PPRuNe Forums

PPRuNe Forums (https://www.pprune.org/)
-   Jet Blast (https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast-16/)
-   -   What`s a real and genuine asylum seeker (https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/616853-what-s-real-genuine-asylum-seeker.html)

Chronus 2nd Jan 2019 18:34

What`s a real and genuine asylum seeker
 
No doubt we have all heard Javid`s declaration of real and genuine asylum seekers. What`s one of these, is there really such a thing. Men, women, young old, boys, girls, babes in arms, running away from their homes, abandoning all they own and possess, in fear of their lives, persecuted, oppressed by their own folk, and to prefer to risk their lives in crossing the cold waters of the English Channel in inflatable dinghies in the dark of night. Who may these people and what they are running away from must be a really tough question. How and by whom these questions are to be answered is a costly one. Javid wonders why these people don`t seek asylum in the first country in which they land. I would have thought it is by now patently obvious why they choose the UK. Is it not that the UK is the friendliest and most accommodating legal haven to head for in the whole of the EU. But rush they must, the word is out, and that word is Brexit .

ORAC 2nd Jan 2019 18:57

An asylum seeker is any person who flees his or her home country, enters another country and applies for asylum, who says they are a refugee, but whose claim has not yet been definitively evaluated.

The Dublin Regulation (Regulation 604/2013) is the EU law that determines which EU member state is responsible and must conduct the examination of an applicant for asylum. The responsible member state is the member state through which the asylum seeker entered the EU. The regulation lays down the procedures for the transfer of the asylum seeker back to the entrant member state.

The entrant member state is responsible for either accepting or rejecting the claim; the seeker may not restart the process in another member state.

Espada III 2nd Jan 2019 20:25

Whilst that may be technically correct the de facto answer is of course that a genuine asylum seeker has a genuine fear for his/her life if they were to return to their country of birth/nationality etc. It is probable that 99% of those crossing the Channel are Economic Migrants, whose own countries are so ravaged by corruption that the general population is desperate to leave. The real course of action for these people is to change the governments of those countries (yes, I do mean recolonisation) so that the economies recover to a point where people do not need to take the huge financial and life threatening gamble to cross the Med in leaky boats, Europe and the UK cannot afford all these people and still maintain the quality of life that is the reason these people come over in the first place. The mineral wealth of Africa is so big the population could live like Norwegians if the governments were suitably efficient and honest.

In the post Korean War era, South Korea had an economy no better than sub-Saharan Africa. Now look at it compared to African countries.

lomapaseo 2nd Jan 2019 20:28

What`s a real and genuine asylum seeker


Jullian Assange

BehindBlueEyes 2nd Jan 2019 20:41

Many of those escaping from war torn, unstable or poverty stricken countries are no more victims or any more deserving than any other of their compatriots - they all need help. In fact, one could argue that the individuals who have are able to travel are less of a victim than those that cannot do anything and are left behind; the sick, the poor, the elderly. The West could benefit them and improve their situations far more with political will and pressure on their leaders rather than taking on a continuous stream of migrants.

As usual, the gutless and ineffectual UN do nothing for fear of offending the despotic leaders.

Pontius Navigator 2nd Jan 2019 21:14

Recolonisation of what are effectively failed states is too late. The old colonial powers no longer have the power to impose their will which was largely funded by exploitation of the colony's resources. The 'colonies' are too wealthy and too well armed for Western powers to forcibly take control.

One thing the West could do would be to level the wealth mountains. Money creamed off by a corrupt class may be squirelled away in foreign banks; seize it. At a stroke they no longer have their foreign boltholes to which they can retire with their loot. They would then have no alternative but build their palaces at home. That at least would help the GDP. Where they seek to buy gold taps or marble baths etc, embargo imports; enforce local production. Embargo al! vanity imports - Rolls Royces or HMS Mermaid for instance.

DaveReidUK 2nd Jan 2019 22:03


Originally Posted by BehindBlueEyes (Post 10349992)
As usual, the gutless and ineffectual UN do nothing for fear of offending the despotic leaders.

You appear to be confusing the UN with some kind of World Government.

ramble on 2nd Jan 2019 22:23

Genuine asylum seekers? Met a young Iranian guy here in Oz recently. He told me he came to Australia as a refugee. Mother and father and 6 siblings still living happily in Iran. One brother already in Australia. Refugee my arse, and heaps of agro to boot.....

