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Oz sends Novak Djokovic packing

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Oz sends Novak Djokovic packing

Old 11th Jan 2022, 11:19
  #181 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by level_change View Post
This is not so much about some millionaire trying to get around the rules but about everyone of us accepting these rules. In my country during the Nazi regime, we banned jews, gypsies and other non-compliant minorities from the economy and social life, we dirt campaigned and dehumanized them in all available media outlouts and eventually went on to mark and murder them in concentration camps. "for the greater good of the nation". Today I find myself in the same country, isolated from society, even from most shops, unemployable, for refusing the genetherpy that nearly killed my close friend (cerebral venous sinus thrombosis), as someone who had covid and recovered from it (natural immunity has an expiry right?). I'm not at all surprised that most pilots accepted the jab, under false promises, safe or not, it doesn't matter. Most of you just go along because you have been trained to be obedient self-disrespecting individuals with ever degrading pay and conditions. If you will not learn to stand up for yourseleves, it being the vax or your terms of employment, things will continue to get worse than they already are. Do you not slowly feel betrayed from the false promises you fell for? Basic human rights still not restored? Still locking up healthy people as contact persons, still masking up the kids? Keep complying, you will surely be rewarded in the "economy of the vaccinated", once your booster is required every 3 months. Mr. Graham Wood, I salute you.
First up - Godwin's law. You lost me at "Nazi regime". Secondly, basic human rights work within and without a functional society. If you want the benefits of living in society or circulating in the community, then you do have a choice. Ignorance isn't a valid medical exemption.

Most of you just go along because you have been trained to be obedient self-disrespecting individuals with ever degrading pay and conditions.
Oh how I loathe myself for wanting to pay off the mortgage.
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 11:20
  #182 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ATNotts View Post
So he's won the Australian Open 9 times. Does that exempt him from the rules, however stupid or disproportionate you or he believes they are, from complying with them?
Do you want to deport a person for ticking the wrong box on a form how many questions is it now? And in English? The people supposed to be running the country are loving the diversion. Does Dutton want to have a nuclear war with China? Let's deport him instead before our skin melts. Compared to our hero's in AFL he is an angel. Give the guy a break he put money into the bushfire funds.
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 12:35
  #183 (permalink)  
 
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I'm sure the honorable Mr Novax would be willing to supply a blood sample to the Oz authorities to confirm the presence of antibodies which would confirm his story that he has "had Covid"--I mean seeing as "Ive had Covid already" is a major part of his argument as to why he, an anti-vaxer to boot , should be allowed into Oz

Aa far as I know "I've had Covid" isn't a "medically acceptable" (authorities words) reason to enter Australia unvaccinated. It's only if having the vaccine will cause you more serious grief related to your underlying other health issues , whatever they may be.

Pretty sure Mr D is reasonably healthy, not to mention very influential in his home town if he can be attending public gatherings for days immediately after "allegedly" testing positive for Covid.....really???--and negative again after only 6 days?? Sorry I don't buy it. Maybe they have special Serbian test kits or something...

I guess he has "herd immunity" from having to obey the 14-day isolation law in Serbia as well...

Last edited by Sausage Stuffer; 11th Jan 2022 at 12:50.
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 12:54
  #184 (permalink)  
 
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There are two* completely different questions:

Q1: Do the Australian entry regulations make sense?
Imho: NO! They are ridiculous and only beaten by the Chinese CCP.

Q2: Should Novax Djokovic be treated differently to anyone else entering the country? Is he above the law?
Hell no! He

*bonus Q3: is Djokovic a d*ckhead?
YES! Always have been as well
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 12:58
  #185 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by JamesGBC View Post
Do you want to deport a person for ticking the wrong box on a form how many questions is it now? And in English? The people supposed to be running the country are loving the diversion. Does Dutton want to have a nuclear war with China? Let's deport him instead before our skin melts. Compared to our hero's in AFL he is an angel. Give the guy a break he put money into the bushfire funds.
He doesn't deserve a break. He isn't a one man band, his command of the English language is very competent, at least when you hear him speak at press conferences, and IF there was a question on a form he didn't understand there would have been someone in his team from whom he could have received advice.

He disregarded Serbian rules having tested positive for Covid-19 - perhaps his command of the Serbian language may be lacking. He is an entitled sportsperson, nothing more, nothing less. How much money did he put into the bushfire funds, and how does that stack up against his annual net income?
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 13:23
  #186 (permalink)  
 
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I realise this isn't the central issue, but I'm really struggling to get my head round the idea of immunity from having had Covid *twice*...
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 14:12
  #187 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by pasta View Post
I realise this isn't the central issue, but I'm really struggling to get my head round the idea of immunity from having had Covid *twice*...
Its probably similar to catching COVID and being triple vaccinated (happened to me and to many of my friends). Omicron is surging in the UK and it is not spreading like wildfire through just the unvaccinated, it is going through just about everyone irrespective of their status.

