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-   -   War in Australia (any Oz Politics): the Original (https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/477678-war-australia-any-oz-politics-original.html)

Wonderworld 19th Jul 2012 10:56

I got a letter from AGL today outlining the increases in gas and electricity prices Thanks for nothing Juliar :mad:
Cant wait for the next federal election.

Buster Hyman 19th Jul 2012 12:36

When they run out of Pokie money, & realise Centrelink don't hand out cash anymore, that'll be when the true believers wake up!

Lex Talionis 19th Jul 2012 12:56

" got a letter from AGL today outlining the increases in gas and electricity prices Thanks for nothing Juliar"

Seriously very funny and reading that you would think that utility prices have never increased at all to any significant amount or before the carbon tax or god forbid under a Liberal government.

Better not let the followers of the far right find out about the cost of electricity over the past 3 or more years.

"HANDOUTS to low-income workers under the carbon tax scheme have led to a surge in pokie revenues in May and June, according to The Australian Financial Review"

Now we have people suggesting that people of middle to high incomes do not spend their money on non essential items either.This is getting even funnier by the moment.

It must be terribly frustrating for the far right to wake up every morning and find out that nothing much has changed after listening to Dr No telling all and sundry that the world as we know it would collapse after the carbon tax was introduced.

First we heard that all of us would lose our jobs and everything from lamb chops to bricks would be out of the reach for all but a very select few.

How long is this now supposed to take,one day?

A month?

A year?

5 years?

Imagine just how stupid he is going to look (even more so than now) when at the next election the Australia is still going along fine and the wheels have not fallen off but as Dave has said:

"don't let the truth get in the way of your prejudice "

allan907 19th Jul 2012 14:24


It must be terribly frustrating for the far right to wake up every morning and find out that nothing much has changed after listening to Dr No telling all and sundry that the world as we know it would collapse after the carbon tax was introduced
Well....ignoring the fact that the majority of us here are not "far right" but are centrist or even slightly left of centre....ignoring that, most of us who are not as myopic as the true believers and can see a turd in front of us wake up and think "another day less under this rabble" or, "one more day nearer to ALP annihilation".

One wonders how Matt and Lex and the rest of the true believers wake up - in a cold sweat mayhap?

CoodaShooda 19th Jul 2012 19:54


Now we have people suggesting that people of middle to high incomes do not spend their money on non essential items either.
Lex
People on middle to high incomes around here are on the wrong side of labor in the "class war" and aren't getting any compensation to offset the increased taxes, aren't getting the new tax rate offsets and, if they have private medical insurance, now receive less of a government rebate.

Most of them are tradies or miners or other productive workers - not leeches in the money markets.

By the way, wasn't Abbott pilloried by labor for suggesting that the handouts might be wasted on pokies rather than on feeding and educating the kids?

Buster Hyman 19th Jul 2012 22:38

Big difference between "non essential" items & gambling Lex.

But regardless, you want the rich to pay for the poor, and the poor need not apply themselves to contribute or return the favour...am I understanding you here, Comrade? Sorry, perhaps its your choice of words, but it just sounds like whining Socialist crap over & over & over again.

parabellum 20th Jul 2012 00:12

Matt Grey and Lex are stolidly refusing to acknowledge that the effects of the carbon tax were never, ever, going to be felt on the first day of its introduction. The direct effect on the Australian public will be felt when the cost of the tax is passed onto them and that was never going to be an instantaneous thing. None so blind .............etc.

Lex Talionis 20th Jul 2012 00:38

So no response to electricity prices increasing between 30 and 40 % or more over the last 3 years!!!!

Someone might like to explain how the Carbon tax was responsible for those increases?

Now we are told that the wealthy can gamble but not the man in the street.

Al is right and the myopia seems to be endemic in the far right of the political spectrum.

Oops sorry I should have said the center left but as I said this is becoming very very funny.

Clare Prop 20th Jul 2012 01:52

Lex electricity is a state issue. Here in WA some of the reason electricity prices have gone through the roof is that now we are finally paying for State Labor's break up of Western Power, and they are finally doing some maintenance on power lines following some devastating bush fires.

Meanwhile, more talk of the deckchairs being rearranged on the federal Titanic. I know that Caucus think voters are stupid but do they really think that we have forgotten that it was under Rudd the rot set in, the only difference under Gillard is that she wasn't clever enough to keep the rotten core of the party hidden, in fact she has exposed it by standing by people like Slipper and Thomson...standing by while her beloved Unions hold the country to ransom and now openly issue threats so we can see who is really pulling the strings. And yet some people still think she is wonderful, people who are worried they might have to work for a living when the Labor dinosaur finally becomes extinct?

