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-   -   War in Australia (any Oz Politics): the Original (https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/477678-war-australia-any-oz-politics-original.html)

Squeaks 24th Jul 2012 11:53


MattGray 24th Jul 2012 12:30

Day 24 of the great big new scary toxic Carbon Tax and Tony Abbott discovers the sky still hasn't fallen

Meanwhile out there in the real world
  1. Unemployment 5.2%,
  2. GDP growth 4.3%,
  3. RBA cash rate 3.5%,
  4. CPI 2.2%,
  5. Investment 50-year highs.
Facts not rhetoric.

There's none so blind.................

parabellum 24th Jul 2012 12:52

Just one more time Matt Grey; the effects of the carbon tax were never going to be instantaneous, as you well know, they will definitely be felt when they are passed on. Any suggestion that the effects would be felt immediately indicate a typically disingenuous approach to reality by the ALP and their supporters, or the possibility of plain stupidity.

Takan Inchovit 24th Jul 2012 13:08


Worried about the mess he's going to have to clean up after Jools!

SOPS 24th Jul 2012 13:19

That is probably the plan. Create such a huge mess that it makes the Libs look bad as they struggle to clean it up. They have done a great job of spending the surplus and going into a huge debt, creating a non stop flotilla to Christmas Island, bringing in a Carbon Tax that wasnt going to be....well you get the idea.

Buster Hyman 24th Jul 2012 14:12

Yep, everythings just fine n dandy in ALP land...

RJM 24th Jul 2012 14:21

Unemployment 5.2%,
GDP growth 4.3%,
RBA cash rate 3.5%,
CPI 2.2%,
Investment 50-year highs.
...despite the ALP's depradations!

hellsbrink 24th Jul 2012 15:58

The flood of refugees, the spilled blood of innocent Iraqis has nothing to do with us Liberals they protest.
And how, pray tell, are they actually "refugees" when they are paying THOUSANDS to get transport past so many "safe" countries to get to the land of milk and honey?

You see, that is where your argument falls apart. How can you be a "refugee" or an "asylum seeker" when you travel through so many countries to get to a ship which takes you past other countries to reach the one which will give you the most for nothing? And if you are so "downtrodden" and "persecuted", how do you manage to get the money to pay for that travel from Iraq (as per your ranting above) through other countries to get to the ship that will take you to Australia? So, you see, they are not "refugees" in the sense the Vietnamese were when their ships started crossing the seas as they have already gone through so many places, illegally, to get to the ship that will take them to Australia (unless you are saying that they take a direct sea route from Iraq to Aus.....).

Change it to "economic migrants", like they are in the EU, and then you can open your mouth about how all is good.

allan907 24th Jul 2012 16:25

Guys, we've got a half-way decent mod on at the moment. This thread needs to be kept alive in order to deal with the momentous moments that are about to break upon us. Please don't feed the troll. They're going to be gone in the not too distant future.

boofta 24th Jul 2012 19:20

No, please don't let it be too soon.
The longer it takes the more devastated labour will be.
I hope she drags out the election to the last possible day.
Hopefully to clear greens and labour permanently from
the political scene, we will need a massive mandate to
sort their mess out.

500N 24th Jul 2012 20:06


The problem is I don't think you will clean out the greens,
you could end up with more of them, although some political
parties are getting a bit smarter with preferences now and
re managing to null the Green vote (Vic - Liberal, last election)
which also has a detrimental effect on Labour.

I do think Gillard / Labour really are shooting themselves in the foot
- or feet in their case and the Liberals will need a big mandate to clean
up the mess.

The problem is, not sure Abbott is the guy to bring that to them
at an election and no other clear person in the wings to step up.

If the Libs had someone else who was credible, Gillard would be gone
by now. I think Labor knows Abbott isn't as electable as he thinks and
therefore think they could still win.

Either way, the Gov't is so hamstrung at the moment we need to
go to the polls and sort out the mess once and for all.

That's my take on it, happy to be corrected.

IF Gillard came out with a hard line policy on Asylum seekers
- like Howard - I think she could turn it around. I see even soft lefty types
now saying that it is beyond a joke, even to the extent of agreeing with
some of my extreme views on how they should be dealt with.