I'm not saying that COVID vaccines do not work, or do not have a place in this endemic (which is what it is btw), but many Governments around the world have led their populations to believe that vaccination is the solution, along with face masks and social distancing. The only people this keeps happy are large pharmaceutical companies who are making unbelievable profits.

We have tried and tested strategies of dealing with endemic diseases, in this case it would be to offer vaccinations to the vulnerable and let everyone else get on with living life.

But the fact people are more up in arms over a tennis player arriving into a country without a vaccination then they are with their own governments who are mandating such stupid policies and showing almost zero leadership out of this mess, gives me little hope for our future. Welcome to 1984.

Just take a moment to remember what life was like 2 years ago and ask yourself if you would have believed back then that we would still be living under the spectre of a virus that now has a case fatality rate no worse than flu. That we would be implementing vaccine passports, mandatory health checks, masks on aircrafts and in shops, restricting where people can go and who they can see, etc. Some people on here really do need to wake up.
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 14:21
  #188 (permalink)  
 
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Godwins law or not, level_change makes a valid point. Governments around the world have massively overstepped the mark on COVID and now don't know how to get themselves out of this mess. From a political point of view, there is no easy way out so how does a Government get the electorate to accept their fate without ending up with mud on their own faces which could affect their chances of being elected again?

Hitler identified with Germany's economic woes and identified the Jews as the perfect 'escape goat'. He managed to convince an entire nation that the reason their country was poor was because of Jews, quite some feat because we all know it was a load of horses manure.

In this case the unvaccinated are now being targeted as the reason we are still in this mess when anyone who can interpret the data for themselves can see this is absolutely not the case. But from the Governments point of view this is the perfect target because they know there will always be unvaccinated people (especially when they can move the goalposts and tell us that you now need 4 jabs to be considered 'vaccinated'), and so there is always a group of people they can try to shift the blame onto.

As I've stated on here before, I'm fully vaccinated and not anti the vaccines at all. But I'm also clever enough to realise that the mess we are in has nothing to do with people who (rightly or wrongly) decide not to get jabbed.

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Old 11th Jan 2022, 15:07
  #189 (permalink)  
 
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Thatís not what itís about at all.

The Australian Government decided that it was in the National Interest for there to be high level of community vaccination so that the country could get on with business with minimal impact on health services, minimal unnecessary loss of life, and get the economy ticking again.

This has been widely regarded as a good policy - the only criticisms being the mechanisms of implementation including vaccination availability and timings.

State Governments also participated in this, being responsible for quarantine and health in their respective states.

In order to achieve this goal, certain policies were implemented including vaccine mandates in certain industries (including aviation) and to participate in certain areas of life (eg a sit-down coffee).

The international border was included - foreign nationals required a vaccination to enter.

The Australian Open, like most other large events, had a vaccination mandate in accordance with the general policy.

Tennis Australia - in their wisdom or foolishness - really wanted the best tennis players to attend, so tried to seek exemptions for the likes of Novak. They apparently tried to get the Federal Government on board with this, but failed, as made clear by the leaked letters between the two parties.

So thatís how the current situation has evolved. Itís as simple as that. No Hitler metaphors are necessary, we are not one step away from Nazi Germany.

Most Australians will be very angry if Novak is allowed to participate, because Australian culture is all about one rule for all. We are an egalitarian society. I need a vaccination to go and watch him play. Whereís my exemption?

Now, Iím not so naive to realise that it doesnít always work like that, but because this is highly in the public domain, itís now political.

If Novak hadnít been a public anti-vaxxer and then bragged on Twitter about his exemption then it might have slid under the radar and we wouldnít be having this conversation, but there you go.

Novak is not the only fool, the CEO of Tennis Australia needs to fall on his sword over this - he is very complicit in setting Novak up.

Last edited by Derfred; 11th Jan 2022 at 15:21.
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 15:42
  #190 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by m0nkfish View Post
Its probably similar to catching COVID and being triple vaccinated (happened to me and to many of my friends). Omicron is surging in the UK and it is not spreading like wildfire through just the unvaccinated, it is going through just about everyone irrespective of their status.
I can understand why catching Covid (or being vaccinated) doesn't necessarily give you perfect immunity. What I was really struggling with was the logic of Djokovic claiming immunity due to having had Covid, whilst also having had it twice. If it really was as effective as he claims, how does he think he caught it a second time?
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 15:48
  #191 (permalink)  
 
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Having caught covid with or without the jab, his body will have produced antibodies and each new strain will cause a reaction of those antibodies to fight off the viral onslaught. So far there have been 3 main variants afaik, novel, Delta and Omicron and perhaps ND has had all three ? Who knows...
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 15:58
  #192 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SpringHeeledJack View Post
Having caught covid with or without the jab, his body will have produced antibodies and each new strain will cause a reaction of those antibodies to fight off the viral onslaught. So far there have been 3 main variants afaik, novel, Delta and Omicron and perhaps ND has had all three ? Who knows...
Four, you forgot Alpha - or Kent as it was originally referred to as in the media.
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 16:44
  #193 (permalink)  
 
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They should simply chuck him out.
However, maybe the Border Force Brain surgeons that got their timing wrong should go with him.
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 16:44
  #194 (permalink)  
 
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In this case the unvaccinated are now being targeted as the reason we are still in this mess when anyone who can interpret the data for themselves can see this is absolutely not the case. But from the Governments point of view this is the perfect target because they know there will always be unvaccinated people (especially when they can move the goalposts and tell us that you now need 4 jabs to be considered 'vaccinated'), and so there is always a group of people they can try to shift the blame onto.
because they are the reason! The reason that hospitals are overloaded. In my country 85% is vaccinated but the unvaccinated account for over 60% of hospitalizations.

