PPRuNe Forums

PPRuNe Forums (https://www.pprune.org/)
-   Jet Blast (https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast-16/)
-   -   BREXIT (https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/619673-brexit.html)

NutLoose 23rd Oct 2019 09:31

One law that does need to change is the inability of a sitting PM to call an election when his side has lost a majority, it is just wrong that we could run for years with a Government with their hands tied behind their backs in theory unable to pass any laws or budgets.

pax britanica 23rd Oct 2019 10:09

Takeaways from yesterday

Ian Duncan-Smith insisting that parliament are being deliberately difficult since they know full well whats in Boris bill as it is the same as the white paper Theresa May put forward only a a year ago. Hmmmm well wasn't it him and his friends who voted against that a year ago.

Boris ' insistence on leaving on 31/10, dying in ditches etc , was stupid from the start- had he asked for a three month extension he could probably have got all this through without lying to the Queen and and other stupid stunts which deeply question his credibility as PM

Boris was known to have a very very distant relationship with the truth before becoming PM but now he is seen as completely and utterly dishonest to the point where no one really believes him and therefor wont take his word for anything in his new deal , which of course isnt new at all and contains exactly the provisions NI/DUP didnt want under TM.

That we have a Parliamentary democracy in this country not a dictatorship and the PM is first and foremost an MP and has to obey the rules like anyone else. you vote for your MP not for the PM. Talking of which an election will be interesting-what will happen say in Walton on Thames where the MP is the demonstrably hapless and hopeless Dominic Raab, as Pro brexit as can be but 75% of his constituents voted Remain . Or even my own constituency where we are blessed with Ice Man Gove where the same local council area went from a Conservative majority of 20 plus to a majority of 1 in the post brexit council elections.

Steepclimb 23rd Oct 2019 10:14


Originally Posted by NutLoose (Post 10601321)
I was voting as were those I have asked to leave the EU period, we were not voting on how we left as the idea of a soft Brexit had never been mooted at that point, remember the monies that we pay to the EU would by the definition of the out campaign have been retained in the UK, the soft Brexit as they put it does not allow that, so that was never on the cards.
AND I WISH PEOPLE IN HERE WOULD STOP TELLING ME WHY AND HOW I VOTED TO LEAVE.

You've summed up the problem. The actual consequences of leaving the EU were never spelt out certainly not the by leave campaign and very badly by the remain campaign.

No one thought of Northern Ireland, as usual. No one thought of Scotland as usual. No one speaks of Wales as usual.
No one spoke of or expected a no deal exit. No one thought of how the EU would react. No one imagined a carefully negotiated deal brought forward by the government would be rejected by an unholy alliance of the Brexiteers and the Labour Party. Which would bring down a Tory PM, propelling Boris Johnson into number 10. A man who has a long standing history of making up negative stories and lies about the EU.

No one saw it coming, not even you.


Aihkio 23rd Oct 2019 10:28

I don't quite get it, the UK system seems to take WWs in stride but a tiny Brexit throws it into knots.

As I have never understood how a country without a written constitution could work I am assuming I am looking at such a case just now.

Or could somebody tell me where I err ...

Fly Aiprt 23rd Oct 2019 10:41


Originally Posted by NutLoose (Post 10601321)
I was voting as were those I have asked to leave the EU period, we were not voting on how we left

:E
No need to whinge : you didn't care how you would leave, so no problem leaving with 'people telling you how you voted and why', is it ?
Or is it that you didn't quite exactly know why and what you voted for...?


Fly Aiprt 23rd Oct 2019 10:44


Originally Posted by Groundbased (Post 10601309)
How could he have signed this deal months ago? It wasn't on the table until two weeks ago.

Oh yes it was.
What kept him ?


Groundbased 23rd Oct 2019 10:46


Originally Posted by Sallyann1234 (Post 10601326)
A better one was.

That depends on your point of view. From the perspective of the remain majority (of MPs) May's deal was obviously going to be better than anything that came later for the reasons I stated in another post. They should have voted for it when they had the chance. Johnson wouldn't even be Prime Minister and we would now be having the trade discussion.

Groundbased 23rd Oct 2019 10:48


Originally Posted by Fly Aiprt (Post 10601381)
Oh yes it was.
What kept him ?

