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Old 6th Oct 2021, 02:41
  #21 (permalink)  
 
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I bet he feels a right t00l today
I very much doubt it, these folk don't do conscious. Leona Helmsley, the "Queen of Mean" as she was dubbed, "We don't pay taxes; only the little people pay taxes".
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Old 6th Oct 2021, 06:21
  #22 (permalink)  
 
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Is there any way to search the raw data? Or do we have to rely on sleuthing by journalists to tell us what's important?
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Old 6th Oct 2021, 08:30
  #23 (permalink)  
 
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Looks like Bonio from U2 has also been hiding tax, something he's SO against as a warrior for the oppressed and down trodden, I bet he feels a right t00l today.
His Bononess has been pretty good at swerving normal obligations for decades through some fleet footedness financially speaking, all legal no doubt. Once the wonderful tax-free scheme for artists in Ireland came to an end, the business affairs of U2 were moved to Holland and on and on. Interestingly the Irish scheme had been srt up to support all the journeymen/wimmin musicians, writers, painters, actors etc whose income was sporadic and often meagre. U2 were earning tens of millions each year and used this scheme. Irish to the core, but unwilling to support the country back when it needed help pre-Celtic Tiger. As said above, He doesn't do self-awareness and like many others is a card-carrying Champagne-Socialist.

Is there any way to search the raw data? Or do we have to rely on sleuthing by journalists to tell us what's important?
I read somewhere yesterday (possibly bbc) that there was raw data available, but in limited form.
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Old 6th Oct 2021, 09:10
  #24 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SpringHeeledJack View Post
His Bononess has been pretty good at swerving normal obligations for decades through some fleet footedness financially speaking, all legal no doubt. Once the wonderful tax-free scheme for artists in Ireland came to an end, the business affairs of U2 were moved to Holland and on and on. Interestingly the Irish scheme had been srt up to support all the journeymen/wimmin musicians, writers, painters, actors etc whose income was sporadic and often meagre. U2 were earning tens of millions each year and used this scheme. Irish to the core, but unwilling to support the country back when it needed help pre-Celtic Tiger. As said above, He doesn't do self-awareness and like many others is a card-carrying Champagne-Socialist.
But do any of us volunteer to pay more tax than legally required? I accept that there is a spectrum of avoidance measures, from common sense simple things to increasingly convoluted and contrived. But isn't it hard to blame someone for legally minimizing their tax exposure? I suspect that the 'corruption' happens at the political level where lobbyists and politicians can write the rules to suit themselves.
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Old 6th Oct 2021, 11:27
  #25 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by double_barrel View Post
But do any of us volunteer to pay more tax than legally required? I accept that there is a spectrum of avoidance measures, from common sense simple things to increasingly convoluted and contrived. But isn't it hard to blame someone for legally minimizing their tax exposure? I suspect that the 'corruption' happens at the political level where lobbyists and politicians can write the rules to suit themselves.
The standard argument and just as unacceptable as ever !
Those who have the choice as to how their tax affairs are 'managed' are, in the majority, able to afford professional assistance to do so. The methods employed and the avenues used, become ever more tenuous, in terms of social 'fairness', the greater the amounts involved.
It's worth remembering that the various 'schemes' devised by the Inland Revenue are designed by financial/legal professionals - NOT by Ioe Average Taxpayer.!
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Old 6th Oct 2021, 11:36
  #26 (permalink)  
 
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The system is set upon by the rich and influential for their benefit. Stamp duty on home sales is designed to raise revenue and most homeowners would have paid it as they wouldn't have the knowledge or ability to set up a Panamian shell company. In any case the fees involved would probably be more than the tax due.

However, for those in the know buying ultra expensive properties there is a loophole which allows them to dodge their obligations.

If the loopholes get too well known and start getting used to the extent that revenue is affected, they are closed. Once estate agents in the high street start offering offshore corporations to Mr & Mrs Average there will be changes.New laws are introduced which require skilled legal and accounting work to take advantage of.
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Old 6th Oct 2021, 13:07
  #27 (permalink)  
 
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Taxes move on - since 2014 there has been an "annual tax on enveloped dwellings" which applies to arrangements such as The Blairs. A "dwelling" owned by a company is taxed if it is worth over 500,000. The Blairs should now be paying 59,000 a year on this particular one.
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Old 6th Oct 2021, 13:40
  #28 (permalink)  
 
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The Blairs should now be paying 59,000 a year on this particular one.
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Old 6th Oct 2021, 20:35
  #29 (permalink)  
 
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But do any of us volunteer to pay more tax than legally required?
A view on paying tax.

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Old 6th Oct 2021, 21:44
  #30 (permalink)  
 
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I wonder if some ppruners have ever said “Oh goody, my tax is due. I must pay my fair share…”

Thought not.

Tax avoidance is not illegal. Tax evasion is. If people disobey the law, then they should be taken to account, otherwise they should be left to get on with their lives. Remember that most people have had the option to become rich, it’s just that the vast majority of them chose not to ( that includes me btw, but I don’t begrudge those that did).
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Old 7th Oct 2021, 01:05
  #31 (permalink)  
 
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I fully expect businesses to do their best to minimize the tax they pay, they owe it to their shareholders to get the best returns.

However I have a problem with those who make the rules doing their best to avoid them, whilst giving sanctimonious lectures to the rest of us about paying our fair share. It's similar to the Catholic Church laying down moral standards.

I respect a leader who complies with the letter and spirit of the laws they make, and whose affairs are open to scrutiny. Otherwise get off the high horse.
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Old 7th Oct 2021, 02:23
  #32 (permalink)  
 
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The average punter doesn't have a convoluted tax minimisation scheme, most of their legal tax minimisation is direct (e.g. work claims) and some of it may have a complexity arrangement with other entities of just two to three levels at the most. Anything more complex and you will often need professional legal and accounting services. If there was an increasing tax surcharge for each subsequent level of complexity arrangement after a certain limit then the benefit of going down such a path would be lost and these kind of outlier tax avoidance cases could then be easily reigned in.
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Old 7th Oct 2021, 04:15
  #33 (permalink)  
 
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krismiler:
I respect a leader who complies with the letter and spirit of the laws they make, and whose affairs are open to scrutiny. Otherwise get off the high horse.
Serious question, no snarkiness:- Can you name any leaders whom you respect?
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