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-   -   War in Australia (any Oz Politics): the Original (https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/477678-war-australia-any-oz-politics-original.html)

Ovation 26th Jun 2012 08:10

AN ENTIRE 737 plane was chartered just to fly one injured asylum seeker from Christmas Island to Perth, it has emerged.

The aircraft, which usually carries around 130 passengers flew the man, a detention centre guard and an immigration to Perth on Saturday so the man could receive urgent medical attention.
So a 737 was used to fly one survivor to Perth for attention to his (lack of) two fingers severed in the capsize.

Made me recall when I was a kid and the circus was in town at the Traralgon show grounds. A fellow who'd had too much to drink stuck his hand into a Lion's cage and had two fingers promptly bitten off. I remember telling him he needed to see a doctor or go to casualty, but he was more concerned about which fingers he was now going to hold his cigarette between as the regular ones were missing. :)

They sure made em tough back in the old days!

priapism 26th Jun 2012 09:51

I reckon the Australian Government should tell Indonesia it will reduce it's annual foreign aid cheque by the amount it is costing us to process and keep these illegals. Perhaps that will make those little corrupt buggers to stop turning a blind eye to it.

parabellum 26th Jun 2012 10:31

I reckon the Australian Government should tell Indonesia it will reduce it's
annual foreign aid cheque by the amount it is costing us to process and keep
these illegals. Perhaps that will make those little corrupt buggers to stop
turning a blind eye to it.
No point, I'm afraid. There is no shortage of Indonesian police and all the riverside and coastal stations have, at least, HF radio, these are the people who need to be paid off but the smugglers have already got to them and Australia would simply be getting into a bidding war if it took them on.

Wiley 26th Jun 2012 23:18

There is no shortage of Indonesian police and all the riverside and coastal stations have, at least, HF radio, these are the people who need to be paid off
(My boldface).

People here and on other sites often cite how much cash the "New Australian" hopefuls who employ the people smugglers have to dish out to make it to Christmas Island. From (granted, fleeting) personal experience, I suspect it's an even more expensive exercise for these "asylum seekers" than most appreciate.

I was forced to take seven (male, Middle Eastern) pax back to Singapore from Jakarta a few years ago after their leader/spokesman told the Immigration bloke at passport control that he'd lost their money and they were unable to pay him the USD200.00 a head cash "visa fee".

From my experience of Indonesia over a forty+ year period, I suspect it would a very safe bet to say that that would not be the last such "fee" that they would face before boarding the leaky boat bound for Christmas island.

I, as captain of the aircraft, became quite closely involved in all the goings on between the Indonesian Immigration officers, our station manager and the spokesman for the seven pax (who spoke quite good English) by then and it was illuminating. The nationality of the (by then, very emotional) spokesman for the pax changed, (I think it was about) four times in as many minutes... I suspect to whatever he thought might tug at my heartstrings the most, for he "would be executed" if forced to return to Iran/Syria/Iraq/Palestine (as I said, the final destination changed again and again).

As soon as I was called, I asked the station manager to make sure there'd be no delays waiting for the baggage of the pax the Indonesians were refusing to accept, so I asked him to get their tickets and check the baggage tags. Seven pax, all of whom had boarded the flight in Dubai, and not one piece of checked baggage between the seven of them. Hand baggage? One - (not one each, but just one small carry on bag) between the seven of them.

At this stage, we were still trying to get the Indonesians to acept the seven pax, so I asked their leader why they were coming to Indonesia. "Business." Were the people they would be doing business with meeting them at bthe airport? "Yes." So would it be possible to contact their business partners and ask them to pay the "visa fee"? "No, that would not be possible."

By the time the group leader "found" the necessary money, it had all become way too public for Indonesian Immigration, and the Indonesians refused to back down. We were refused Customs clearance to return to Singapore unless we took the seven pax back, (which I think - [memory fails me] - involved off-loading a couple of outbound pax).

My guess, (and it's a guess backed up by no evidence at all), is that all seven pax were on the next evening's flight from Singapore back to Jakarta and all seven of them are now Australian passport holders, each of them now reunited with all their families (who've joined them under the Australian government family reunion plan), and are happily living the dream in public housing in Lakemba.

Worrals in the wilds 27th Jun 2012 02:18

Thanks for the story. I wondered what happened at the other end.

for he "would be executed" if forced to return to Iran/Syria/Iraq/Palestine (as I said, the final destination changed again and again).
So he never mentioned Pakistan? Funny about that. :suspect:
No-one ever seems to be from Pakistan. :E:}
Did they have passports of any kind?

david1300 27th Jun 2012 03:34

Todays boat didn't make it
Authorities are scrambling to avert a second disaster at sea after a boat believed to be carrying 150 Afghan asylum seekers - all of them said to be women and children - capsized 107 nautical miles north of Christmas Island.
Indonesian search and rescue agency Basarnas has told this website that the latest boat to sink was carrying women and children only.