I hope they don't put another leader in. I want to see her face when she gets knocked off her pedestal by the voters, not the "faceless men".

And I want children to be taught in history what happens when federal elections are run like a "popularity contest" where people think they can "vote for a Prime Minister".

allan907 20th Jul 2012 02:03


Al is right and the myopia seems to be endemic in the far right of the political spectrum.
There we are Lex - amended so that even the slowest of us can read the meaning. One would hesitate to accuse you of deliberately being provocative would one?


So no response to electricity prices increasing between 30 and 40 % or more over the last 3 years!!!!
I'll be the one to bite, notwithstanding the leftist tactic of ignoring the devastating points forwarded about the coming annihilation of the ALP in government and concentrating on some tiny tiny part by restating an irrelevant question.

Apart from WA what was the colour of State Governments over the past 3 years? Yep, you guessed it - red. And what do Governments of this colour like to do? Yep, you guessed it - buy votes. And what is the easiest way to buy votes? Yep, you guessed it - keep the price of essential services such as electricity artificially low so that the higher wage earners pay for it through taxation.

I can't speak for the rest of Australia but here in WA the previous Labor Government made a deliberate policy decision to have no, yes that right, no increases in electricity prices for 4 years. Any idea of the effect of that Lex?

Yep, you guessed it, State taxes went up to pay for it and the electricity generating companies ran up a debt that would skin your eyes.

The previous Labor Government was totally paralysed by that decision. They desperately wanted to raise the price to "reflectivity" but were scared shitless to do so in case they lost votes and were booted out of office (they were anyway). This was despite some very heavy advice that they could not continue in this fashion. There was a huge amount of discussion about how they were going to massage it and break it to the "people" once they were re-elected (they weren't) and the favourite for the ALP was to hit the punter with a 50% rise in the budget immediately after the election so that they had the remainder of the term to get over the angst. They also realised that, despite that 50% rise, annual increases would also have to be applied to ensure that they didn't get back to the same mess.

How do I know all this? Well, I was on the Ministerial Advisory Committee on Electricity Supply. Fran Logan was the Labor Minister at the time. He's a good mate and even he will admit to being totally bollaxed by the problem.

Since the election of the State Coalition Government electricity price rises have been phased in over the past 3 years to reflect actual costs.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c9...eckkycosts.jpg

So, Lex and Matt, if you have a spare few minutes have a look at the above and understand where the rise in electricity prices is coming from. Understand that the impost of a $23 a tonne carbon tax (and rising) will have a direct effect on electricity prices and understand that's why 70% of the people in this country don't like it and why they resent being lied to by an opportunistic prime minister whose past is shadier than a beach umbrella on Bondi beach and why that person and her party will be gone at the next election.

Oh, and you might learn a little about economics as well - something else that, despite having the "best treasurer in the world" this current mob don't seem to have an understanding of.

Captain Sand Dune 20th Jul 2012 02:19

And in the Victorian by-election the ALP and the Greens are not preferrencing (sp?) each other. Is the romance over? Have the mental midgets of the ALP finally realised that the support of the Greens came at a cost? A cost with socialist overtones that even the most dim-witted voter is becoming aware of.

Now we are told that the wealthy can gamble but not the man in the street.
Not really what Buster and Cooda meant now, was it? I don't care who gambles, but I do when it's my taxes being gambled. Sadly, rather predictable. Shades of KRudd's "economic stimulus" payments.

it was under Rudd the rot set in
Nup, earlier than that! It started with Goof and has steadily gotten more rotten.

MTOW 20th Jul 2012 02:21


I hope they don't put another leader in. I want to see her face when she gets knocked off her pedestal by the voters, not the "faceless men".
You and me both.

Meanwhile, today the ninth boat in five days arrived at Christmas Island. Or, to be more accurate, 44 passengers and three crew from the ninth boat full of queue-jumping illegal immigrants to arrive in five days are being transported to Christmas Island by HMAS Taxiservice.

