Tamesy1

Yes this was possible up until 7th December 2006, however the 'deviation route' has now been removed with the new FCL-3 amemdment.

See this page for more info:

http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?ca...49&pagetype=87

T1

Tutaewera

Thanks for the link Tamesy1. But if one reads the downloadable .pdf section on deviation it states:

ICAO Licence holders
Existing licence holders (i.e., a current valid licence equivalent to the medical certificate for which they are applying e.g. CPL or ATPL for class1, PPL for class 2) from other ICAO states with appropriate demonstrated experience applying for initial issue of a JAA medical certificate will be assessed to the JAA initial standard. Those who fall outside the initial standard, but within the revalidation standard and subject to satisfactory assessment and appropriate limitations, may be considered for a long-term deviation, which will then be transferred to their JAA licence, when issued.

So to answer my own question, it looks like those with existing ICAO class 1 medicals and industry experience CAN get deviation. Its just for ab initios where its been dumped...

But many thanks for the link, its solved the problem.

Mr Man

Hi ,
I have a friend (honestly)who had a problem with the standard plates,so had VFR restriction.He desperately wants a class 1.He has done the lantern test with no success (apparently got 4 right instead of the minimum 6)and was advised that his very last option was the "Dutch?"test.Now I know nothing about colour blindness and would like to put this all into perspective before advising him.I would be really grateful for any advice on options etc.I have done a search but there seems so much on the subject that I'm struggling to find info relative to his problem with my non existent knowledge in this field.
Thanks in advance,oh,by the way,I know the prob is green and white if this helps.

TelBoy

Mr Man

Have a look at page 10 of this thread a few people have made comments about Class 1 in Holland.

As for your "friend" saying he did not get the minimum 6 right????? I thought you had to get all right!

He should have been able to do the Holmes Wright test which is two lights one above the other. They will show red, white or green and you have to say what they are. Then there is the Bayne test. I personally have not taken this yet but understand that is shows red, white, orange, blue and green.

Another option if he wants to fly outside Europe is the FAA route. If you look at my previous posts about FAA testing I need to be corrected. Now you only need to pass the light signal test to get any class medical. I only found this when I applied for a replacment waiver and got a letter back saying that it is good for ANY class medical see http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/...m_tech/item52/

The signal test is to read the tower signal gun at distances upto about a mile. IF you pass (some people here think the FAA is a route for all CVD, but you still need to pass the test) you get a SODA - Statement of Demonstrated Ability, and this acts as the colour vision part of your medical.

Good luck to your friend, he needs it. Do not give up and why not get him to post here personally - this forum has been a real boost for me.

ROTHERFLY

Hi All.

My First Thread On Pprune. Im Mr Man's "friend" ! So I Do Exist !!

Just Got Back From Dublin Where I Failed The Holmes Wright Test. Got 6 Wrong Out Of 22. On My Initial Isihara Plates I Got 6 Wrong Out Of 18.

The Problem For Me Is The Green/white Lightcombination On The Test.
Thanks Telboy For The Advise And Links Which I've Looked Through. My Fear Is That Even If I Took The Beyne Lantern Test I Still Wont Be Able To Pick Out Those Colours. The Faa Route May Be The Only Option Left. Would Appreciate Any Advise/experience On The Matter.

Regards.

TelBoy

Rotherfly - why not try the City Unit test if you are going to be in the UK. £75 and they will give you all the tests so that you can see what you can do and actually try the Bayne.

The FAA light Signal Test (as I took it) was taken sitting in a car with an FAA examiner. This guy is NOT a Doctor but an FAA official. First we parked at 1000 yards from the tower and the FAA guy radioed the tower to start the test. You tell him the colours you see. The test was then repeated at 1500 yards. The FAA man was concerned that the tower had tinted windows and this would affect the test, but I passed OK - I'm not sure if they allow mistakes.

To get the test you must have an FAA medical with restrictions because of colour vision. You then apply to the FAA and they give you a letter to take the test. Sorry I can't remember the exact details, it was 13 years ago. If you pass you can use this towards any aviation medical.

NOTE: Even the FAA said that employers do not like the SODA waiver, but I know that jobs ARE there for the right people with them.

We all know how you feel here in this forum, but don't get down, do everything you can to fulfill your dreams.

City Uni is at :http://www.city.ac.uk/optometry/publ...ourvision.html

Hope this helps. PM me if you wish and all the best for your future.

Beaver diver

I am just curious as I have heard that for some companies a government regulated medical Class 1 with no restrictions just isn't enough so they like to dig further. Does anyone knows what those medical exams consist of and which companies in UK practice their own medical exams?
I have had some problems with colour deficiency, but nevertheless I have JAA and Canadian Class 1 medical with no restrictions, since I have under gone the alternative Lantern test.
Few days ago I went for an assesment to Stansted for working on the airport and they didn't grant me the job, because I could't read those outdated isihara plates. So, I am a little bit worried how stringent do companies get and are there any that are not? (Ryanair, Easyjet,BMI...?)

Thanks and you can PM me as well, I'd appreciate your help

Cheers

TelBoy

Beaver diver - I would complain to the DDA about the place at Stanstead. If the regulators say you are safe to fly there, how can they say that you are unsafe!!!

About time that discrimination like this was delt with.

Good luck mate.

Mr Man

Thanks for the time TelBoy,good of you to care!

Beaver diver

Thanks for the support!