This deal was not on the table. May's deal was and that was different.

WB627 23rd Oct 2019 10:57

I still can't understand how this deal does not contravene the Good Friday agreement, or why no one has yet used that legally binding international treaty, to seek an injunction preventing Brexit.

Perhaps someone could enlighten me.

Groundbased 23rd Oct 2019 11:00


Originally Posted by WB627 (Post 10601388)
I still can't understand how this deal does not contravene the Good Friday agreement, or why no one has yet used that legally binding international treaty, to seek an injunction preventing Brexit.

Perhaps someone could enlighten me.

This surprises me also. Given that the EU have continually stated that their primary objective is to ensure the GFA is not compromised I can only assume that by agreeing to the deal they believe it doesn't affect the GFA. I think a case has been brought to examine this, but nothing forthcoming as yet.

Fly Aiprt 23rd Oct 2019 11:02


Originally Posted by Groundbased (Post 10601383)
This deal was not on the table. May's deal was and that was different.

A deal is something you have to negotiate with the other party.
What kept him from negotiating months ago ?

Groundbased 23rd Oct 2019 11:35


Originally Posted by Fly Aiprt (Post 10601394)
A deal is something you have to negotiate with the other party.
What kept him from negotiating months ago ?

He wasn't the Prime Minister.

If you mean since he became Prime Minister then he has had 90 odd days to re-open and re-negotiate something that had taken 2.5 years to put together, which most people said was not possible, and which the EU originally said was not up for re-negotiation.

Fly Aiprt 23rd Oct 2019 11:40


Originally Posted by Groundbased (Post 10601407)
He wasn't the Prime Minister.

I had the notion he's entered office on July the 23rd.
What has he been doing since then ?

Fly Aiprt 23rd Oct 2019 11:48

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....2ed52e22fa.jpg

Groundbased 23rd Oct 2019 11:50


Originally Posted by Fly Aiprt (Post 10601412)
I had the notion he's entered office on July the 23rd.
What has he been doing since then ?

Negotiating.

OilCan 23rd Oct 2019 11:53


Originally Posted by wiggy (Post 10601234)
Interesting but of course the current legal entitlement in the UK ( ATM underpinned by the EU rules) is not be what many people are expressing concerns about....

You're quite right wiggy, I was merely trying to highlight the guff spouted by an 'honourable gentleman' during yesterdays debate. (post 3439)

Torquetalk 23rd Oct 2019 12:08

Blowjo’s tactics are all designed to put him in the light of being true to the will of the people. He and his team knew full well that parliament would not back a rush through prior 31st October; the EU will grant an extension; there will be an election and the Torres will be back in with an increased majority due to astute crowd pleasing and Brexit fatigue. Which other party has anything like coherence of message to prevent this?

The price for the UK as England and Wales go boldly forth into that world of unfettered possibility will be felt in the coming years.

WB627 23rd Oct 2019 12:12


Originally Posted by Torquetalk (Post 10601432)
The price for the UK as England and Wales go boldly forth into that world of unfettered possibility will be felt in the coming years.

The price for the UK will be Bojo giving the SDP another referendum in return for their 35 votes

Torquetalk 23rd Oct 2019 12:20


Originally Posted by WB627 (Post 10601437)
The price for the UK will be Bojo giving the SDP another referendum in return for their 35 votes

I doubt that Blowjo will need to promise the SNP anything. The other parties are so inept at getting a nation protecting message across that the popular vote and frustration will wash away the reality that it was the Tories which got us into this mess, gravely deepened social problems with austerity for those in need, and that they represent a continuing threat to the United Kingdom. Conservatives my arse.

charliegolf 23rd Oct 2019 12:37


Originally Posted by Groundbased (Post 10601407)
He wasn't the Prime Minister.

If you mean since he became Prime Minister then he has had 90 odd days to re-open and re-negotiate something that had taken 2.5 years to put together, which most people said was not possible, and which the EU originally said was not up for re-negotiation.

'No re-negotiation' as an EU mantra only really applied to the EU giving ground. UK offering up something that was a redline for 3 years was hardly a re-negotiation was it?

CG


All times are GMT. The time now is 18:49.


Copyright 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.