Read more: Scramble to rescue children from ocean death

I cannot help but think back to whatever it was that the government was doing 6 or 7 years ago must have been working. From memory, 3 boats only in the first 6 months, and no disastrous losses of life like now. It seemed the people smugglers either knew that the process wouldn't work, or their potential clients new and so weren't prepared to come.

david1300 27th Jun 2012 03:47

My solution - set up an offshiore processing centre in Indonesia. Any arrivals on Christmas Island are immediately transferred back to Indonesia for processing. Processing is expedited by:
1 - having travel documents and/or identity documents so the applicant can be identified, and security checks can be completed.
2 - have documents, take a number from the dispenser marked 'A'.
3 - No documents, take a number from the dispenser marked 'B' which will be addressed as soon as we complete the numbers from the dispenser marked 'A'
4 - 'A' group completes application form and pays processing fee of $1,000 (figure sucked out of my thumb, estimated boat passage at present. Adjust if needed)
5 - target is to process approx 3000 applications a year.
6 - those that are approved after completion of security and medical checks, are offered refugee status/visas, and are transported to Australia in safety and integrated into Ausiie society (details available, but too lengthy to detail here).
7 - those not accepted/approved are advised, and they continue as they were before. Remember, if they now take a boat to Christmas Island or Australia, they are returned forthwith to Indonesia.

Simplistic, but probably far cheaper ultimately than what we currently face, and far, far safer for the 'refugees', the search and rescue crews, the Christmas Islanders, and the guards at detention centres.

SOPS 27th Jun 2012 04:39

Repeating again (in a awful Welsh/bogan accent) "Another boat, another policy failure" :ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh:

Andu 27th Jun 2012 07:51

Tony Abbott, and now Scott Morrison, on Sky TV announcing that in a (let's face it, doomed to fail) bid to get support for their amendments to Oakeshott's bill from the crossbenches, they will increase the refugee intake to 20,000 a year within three years.

I really don't think Abbott is reading pubic sentiment accurately on this issue.

Takan Inchovit 27th Jun 2012 08:35

I notice, with distain labor are using 'the Slipper slip ups affair' as a distraction to the more real problems ..... which is .... the government itself!

Clare Prop 27th Jun 2012 09:07

The Greens have said they won't support offshore processing so no way would anything agreed in the house of reps between Labor and the Coalition will get through the senate. So finally people might realise that the Greens are the ones with the most blood on their hands and they can stand there on what they see as the moral high ground while women and children drown.

Double dissolution trigger? Is this why Gillard has been too scared to act? Just think, we could get rid of the whole rotten lot of them and start afresh.

CoodaShooda 27th Jun 2012 09:14

I suggest that if the government and opposition agree to the bill (as amended etc), it will have no problem passing through the Senate.

Clare Prop 27th Jun 2012 09:17

Not according to a press conference by the Greens just now.

SOPS 27th Jun 2012 09:24

Thats the way I understood it as well, Clare. It seems the Greens will block anything that (to paraphrase) " does not let poor, vunerable people be processed in mainland Australia."

Worrals in the wilds 27th Jun 2012 09:38

If the Coalition vote with the ALP the Greens become very irrelevant very quickly. House of Reps: 71 (ALP) + 72 (Coalition) versus 7 (Cross bench, including 1 Green). Senate: 31 (ALP) + Coalition (34) versus 11 (Cross bench, including 9 Greens)?

The ayes have it. :E
The question is whether that will happen. If the major players could grow up for a change and nut out a bipartisan solution the Greens would be back to the irrelevance they deserve. I believe that's what the supporters of both major parties want; it's certainly the word round the campfire. Sort it out. Deal with it. Get together and govern for a change, without listening to the wailing of the minority parties. IMO both parties would gain respect from their members and supporters for doing so.

You can bet a year's party membership fee (whichever party that may be :}) that The Greens are counting on that not happening. Hence their supposed power.

In the interests of accuracy I think we should start referring to The Greens as The Green, as a true reflection of the one seat they hold in the House of Reps.:hmm:

RJM 27th Jun 2012 09:44

...aided and abetted by Ian Rintoul of the Refugee Action Coalition, who says 'people smugglers are humanitarian workers'. :ugh:

Worrals in the wilds 27th Jun 2012 09:52

And OMCG bikies are just blokes who like motorcycles and do toy runs for the kiddies.
There's an idiot with a soundbite for every occasion.

RJM 27th Jun 2012 10:09

I'm scratching my head...

What mandate do the Greens have to stop legislation agreed to by both major parties? The Greens have about 12% of the vote.

Tonight, Greens leader Milne said:

'There are people who actually want to deter asylum seekers! We should be welcoming the desperate people who are trying to get here. Our objective ought to be to give refugees safe pathways to Australia.'

'John Howard wasted millions on the appalling Pacific Solution which didn't stop people coming.'

Here's the truth on which the Greens base their position, which is more about growing their electoral base than any sort of sound policy. The pause in boat arrivals under Howard's Pacific Solution, and the result of Gillard's personal dismantling of it, are clear:

parabellum 27th Jun 2012 13:04

Last report I heard tonight said boat remained seaworthy until rescue was in sight, then it was sabotaged from within.

Andu 27th Jun 2012 13:12

I don't understand why the survivors are being brought to Christmas Island. Surely they should be taken to a port within the same jurisdiction as was the area the boat foundered.

These last two sinkings must surely reinforce the fact that the most successful game plan for all future boats would be to sink the boat as soon as a rescue vessel- an Australian rescue vessel - is in sight? Time will tell...

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