Pinky the pilot 3rd Jan 2019 07:34


Met a young Iranian guy here in Oz recently. He told me he came to Australia as a refugee. Mother and father and 6 siblings still living happily in Iran. One brother already in Australia. Refugee my arse, and heaps of agro to boot.....
ramble on; I wonder if he was one of the six Iranian 'asylum seekers' shown on TV back in the Rudd/Gillard/Rudd years getting off HMAS Taxi, all 'roided up with 'six pack' abdomens and each and every one carrying a laptop computer!:*

Echo Romeo 3rd Jan 2019 07:45

Ok, so what happens to these people that have been picked up on the South coast. Do they have an automatic right to asylum here? Will they be sent back, detained, provided for. What?

Pontius Navigator 3rd Jan 2019 07:46

Met a young Iranian working in a silver shop in Tehran opposite our hotel. Pleasant chap, good English, wanted to buy my rain coat. Asked about England​​​​​​ wanted to go to London. This was 45 years ago under the Shah.

Tehran, to us, was an exciting city. Exotic bustling place with Bazaars and good shops, pretty women, ski resorts up in the hills not far away. Very cosmopolitan but also populated with poor, uneducated and illiterate peasants.

The educated and worldly wise wanted out. They found their world claustrophobic. They could go to Beirut, the jewel of Arabia, but England and the world was their dream.

SOPS 3rd Jan 2019 08:53


Originally Posted by Pinky the pilot (Post 10350285)
ramble on; I wonder if he was one of the six Iranian 'asylum seekers' shown on TV back in the Rudd/Gillard/Rudd years getting off HMAS Taxi, all 'roided up with 'six pack' abdomens and each and every one carrying a laptop computer!:*

I remember those photos so well, Pinky. Asylum Seekers.. my ar$e!!

Gertrude the Wombat 3rd Jan 2019 08:53


Originally Posted by Echo Romeo (Post 10350294)
Do they have an automatic right to asylum here?

No.

They can put in a claim, but most claims are unsuccessful.

WingNut60 3rd Jan 2019 09:16


Originally Posted by Gertrude the Wombat (Post 10350355)
No.

They can put in a claim, but most claims are unsuccessful.

I am lead to believe that about 30% of claims are verified and accepted.
Of the remainder, about a further 30% of rejections are reversed on appeal.
So that takes you out to about 40 - 50 % are finally accepted.

My source is not verifiable. Anyone have any better numbers?

papajuliet 3rd Jan 2019 09:18

Well over 90% are unsuccessful - that's the good news. They then keep appealing against the decision. Few appeals succeed. They then disappear before they can be deported. So the end result is that they're still here somewhere.

ORAC 3rd Jan 2019 09:28

Asylum seekers number around 110,000 a year - mainly visa overstayers. Deportations and voluntary removals number around 40,000 a year. So about 70,000 a year vanish into the population when their applications are refused.

Sprogget 3rd Jan 2019 10:54


Originally Posted by ORAC (Post 10349925)
An asylum seeker is any person who flees his or her home country, enters another country and applies for asylum, who says they are a refugee, but whose claim has not yet been definitively evaluated.

The Dublin Regulation (Regulation 604/2013) is the EU law that determines which EU member state is responsible and must conduct the examination of an applicant for asylum. The responsible member state is the member state through which the asylum seeker entered the EU. The regulation lays down the procedures for the transfer of the asylum seeker back to the entrant member state.

The entrant member state is responsible for either accepting or rejecting the claim; the seeker may not restart the process in another member state.

This is not true.

eal401 3rd Jan 2019 12:12

I would assume that the definition you are after is someone fleeing hardship, persecution or war in their homeland and who seeks sanctuary in the first safe country they come across.

I would be curious to know from those coming to the UK what is dangerous and unsuitable about Italy, Germany, France, Spain etc? I was not aware of any specific threats in those countries.

ORAC 3rd Jan 2019 12:12

Really? Which part are you questioning?

vctenderness 3rd Jan 2019 16:16

In relation to the latest arrivals via dinghy every report I have heard or seen refers to all of them as Iranian. So why does every bleeding heart leftie I have heard on radio and tv refer to ‘escaping war and the bombing of their countries?

Have I missed something? Has The Donald started a war in Iran? Has Mother Theresa sent our aircraft carrier (minus aircraft) to The Gulf?

They are coming from France,which last time I visited, was a pretty civilised place and also not being bombed or at war.

These people are cunning chancers and know we are the biggest soft touch on the planet. Once they set foot on U.K. soil, or the deck of a British water taxi, sorry Royal Navy warship, they are on the gravey train. Free houses, free education, free health care even free money.

Asylum seekers my arse!



All times are GMT. The time now is 18:57.


Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.