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Una Due Tfc 21st Aug 2019 16:29

Hi Orac, Thanks for that.

The issue I’m trying to make clear is that the CTA under current arrangement works because Latvians, Romanians etc have free movement in both the UK and Ireland. After November 1st under current proposals, they’ll no longer have free movement in the UK but will in Ireland. They’ll enter Ireland perfectly legally and as things stand Britain can’t do a thing to stop them entering via NI unless it puts a border somewhere, whether that’s between NI & ROI or between Britain & NI.

SARF, as I’m trying to make clear, your problem isn’t asylum seekers, it’s those legally entitled to enter ROI but not the UK, how do you know if they’re in the UK or not?

racedo 21st Aug 2019 16:48


Originally Posted by NoelEvans (Post 10550702)
Any action by the Irish government that put the CTA at risk (and joining Schengen would surely make that a certainty) would mean them having to face the ire (excuse the pun!) of the Irish population. Looking at the UK resident posters here who themselves, or thought their Irish parents/grandparents, have benefitted from the CTA enabling them to move freely to the UK and settle here. The removal of that ability by any action such as joining Schengen would probably be 'terminal' for the Irish government of the day.

So how are UK Border agency going to police 208 crossings, 310 miles of border with a population who refuses to allow them do it ?

charliegolf 21st Aug 2019 16:50


Originally Posted by racedo (Post 10550882)
So how are UK Border agency going to police 208 crossings, 310 miles of border with a population who refuses to allow them do it ?

They could use the army. Oh, wait...

CG

racedo 21st Aug 2019 16:52


Originally Posted by bpilatus (Post 10550728)
Yes.

It is called 'brexit' and it means that our sovereign government (and only our sovereign government) decides how we manage our borders.

It is so, so, simple I am surprised it hasn't 'clicked' yet for you.

Thank you for reading

Really ?

How then have you controlled immigration fron non EU members ?

Has it gone down ?

racedo 21st Aug 2019 16:56


Originally Posted by bpilatus (Post 10550738)
You eu folk love your 'monitoring' and 'controlling' of stuff. :D

Is that why London has more CCTV cameras than anywhere else.

Fly Aiprt 21st Aug 2019 17:16


It is so, so, simple I am surprised it hasn't 'clicked' yet for you

Not sure of what exactly your domain of expertise is, but whereas you may be fully prepared, it is not the case for many sectors of activity in the UK : food, fisheries, pharmacy, transport, automobile, fuel...
They all express concern about the complexity of the situation and their unpreparedness. It doesn't seem to have clicked for them either ;-)
Lack of competence ?
Or maybe you just didn't grasp the situation in its entirety ?

bpilatus 21st Aug 2019 17:41


Originally Posted by racedo
How then have you controlled immigration fron non EU members ?

popped out for a quick cigarette break...

You seem to conflate 'manage' and 'control' far too easily it must be an eu thing...

We 'manage' non-EU migration just fine. It's ours to manage as we see fit as a sovereign nation.

Post brexit we shall manage eu immigration just fine too, with no silly rules about it coming as diktats from unelected juntas.

I'm looking forward to it. When anyone, post brexit, whinge about immigration (or whatever) we can fix it at the ballot box.

Thank you for reading.

wiggy 21st Aug 2019 17:49


Originally Posted by bpilatus (Post 10550921)

You seem to conflate 'manage' and 'control' far too easily it must be an eu thing...
.

Lexico- powered by the OED , on "manage"

Thank you for reading definition 1.4 and 1.5....

Jack D 21st Aug 2019 17:57


Originally Posted by Fly Aiprt (Post 10550903)
Not sure of what exactly your domain of expertise is, but whereas you may be fully prepared, it is not the case for many sectors of activity in the UK : food, fisheries, pharmacy, transport, automobile, fuel...
They all express concern about the complexity of the situation and their unpreparedness. It doesn't seem to have clicked for them either ;-)
Lack of competence ?
Or maybe you just didn't grasp the situation in its entirety ?

It doesnít really matter ! obsession with beaurocracy is do EU, all this will be renegotiated in due course
itís clearly impossible to prepare for every minor detail .
The situation has been firmly grasped, surprises are expected thatís all.

Sallyann1234 21st Aug 2019 18:00


Originally Posted by bpilatus (Post 10550921)

We 'manage' non-EU migration just fine. It's ours to manage as we see fit as a sovereign nation.