Buster Hyman 20th Jul 2012 02:28


So no response to electricity prices increasing between 30 and 40 % or more over the last 3 years!!!!
I think Al covered it, but if you'd like to mention why some of those State ALP governments did it, be our guest. We've already hear the rhetoric about the Liberal states...:rolleyes:

Someone might like to explain how the Carbon tax was responsible for those increases?
Hmmm...perhaps they knew it was coming and, unlike the bloke at Brumby's, they thought ahead...

Now we are told that the wealthy can gamble but not the man in the street.
Says who? Again with the irrelevant & unquoted smoke & mirrors. You'd easily win pre selection with this form.

Al is right and the myopia seems to be endemic in the far right of the political spectrum.
..... !!!....sorry, nodded off there.

Oops sorry I should have said the center left but as I said this is becoming very very funny.
Do you laugh as you drive past Centrelink too? I'll give you a waive from the queue next year!

Clare Prop 20th Jul 2012 04:30

I don't care if people are stupid enough to gamble, but not with my hard earned tax dollars, thanks.

I lived for many years in a crown dependancy of the UK, that had no political parties...you voted for the person who convinced you they could represent you in the government, no bulltish political ideology) and no dole, no income tax, free healthcare, life was good if you worked hard, if not then you had to find a job quick, but the sick, elderly and disabled were looked after.

People are so convinced that this two party system is the only way, it isn't, it's so dysfunctional now as to be meaningless. Paved with good intentions, like the Refugee convention, but a crock of :mad: and not democratic at all

Andu 20th Jul 2012 05:36

A third boat "intercepted"(!) by HMAS Taxi today, bringing the total to ten boats in the last five days. (How's that set-in-stone budget surplus, based around 450 "irregular arrivals" a month, looking now, WaYNE?)

I was particularly amused to hear the reporter on AM this morning saying that Free Syrian Army units had been able to take over the border posts on the Iraqi/Syrian border (and summarily executing all the surrendered border guards) "because the Syrian Army was totally committed to maintaining order within the country" and , [and sorry, I can't recall the exact words, but what follows is exactly the sense of what he said]... (wait for it) "...if they are unable to maintain their borders, they can no longer be said to be governing the country."

Perhaps a not so subtle niggle of protest about our own border situation from within the ranks of Fortress Auntie?

Lex Talionis 20th Jul 2012 07:48

To the moderators
I am attempting not to break any Pprune rules but after reading many posts with personal comments it is difficult to respond without mentioning names and comments which I feel are made deliberately to provoke a response so as to have someone with a different political viewpoint banned.

Too funny Al and at first it was someone here blaming Labor & the carbon tax for an increase in his/her latest power bill.
Now we have Al explaining why.I'm glad you were on that committee Al!
You also mention something about a favourite tactic of the left but in an earlier post said that most here were left of center.
If that's the case you should know about left wing tactics.
Seriously,I have no problem with any stuff ups any party makes and will happily join any condemnation because we have to have accountability in politics.

However,to blame Labor for everything when it has all happened before under the Liberals screams hypocrisy.

What's next?

Let's blame Gillard for the tide coming in?

Also Al, just because someone does not share your curious view of the world it does not mean they are provocative.It means they don't agree with your take on the world.

parabellum 20th Jul 2012 08:08


Also Al, just because someone does not share your curious view
Lex, that statement in itself is as provocative as anything anyone else has posted here yet you choose to go running to the moderators, why?

Andu 20th Jul 2012 08:09


Let's blame Gillard for the tide coming in?
Let me rephrase that comment, Lex, into something that's beyond debate.


Let's blame Gillard for the tide of uninvited, freeloading, illegal immigrants coming in.
- note: question mark deleted.

A government that cannot control its nation's borders does not deserve to call itself a government. Even the ABC seems to agree with that sentiment - (see my post above).

Andu 20th Jul 2012 08:12


yet you choose to go running to the moderators, why?
Simple. To get the thread binned, as has been proven to work before.

Buster Hyman 20th Jul 2012 09:38


comments which I feel are made deliberately to provoke a response so as to have someone with a different political viewpoint banned.
Seriously though Lex, just block posts by the person who you feel is goading you. I think we all agree that like a Government is only as good as the Opposition, the same exists in any debate.

On this thread, whilst I can't think of many things that you & I agree on, I still enjoy a debate on the current issues. Yeah, we'll knock heads again, threaten to beat the beejeezuzz out of each other, but when cooler heads prevail, we're still lucky to have the opportunity to debate.

The Modz are on top of this thread & if someone is pushing too far, block em & let the Modz sort it.


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