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Ouch buy a new car, 20 mins later its totalled

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Ouch buy a new car, 20 mins later its totalled

Old 25th Jun 2020, 22:01
  #41 (permalink)  
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And letís not forget the Ferrets.
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Old 26th Jun 2020, 02:44
  #42 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by wowzz View Post
The law would say the same in the UK. However, how many of us can honestly say that we always drive sufficiently far behind a a vehicle at 70mph on a motorway, that we could stop if the vehicle in front of us suddenly stopped unexpectedly?
Even people who respect the 'proper' following distances generally don't take account of the stopping ability of different vehicles. Sports cars can stop much faster than a typical
sedan - which in turn can stop much faster than most vans.
I have no idea why the Lambo might have stopped so rapidly, but I'd bet the Lambo could stop from 70 mph in half the distance that the van could.
The guidelines for following distances only account for reaction time - which often isn't sufficient. The following distance I use when driving my van is much longer than when I'm driving my S2000.
Back when my racing rig was a 24 ft. motor home (5 ton), pulling a 20 ft. trailer (2+ ton), even though it had trailer brakes I didn't even like to think about how long it would take me to panic stop. Once, in heavy traffic at ~50 mph, some idiot pulled in front of me then hit the brakes. It was a near thing - I was in full panic stop mode. The rear axle on the motorhome locked up (no anti-lock) so I was literally at max braking. I distinctly remember two thoughts - first was I was skidding with the locked rear, yet it was easily controllable. Second was I was at max performance braking - and I wasn't slowing very fast
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Old 26th Jun 2020, 02:56
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Originally Posted by tdracer View Post
............I have no idea why the Lambo might have stopped so rapidly, but I'd bet the Lambo could stop from 70 mph in half the distance that the van could.
.....
Who said it did stop suddenly?
Even with something dire happening, the inclination would be to NOT slow down rapidly in the midst of high speed traffic.
And, if traffic was reasonably heavy, without an engine, he might have opted to simply coast to a stop in the lane he was in rather than try to cross traffic in limp mode.

A few mights and maybes, but in the absence of facts it's the best any of us can do.
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Old 26th Jun 2020, 04:20
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Originally Posted by WingNut60 View Post
Who said it did stop suddenly?
Even with something dire happening, the inclination would be to NOT slow down rapidly in the midst of high speed traffic.
And, if traffic was reasonably heavy, without an engine, he might have opted to simply coast to a stop in the lane he was in rather than try to cross traffic in limp mode.

A few mights and maybes, but in the absence of facts it's the best any of us can do.
There are two basic possibilities:
The Lambo stopped rapidly, or it didn't and slowed to a stop at a reasonable rate.
If was the former - something catastrophic happened (e.g. gearbox or engine locked up), then the van driver has a valid excuse - as noted a Lambo can stop much more rapidly than a van.
If it was the later and it stopped more slowly - then why didn't the Lambo driver make some effort to get out of harms way (perhaps traffic prevented him moving to the left - but there is always the center shoulder - maybe not completely out of the way but as far over as possible). And if it was a more gradual slowing - why did the van driver fail to react and nailed it at high speed?
I once had my van quit while driving back from a race - absolutely no warning - one second everything was fine, the next second the engine had quit and I was coasting (fuel pump failed). The very first thing I thought of (well, maybe the second after 'WTF!') was where could I go to get out of harms way (which fortunately I was able to do).
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Old 26th Jun 2020, 04:21
  #45 (permalink)  
 
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There was a similar accident in my little country town here about six weeks ago. A 'gentleman' whom no-one seems to know was hooning around the streets in a fast looking Merc which he had taken delivery of a few days earlier. He charged straight though one of the intersections in the shopping area of the town ignoring the 'Give Way" sign, and T-boned another local who was crossing the intersection at the same time in his relatively new Prado. The Prado was spun around facing the direction from which it had come and rolled onto its side - driver's side to the tarmac. The Prado driver sustained a head wound and was hospitalised for 18 hours. Both vehicles were instant write-offs. The Merc driver sustained no serious physical injuries that anyone knows of. However he was found to be well over the DUI limit, and (small town information grapevine) had been in one of the local pubs for almost all of the morning. It was also revealed that he had no comprehensive insurance on his vehicle, which means he has done his money on his own car, and will no doubt in due time be requested to pay for the written off Prado belonging to the other driver. In due course he'll also be invited to one of the law courts - which will almost certainly bring more financial trouble - probably a period in the slammer as well. The Merc was still sitting in the far corner of the crash salvage premises when last I looked. It could be there for a while.
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Old 26th Jun 2020, 05:36
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Originally Posted by tdracer View Post
There are two basic possibilities:
......... - but there is always the center shoulder - maybe not completely out of the way but as far over as possible). ............
There are lots of possibilities but pulling onto the centre shoulder was not one of them. Take a look at the 2nd photo in the OP's first post.
Hint:- M1 = centre shoulder is on the RHS.

