let me tell you a story about "uncertain cause".

I was taken ill a few years ago, and they could not initially find the cause, so they (UK CAA) put it down to pre-syncope, with an OML. I did hold a Class 1 for many years before, so am in a different position to you.

All my Doctors thought this was tosh, but that is what the CAA insisted on. They also omitted to bother looking at a head MRI - which was the FIRST THING the medics asked me to do.

Turns out that this very head MRI shows a brain tumour, which has since doubled in size.

Now the CAA refuse to even look at the MRI - as it proves THEIR 'diagnosis' was wrong. This is what you are up against with these regulators!

It gets worse, however, as when I asked to see my CAA records, about the same time I was in an MRI scanner, being magnetised, my employer got their tame AME (God I hope he is reading this) to phone up the CAA and give them a complete bull-shit reason for me being absent from work, that does not involve having a brain tumour ..............

This is the reality of what you are up against, my friend.

P.S. And yes, this AME is still practising!

Last edited by Fire and brimstone; 25th Oct 2020 at 10:19.
Fire and brimstone is offline  
Old 25th Oct 2020, 11:19
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: UK
Posts: 38
Originally Posted by Fire and brimstone View Post
my employer got their tame AME (God I hope he is reading this) to phone up the CAA and give them a complete bull-shit reason for me being absent from work, that does not involve having a brain tumour ..............

This is the reality of what you are up against, my friend.

P.S. And yes, this AME is still practising!
Forgive me if i am wrong but it sounds as though he had your back...
Field Required is online now  
Old 25th Oct 2020, 11:32
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Not Aviation House
Posts: 574
Originally Posted by Field Required View Post
Forgive me if i am wrong but it sounds as though he had your back...
If his motive was protecting my back, he could have had the decency to tell me what he was up to? E.g. "Hello - I have just phoned the CAA up and told them you are not actually sick".

An appropriate reply being "how the hell are you involved in my medical care - who told you this rubbish".



Last edited by Fire and brimstone; 25th Oct 2020 at 12:30.
Fire and brimstone is offline  
Old 25th Oct 2020, 14:21
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Kiwiland
Posts: 637
AndreasF I am afraid you are in a medical black hole.

What did the cycle test show? I presume it was an exercise ECG and showed a drop in heart rate or blood pressure or you were faint. If your blood sugar was OK and you didnt have a dangerous heart rythmn your cardiologist may well have said it was loss of consciousness of unknown aetiology related to exercise. I agree with you it was 'caused' by exercise but 'medical cause' means the diagnosis.

Many young people faint and it wears off over the years. It is because of immaturity of the nerves to the heart, which may last into your 20s together with the ability of a young healthy heart to produce profound slow and fast heart rates.

I suspect many aspiring pilots simply fail to declare a faint feeling years before as they have been told 'it was nothing' and you have been caught by your own honesty.

It might be worth talking to the UK CAA especially if you do have an exercise ECG with a full report. They may wave it through on the basis of the above, they may allow you through after X years of no recurrence (and I do believe it will go away as you get older), or they may just say no as they dont want you blacked out in the cockpit having run up the stairs after a quick check A on a cold night.

Do not waste time or money on tests or quackery: ask the regulator. There have been posting about an initial class 1 with an OML in the UK
Radgirl is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.