Andu 24th Jul 2012 22:24

You think the "trickle" of "asylum seekers" is bad now? Wait for two current Middle Eastern "unpleasantnesses" to be resolved (which both will be in the very near future) - Afghanistan and Syria.

In Syria, from the point of view of swelling refugee numbers, it doesn't matter which side wins. Whatever side wins, there'll be tens, if not multi hundreds of thousands of people fleeing the country quite genuinely in fear of their lives, particularly, IMHO, if the rebels win, when we'll see what the so-called "Arab Spring" really is. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see one or more standing room only ocean liners pull up at Christmas Island or suffer "distress" within 100nm, (but not before), reaching that same island.

Afghanistan's fate is a dead certainty - it will be a repeat of 1973-75 in Vietnam. The Western powers will withdraw having declared "victory" - and the Taliban equivalent of the North Vietnamese Army T55 tank knocking down the gates of the Presidential Palace will occur as sure as Allah made little apples within two years - if not sooner - of the last US troops leaving Kabul.

And then the flood (and "flood" it will be) of refugees will include many people we probably SHOULD accept - those silly buggers who believed the pious promises of the West that they would never give in and so joined in the fight against those who want to drag Afghanistan back to the 14th century.

If either of these scenarios comes to pass, (and I don't see how they can't), I have a question I've put before to Sarah Hanson-Young and Christie Milne: at what number of "asylum seekers" presenting themselves at our (non-existent) borders do the Greens say "too many"?

50,000? (We're not far from that figure already.)



A million?

If they can't answer that question, a have a follow up question: at what point do we cease to be Australia, or at least an Australia its current population would recognise?

CoodaShooda 25th Jul 2012 00:27


Given that the Greens policy calls for a national population of around 1/3rd its current size.........................................:hmm:

Sorry mate but I haven't voted Liberal (or National) for over 35 years. But the behaviour of your preferred party over the past 6 years has me strongly reconsidering.

MTOW 25th Jul 2012 00:38

Given that the Greens policy calls for a national population of around 1/3rd its current size
Yeah, SHY's open border policy placed alongside and the Greens' pronouncement of a 7 million sustainable population worries me a bit too.

What do they plan to do with the rest of us?

Comrades Lenin and Stalin (Senator[!] Lee Rhiannon's adored mentors) had a rather creative plan to deal with those troublesome "middle class" Kulaks back in the last 20's.

eagle 86 25th Jul 2012 00:39

Personal popularity is not necessarily associated with not being a good PM - Howard was personally despised by many people yet he is the second longest serving PM behind Ming who was also considered by many to be a pompous ass. The lobster's problem is she is not only personally unpopular but "her" policies are [email protected]

CoodaShooda 25th Jul 2012 02:15


If Australia turned into a place where the majority of the citizenry supported the Greens current policies, I'll be happy to leave.

Fubaar 25th Jul 2012 03:28

Cooda, the Bolsheviks took absolute power in 1917 with less than 20% of the popular vote.

Sound familiar?

david1300 25th Jul 2012 04:08

Originally Posted by allan907 (Post 7312606)
Guys, we've got a half-way decent mod on at the moment. This thread needs to be kept alive in order to deal with the momentous moments that are about to break upon us. Please don't feed the troll. They're going to be gone in the not too distant future.

Maybe more than half-way decent :ok:

I do think keeping the thread alive is important, and the trolls will keep trolling along :\

CoodaShooda 25th Jul 2012 04:23


20% of the vote and a better army. :E

I have previously suggested that I see this government as being Stalinist in it's underlying nature. But could they forge an effective army from the radical unions and GetUp? :E

I guess if they continue to erode our defence capability we might get to the stage of having only a couple of rowboats, some paper planes and a boy scout with a pea shooter. But even they would surely be enough to deal with GetUp? :E

Perhaps we should be looking to how the Nazi Party took power in Germany as having become the blueprint for Socialist governance in the 21st Century.

They were also big on raising aggressive ideological support groups, crushing dissent, revising history and applying The Big Lie. :eek:

500N 25th Jul 2012 04:58

Do you all think Gillard will last until the due date for an election or
will she be replaced, and by whom ?

Will Rudd come back ?

FYI, she is my local pollie and has been for years, she has changed
in the last 6 years from what she was.


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