You're not very good at this are you?

Year after year our immigration from outside the EU has been greater than from inside the EU. In spite of successive governments pledging to reduce it. That will not be affected by Brexit, except perhaps to increase because immigration staff will now have to check EU travellers as well.

Please explain how that has been 'managed'.


Una Due Tfc 21st Aug 2019 18:10


Originally Posted by bpilatus (Post 10550921)
popped out for a quick cigarette break...

You seem to conflate 'manage' and 'control' far too easily it must be an eu thing...

We 'manage' non-EU migration just fine. It's ours to manage as we see fit as a sovereign nation.

Post brexit we shall manage eu immigration just fine too, with no silly rules about it coming as diktats from unelected juntas.

I'm looking forward to it. When anyone, post brexit, whinge about immigration (or whatever) we can fix it at the ballot box.

Thank you for reading.

So you don't know then? That's fine just admit it. Unfortunately it seems to sum up Brexit in a nutshell. "Who cares about the details, everything will be fine". Bloody frightening. And enough with saying the EU is an unelected junta, we all voted for who we wanted to represent us in the EU within the last few months. It isn't the House of Lords you know!

chevvron 21st Aug 2019 18:15


Originally Posted by Sallyann1234 (Post 10550932)
You're not very good at this are you?

Year after year our immigration from outside the EU has been greater than from inside the EU. In spite of successive governments pledging to reduce it. That will not be affected by Brexit, except perhaps to increase because immigration staff will now have to check EU travellers as well.

Please explain how that has been 'managed'.

According to the BBC today, the ONS have been under estimating EU immigration and over estimating non EU immigration for years.

Fly Aiprt 21st Aug 2019 18:43


Originally Posted by wiggy (Post 10550924)
Lexico- powered by the OED , on "manage"

Thank you for reading definition 1.4 and 1.5....

Lol !
And this guy was talking about "eu know-nothing " just a while ago...;-)

racedo 21st Aug 2019 18:43


Originally Posted by bpilatus (Post 10550921)
popped out for a quick cigarette break...

You seem to conflate 'manage' and 'control' far too easily it must be an eu thing...

We 'manage' non-EU migration just fine. It's ours to manage as we see fit as a sovereign nation.

Post brexit we shall manage eu immigration just fine too, with no silly rules about it coming as diktats from unelected juntas.

I'm looking forward to it. When anyone, post brexit, whinge about immigration (or whatever) we can fix it at the ballot box.

Thank you for reading.

So you got no idea then.

How many Non EU migrants have entered UK since 2004 ?

Fly Aiprt 21st Aug 2019 18:53


Originally Posted by Jack D (Post 10550929)
The situation has been firmly grasped, surprises are expected thatís all.



Clearly an oxymoron...
But I agree my friend, surprises are to be expected ;-)
By whom, that is the question...

Fly Aiprt 21st Aug 2019 18:59


Originally Posted by racedo (Post 10550969)
So you got no idea then.

How many Non EU migrants have entered UK since 2004 ?

Nobody knows, and when - and if - they leave - nobody will know either.
But it doesn't matter.
What will matter will be food and fuel supplies, pharmaceuticals, transport, car industry, the value of the £.

NutLoose 21st Aug 2019 19:25

Seems we have movement over the backstop, the EU is finally waking up to the fact we are leaving regardless

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49427674

Fly Aiprt 21st Aug 2019 19:49


Originally Posted by NutLoose (Post 10551008)
Seems we have movement over the backstop, the EU is finally waking up to the fact we are leaving regardless

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49427674

Wait a minute, there is a catch :
" it would be up to the UK to offer a workable plan. "

A workable plan...

Personnally I do not really care if they are leaving or not.

It's all about one thing : are they really prepared to leave, or are they not and so are gonna hang around for days or months ?

Pontius Navigator 21st Aug 2019 19:56


Originally Posted by chevvron (Post 10550947)
According to the BBC today, the ONS have been under estimating EU immigration and over estimating non EU immigration for years.

Statistical aberration perhaps or 'lies . . . '

Regarding free travel, I recall a flight from Belfast to East Midlands. We had just flown in and joined the immigration queue after the Belfast flight. Every went through immigration.

NutLoose 21st Aug 2019 20:12

FlyA,

The thing is there is movement, the EU's cast in stone attitude is changing and that is a major breakthrough.


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