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PDR1 18th May 2017 07:55


Originally Posted by SASless (Post 9774546)
Forget the charge even.....let's have some evidence...any evidence....that even remotely how ever slight rises to the level of reasonable grounds to believe any criminal act has occurred!

There just isn't any!

Someone....anyone....lay it out!

Not allegations....but firm hard facts....anything!

This has only two possible interpretations.

The most likely one is that you are simply speculating because you can't possibly know what evidence the FBI do or don't have. You've heard stuff in the media, but of course you only believe media reports when they are praising your beloved Donald so that's not really evidence in any meaningful sense.

The less likely one is that you do know because someone in the FBI has been leaking details of ongoing investigations to you, which would mean that both they and you are parties to a federal offence.

Which is it?

The really sad thing is that the Trumpansita acolyte, like all good little Epsilons, are clearly still seeing five fingers...

PDR

PDR1 18th May 2017 07:59


Originally Posted by Concours77 (Post 9774307)
The FBI investigates, it does not prosecute.

The FBI only completes investigations and presents them to the DoJ where the investigation has established a minimum level of evidence that an offence may have been committed. We know this even in here in darkest Surrey.


You grok the difference?
Wow - cites an allusion to a right-wing sci-fi author (one who openly despised democracy and promoted military dictatorship as a government of choice).

Very telling...

PDR

PDR1 18th May 2017 08:01


Originally Posted by fitliker (Post 9774479)
An old Latin phrase "Corruptio optimi pessima" which, roughly translated means, "The corruption of what is best is the worst tragedy".



An even older latin phrase: Quidquid latine dictum sit altum sonatur.

Style alone cannot impart substance*.

PDR

* (an expansion, not a translation)

SASless 18th May 2017 12:34

Jet......was Bill Clinton a Draft Dodger?

He used political connections to avoid serving....or are you neglecting to talk about that?

If you judge one should you not use the same Standard for other Presidents?

SMT Member 18th May 2017 12:58

Donald Trump, the champion and avatar of the shallow state, won power because his supporters feel threatened by what they don't understand, and what they don't understand is damn near everything. Indeed, from evolution to data about the economy, to the science of vaccines, to the threats we face in this world, they reject vast subjects rooted in facts, in order to have reality conform to their world views.

They don't dig for truth; they skim the media for anything that make them feel better about themselves. To many of them, knowledge is not a useful tool but a cunning barrier 'elites' have created to keep power from the average man and woman.

PDR1 18th May 2017 13:03

Cue the drones with something about how Fox said Clinton's foundation did the same, so it's OK.

PDR

Jetex_Jim 18th May 2017 13:15


Originally Posted by SASless (Post 9774898)
Jet......was Bill Clinton a Draft Dodger?

He used political connections to avoid serving....or are you neglecting to talk about that?

If you judge one should you not use the same Standard for other Presidents?

And why should what Clinton did be pertinent to Trump's draft dodging?
As far as I can recall Clinton didn't wrap himself in the Stars and Stripes.

That's why it's different old boy.

SASless 18th May 2017 13:52

Ever read Clinton's Letter to Colonel Holmes dated 3 December 1969?

The one where he thanked the Man for helping him avoid the Draft?

The Sultan 18th May 2017 13:58

Putin claim another
 
Roger Ailes dead. Putin still cleaning up after the Trump operation?

Jetex_Jim 18th May 2017 14:01


Originally Posted by SASless (Post 9774962)
Ever read Clinton's Letter to Colonel Holmes dated 3 December 1969?

The one where he thanked the Man for helping him avoid the Draft?

I should have known.

Whatever Trump does, it's alway Clinton or Obama's fault.

Uncle Fred 18th May 2017 14:31


Originally Posted by SMT Member (Post 9774917)
Donald Trump, the champion and avatar of the shallow state, won power because his supporters feel threatened by what they don't understand, and what they don't understand is damn near everything. Indeed, from evolution to data about the economy, to the science of vaccines, to the threats we face in this world, they reject vast subjects rooted in facts, in order to have reality conform to their world views.

They don't dig for truth; they skim the media for anything that make them feel better about themselves. To many of them, knowledge is not a useful tool but a cunning barrier 'elites' have created to keep power from the average man and woman.

Well said SMT. Well said indeed.

Uncle Fred 18th May 2017 14:36

Ailes dead. Just wait for the hagiography. It will be sickening.

That man probably did more to damage America in the last 25 years than any enemy save Al-Qaeda. He certainly destroyed reasoned discourse and rigor. He injected a venom into the public sphere that has poisoned all it touched.

Uncle Fred 18th May 2017 14:40


Originally Posted by Jetex_Jim (Post 9774975)
I should have known.

Whatever Trump does, it's alway Clinton or Obama's fault.

Exactly Jetex. Posters of that tripe cannot do anything but link it all back to preceding administrations. I actually feel sorry for them that they cannot consider the situation at hand, any situation, without the reflex of referring to those no longer on the pitch.

SASless 18th May 2017 14:44

Jim,

Is English your second language?



Jet......was Bill Clinton a Draft Dodger?

He used political connections to avoid serving....or are you neglecting to talk about that?

If you judge one should you not use the same Standard for other Presidents?