A democratically elected government has decided the regulations in Australia. I think they are bloody awful but not my country
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 17:43
  #195 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Derfred View Post
Thatís not what itís about at all.

The Australian Government decided that it was in the National Interest for there to be high level of community vaccination so that the country could get on with business with minimal impact on health services, minimal unnecessary loss of life, and get the economy ticking again.

This has been widely regarded as a good policy - the only criticisms being the mechanisms of implementation including vaccination availability and timings.

State Governments also participated in this, being responsible for quarantine and health in their respective states.

In order to achieve this goal, certain policies were implemented including vaccine mandates in certain industries (including aviation) and to participate in certain areas of life (eg a sit-down coffee).

The international border was included - foreign nationals required a vaccination to enter.

The Australian Open, like most other large events, had a vaccination mandate in accordance with the general policy.

Tennis Australia - in their wisdom or foolishness - really wanted the best tennis players to attend, so tried to seek exemptions for the likes of Novak. They apparently tried to get the Federal Government on board with this, but failed, as made clear by the leaked letters between the two parties.

So thatís how the current situation has evolved. Itís as simple as that. No Hitler metaphors are necessary, we are not one step away from Nazi Germany.

Most Australians will be very angry if Novak is allowed to participate, because Australian culture is all about one rule for all. We are an egalitarian society. I need a vaccination to go and watch him play. Whereís my exemption?

Now, Iím not so naive to realise that it doesnít always work like that, but because this is highly in the public domain, itís now political.

If Novak hadnít been a public anti-vaxxer and then bragged on Twitter about his exemption then it might have slid under the radar and we wouldnít be having this conversation, but there you go.

Novak is not the only fool, the CEO of Tennis Australia needs to fall on his sword over this - he is very complicit in setting Novak up.

Well said Sir!
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 21:17
  #196 (permalink)  
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In terms of his ability to return a 140 (?) mph serve in professional play, isn’t one of the exemptions for getting a Covid vaccine that you have a weak heart? It hardly seems to apply in his case…
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 21:23
  #197 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by pasta View Post
I can understand why catching Covid (or being vaccinated) doesn't necessarily give you perfect immunity. What I was really struggling with was the logic of Djokovic claiming immunity due to having had Covid, whilst also having had it twice. If it really was as effective as he claims, how does he think he caught it a second time?
My following answer is a little simplistic and not the case for everyone but it has a lot to do with T-cells (front-line fighters) and B-cells (back-line strategists). Vaccines and infection provide you with both but with some important differences. With T-cells, the benefits of a vaccine is that you have them ready to do battle, otherwise with infection your body needs to develop them and may not do so in time. B-cells take about a month to develop after the T-cells, and with infection you body produces the ultimate final solution (in most cases) because it's dealing with the real thing, with vaccination the body also produces something that works but not as well and doesn't last as long, The strength on using vaccines over infection comes from having the T-cells at the ready, hence the constant booster strategy that has been implemented. Add pre-existing health conditions, age, etc and the above will vary markedly.

The take home from this is that having had Covid-19 and recovering is much better for you than vaccination (for a period of time), however the issue of surviving is like rolling the dice as no current test can predict that outcome.

BTW, Novak donated $25K to the Bushfire Appeal on January 2020 in a time of need.
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Old 11th Jan 2022, 21:25
  #198 (permalink)  
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Meanwhile, in the USA, our hospitals are getting filled to the choking point with covid patients, with no end in sight.

I recently heard the comment that the omicron may be half as dangerous, but twice [or thrice] as infectious, so it amounts to the same problem.
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Old 12th Jan 2022, 00:53
  #199 (permalink)  
 
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No jab no entry, it should be that for everyone the world over, fed up of these tossers putting everyone else at risk for their own personal gain, the sooner the World starts to ostracise them by putting up barriers for entry to countries or employment, benefits and entry into establishments the better. Personally everyone should be required to be mandatory vaccinated, those that aren’t are spreading new variants to the detriment of everyone else.

I would kick his ass out of the country and stamp denied in his passport to be reviewed in XYZ years.
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Old 12th Jan 2022, 02:32
  #200 (permalink)  
 
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"BTW, Novak donated $25K to the Bushfire Appeal on January 2020 in a time of need."

I think he's received it back ten fold in the form of Aust taxpayer $$...


&

"the CEO of Tennis Australia needs to fall on his sword over this" - I agree completely!
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