We should actually make an website regarding this issues and make petitions and then maybe the CAA and JAA would make a change...
I wrote a letter to CAA regarding my case and they've replied that it is going to take them up to ten days to reply...we'll see.
But really, it is about time that we make some sort of petition or something to address this problem and get some back up from the respected doctors as well. Let me know if anyone interested and then lets pull our strings together. Individually ,we can't do much, but if we try together, things must move forward...
I will contact few people for the website and see how it goes. All of you who are serious and interested to move this issue forward, please send me an e- mail.
My e mail is : [email protected]

Talk to you later

BD

unfazed

wHAT ABOUT A MASS PROTEST IN THE FORM OF A NIGHT FLIGHT BY ALL CVD'S IN THE COUNTRY AT THE SAME TIME

ILLEGAL BUT WOULD RAISE PR PROFILE A BIT AND CONFRONT CAA

DONT FORGET THEY COULD PAY FOR THE LEGAL COSTS IF THEY WANTED TO PROSECUTE EVERYONE WHO TOOK PART (SHOE ON THE OTHER FOOT THEN)

BIT RISKY BUT I WOULD DO IT TO CHALLENGE THE RULES AS THEY STAND

GET SOME MEDIA COVERAGE ?

TelBoy

Hey unfazed that would cause a stir for all of us FAA PPL holders with SODA waiver - who ARE night rated (provided an N is on the side of the aircraft) because the FAA PPL also covers night!!

How daft the rules are.

Can the CAA take an FAA licence away when you are operating within its legal framework (oh except a G on side of aircraft)?

Jails are full anyway

unfazed

Daft rules deserve scrutiny in court so let CAA pay for legal challenge

Easier to defend a logical position than an illogical and twisted rule

I for one would love to run rings through their case and I would have fun doing it

Drat my anti-authoratitive dangerous personality type is coming to the fore again !!!!!!

speedbird421

Hi guys,
Am 40 yrs old, taking up aviation as a career. Been diagnosed with internal squint wherein the prism test gives 20 diopters for near-sightedness and 10 diopters for far-sightedness. For the 3-d vision test i was diagnosed to be able to see plates (probably what they call stereoscopic pictures), of 480 measure,with the help of 3-d vision glasses. plates of a measure of 240 and 60-120 were not visible to me.
The doctor said that i will not be cleared by the medical examiners at the class 1 level. For an example,the squint specailist says i will be unable to judge ccloseness to the runway at the time of landing an aircraft. Well, this is certainly not true, as i have had a few hours of flying experience lately, and have been successsfully able to judge, when an aircraft is to be flared.
I, MOST DEFINETELY, HAD NO TROUBLE IN GAUGING THE PROXIMITY OF GROUND WHILST LANDING.
None of the eye specialists i have met, know of any permissisble limits, prescribed by the Directorate General Of Civil Aviation(DGCA), in India.
Can anyone please tell me what limits have been set by ICAO, regarding
my query.
I do enjoy 20/20 vision and have no reading glasses or spectacles for ar sightedness.
PLEASE HELP.
Thank you.

Owenrules

Hi all,
Just new to your forum, I too unfortunately suffer from CVD (well apparently). My situation I think is somewhat similar to every last one of you, I can see great from day to day, I can tell the difference between all colors but when someone places those damn plates in front of me I seem to hit a brick wall.

On the contrary, unlike most of you guys I'm not yet a pilot by any standards (unless you count all the Flight Simulators). I have wanted to fly commercially all my life and was told from an early age that I couldn't, but from reading all 16 or so pages of this thread I have been given a small glimpse of hope.

I have always hoped I could sign myself up for the integrated approach to become a First Officer however even after reading most of the posts I am slightly miffed.

I have a question..... If I for example traveled abroad to Germany or the likes to obtain my Class 1 medical and got it converted if I may to the correct kind for the UK how long is it valid for? If I were to fork out 80K on an integrated approach, became a First Officer, what is stopping me from failing a retest whenever it arises later in my career? And in turn loosing my license? An apology if this has been asked before but I must have glanced over it.

Furthermore, regarding the legal action being discussed. I have some knowledge of the law and the way the courts work as I have currently rounded up an LLB and am currently a trainee solicitor. From what I gather forking out 250k for legal action is extremely risky. I cant for see the courts holding a sympathetic view towards us. I understand that the CAA is acting unfairly in terms of CVD pilots and students however the courts would more than likely make a policy decision in our case rather than a justifiable one. This happens only too often, the judges could make a decision for what they believe and then reason back wards. There would be a higher chance of sucess if the case went to Strasbourg, if it were possible to find a law firm with sufficient interest and confidence in sucess then were talking action!
In addition the CAA is definitely not worthy of a judicial review, nor would one ever be granted due to the CVD tests it supports.

TelBoy

Owenrules - in reply to your question about passing a medical and later failing retests after forking out a fortune, well the colour vision test only needs to be taken at your initial medical, so you will not be tested for it again. You can obvioustly fail further medicals due to other problems, but thats not what we are concerned about here.

A word of caution. The CAA thinks colour vision never changes so if you take a class 1 and fail - they will not allow a retest, but you can get only the colour vision test done.

Why not try the City Uni tests to see exactley what you are likely to pass and where, not bad for £75.

Welcome to the forum and I wish you all the best with your future flying.

norton2005

Hey people, my prescription for my contact lenses is -6.5 in each eye. what i was wondering is is there any way to get around the problem of me being half a dioptre out? or will the CAA just fail me?

TelBoy

Just thought I would like to share this with you all

16,540 CVD pilots in US and 1 accedent where colour vision is mentioned, have a read its interesting

http://wxap.grc.nasa.gov/review/2005...ella-color.pdf

norton2005

come on guys, has no one got any info on this?

Bealzebub

Yes. the CAA do.
Pick up the phone and call them.