I did not say "it is Clinton's fault"....I just said we should use the exact same standard when judging our Presidents.

Besides....I thought it was always Bush's fault....during the Eight Years of Obama or are you guys changing history on us again.

Do you not agree the Standard should be the same or do you advocate a double standard when it comes to such things to include the application of Justice in Criminal and Civil Cases....as well as public opinion?

Hypocrisy seems to be a cornerstone of the Left....and certainly is manifest in the comments made by those with TDS.

Jetex_Jim 18th May 2017 14:55

Is English your second language?
No.
You on the other hand...

Actually it's simple enough. I'm discussing Trump and the draft dodging is incidental to the fact that many people are betting on him not serving his full term because of the increasing likelihood of him being impeached.

So, will you be betting for or against his impeachment?

Just how big of a Trump fan are you?

Uncle Fred 18th May 2017 15:01

Frankly I always thought SAS is not a real person but rather a comment bot because of the problems with capitalization. Either that or a native speaker of one of the Germanic tongues and English second. German as you know capitalizes every noun...or almost every one.

SASless 18th May 2017 15:25

We have four Investigations going on currently.

None are complete.

None have surfaced any evidence of wrong-doing yet.

The House has an Investigation, the Senate has one, the FBI has one, and now the Special Prosecutor has one.

The Media does not qualify as a source of evidence that can be either relied upon or used in adjudication of any issue.

What say we allow the Investigators do their jobs....report their findings....and see what actions are recommended....and if any are taken BEFORE we leap to any conclusions.

I believe the saying is Horse then Cart.

Jetex_Jim 18th May 2017 15:29


Originally Posted by SASless (Post 9775073)
We have four Investigations going on currently.

None are complete.

None have surfaced any evidence of wrong-doing yet.

The House has an Investigation, the Senate has one, the FBI has one, and now the Special Prosecutor has one.

The Media does not qualify as a source of evidence that can be either relied upon or used in adjudication of any issue.

What say we allow the Investigators do their jobs....report their findings....and see what actions are recommended....and if any are taken BEFORE we leap to any conclusions.

I believe the saying is Horse then Cart.

That's one saying. There's another one about smoke and fire. But I ask again, if you had to bet which way would it be?

ethicalconundrum 18th May 2017 15:38

I think I'll take a bit of umbrage at the use of 'draft dodger' and Trump. The term 'draft dodger' in the US was coined for those who refused to register for selective service, or - in the case of someone who did register, failed to show up for political reasons. Most of them left the country, and stayed in Canada, some hid out long enough that the war wound down, and a former president forgave them all.

Trump did register for the draft, as he was supposed to. He was a HS athlete, in good health. As with all college bound students, Trump received the normal student deferments during his schooling. After college graduation, he was classified as 1-A(suitable for the draft). In the summer of 1968, he was ordered to the US Armed Forces combined induction process, including medical qualification, and was subsequently deferred for bone spurs in his heel. Now, this was an exam, for a soldier/sailor/airman/Marine(ho-rah), who would spend significant amount of time marching, running(with pack), jumping, and fighting. I know, I went through it, and it's not just a quick look around. They take pretty good stock, because of the cost of washing out a trainee during boot camp, and sending them home.

Yet was classified as "Disq -- med" is what we have from the limited records. Subsequently, I guess as I don't have the records the reason was bone spurs in the heels. Trump was a HS athlete, and played basketball for several years. He was also active in college with several sports. Like tennis.

Snip from webMD: '
Heel spurs occur when calcium deposits build up on the underside of the heel bone, a process that usually occurs over a period of many months. Heel spurs are often caused by strains on foot muscles and ligaments, stretching of the plantar fascia, and repeated tearing of the membrane that covers the heel bone. Heel spurs are especially common among athletes whose activities include large amounts of running and jumping.' emphasis added by me.

Is it entirely plausible, and even perhaps likely that a man would develop bone spurs on the heel after engaging in YEARS of basketball, tennis, etc? Does it happen to everyone? No. Is it a common thing for an active person? Yes. In fact, when I played soccer and tennis, I got bone spurs.

Trump was given a medical deferment. Notwithstanding the med deferment, he did what was normal for a young American growing up in the mid-60s who took efforts to be avail for military service, unlike a real draft dodger who would have burned his registration card in a bonfire on campus, or given the middle finger to the country of his birth by going abroad, or by hiding out in a basement for 2-6 years.

Sometimes things are not always as you read on CNN, and require that little extra effort. Of course, it's easier just to read 'Trump - draft dodger' and equate him to the low-life scum POS dikwads who really did dodge the draft, so that me, my brother, and many other fine young men got to put on the pickle and pick up a rifle for a while.

YMMV

(edited for clarity)

SASless 18th May 2017 15:50

I am not a gambler.

I prefer to wait to see the outcomes of the various investigations before casting my ballot on the outcome.

If you are placing your wager based upon what you hear or read from CNN/MSNBC/WaPo/NYT/Politico/BBC....you might not want to bet the Farm.

After Eighteen Months of digging by the FBI and almost that long by the two Committees in Congress....don't you think there would have been at least some smoldering ash seen to go along with that Smoke you claim to smell?


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