And I'm not all that sure that the van driver hit the Lambo "at high speed".
Certainly a nasty (and expensive) wound but it wouldn't take an awful lot of impact force to do that.
Take a look at the front end damage to the Kia in the other video clip. That was barely above walking pace.
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Old 26th Jun 2020, 10:28
  #47 (permalink)  

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Originally Posted by CAEBr View Post
If you do, you end up going backwards as some other t**t will always end up cutting in. Reading the road ahead and being ready to ease off before the car in front slams his brakes on too late is one thing, in this case there is no guarantee that the brake lights came on, which really doesn't leave the following driver much option, even if he has left a space, the realisation that the car had stopped would take up most of the available time
Exactly! Leave enough breaking distance, and you will be undertaken time and time again. Which is why I have sympathy for the van driver.
A very poor excuse to justify following a car too closely. I do maintain a proper distance, especially on my motorcycle, and the belief that people regularly 'cut in' is false. People do occasionally pull into the gap but, weirdly, a slight adjustment on my part re-establishes that gap.

More to do with the psychology of not wanting someone to gain a perceived advantage at someone else's expense.
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Old 26th Jun 2020, 10:45
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Mediocre wine maker in Australia allegedly crashed his brand new Rolls Royce into a telegraph pole a few days after delivery. It was an all time record that was eventually broken.

I almost wrote off my two week old car when speeding (showing it off) in town when a young guy turned in front of me. Fortunately his reflexes were up to scratch and he stopped in time allowing me to be able to slip between him and a concrete barrier without hearing any scraping noises.
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Old 26th Jun 2020, 13:21
  #49 (permalink)  
 
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Had several incidents with wheels coming off other vehicles. One came over the central divider on the M4 and bounced over my car while I was travelling at around the legal limit (honest, officer!). I don't think it actually hit any other vehicle either.
Second wheel overtook me from behind,clipped the central safety barrier and then veered onto the hard shoulder: no idea what it came from.
Third (and most recently), I was stopped at a red traffic signal when a tow truck with a large tipper truck on suspended tow turned across in front of me. A front wheel fell off the suspended tow and bounced across the junction, hit a kerb and a pedestrian refuge iron railing before contacting my vehicle on the nearside front wing and pax door, trapping Mrs Null inside - unhurt but a little shaken.
The towing company paid for my damage/hire car, etc, although my first contact by phone with them kicked off with "...where is the truck wheel now?".

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Old 26th Jun 2020, 17:24
  #50 (permalink)  
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M. Mouse, it is my understanding that with only two wheels and less weight on the wheels, versus a car with four brakes on four wheels with wider tires, a motorcycle has a longer braking distance than a car, so you are wise to keep your distance.

(The front brake of a motorcycle will do most of the work, as that is where the bulk of the weight will go when it slows rapidly.)

Please correct me if I am wrong.

In addition, cars have large crumple zones to absorb impact energy, a feature distinctly lacking in motorcycles, unless one counts ones own body as a crumple zone.
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Old 26th Jun 2020, 17:32
  #51 (permalink)  
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I know someone, after a long wait, was anticipating delivery of his Jensen Interceptor. The delivery driver totalled it en route.
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Old 26th Jun 2020, 19:38
  #52 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by visibility3miles View Post
M. Mouse, it is my understanding that with only two wheels and less weight on the wheels, versus a car with four brakes on four wheels with wider tires, a motorcycle has a longer braking distance than a car, so you are wise to keep your distance.
It's to do with the length of wheelbase and height of Centre of Gravity. The limit on dry roads is the rear wheel lifting on the motorcycle, and cars are longer with lower CoG and their limit is brakes at one end or t'other locking up. With 4 wheels the brakes are designed balanced so the front locks first, which is stable and most (or perhaps some) drivers can deal with, rather than the rear which is unstable and does need much more control. With lowered grip, eg rain, snow, it gets a lot more complicated, but in essence the rear could take on more of the work but that's difficult to do without ABS.

'a
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Old 26th Jun 2020, 21:25
  #53 (permalink)  

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I agree entirely that a motorcycle may well not stop as quickly as a car, although I do not know the definitive answer. As somebody says the front brake does most of the braking although with my motorcycle weighing around 250kgs. the increased weight shift to the front wheel, on a dry road, makes for some fairly impressive stopping ability. This was something we were encouraged to experiment with in some exercises during an advanced bike control day (conducted on an airfield) organised by my local advanced motorcyclists group.

It is very true that a rider is more vulnerable on a motorcycle than in a car. Perhaps that one of the factors which leads people to drive far too closely to other cars.

I stand by my statement that it is a desire to prevent anybody gaining a perceived advantage by pulling into that gap that causes people to not leave a sensible distance behind other cars. I drive some 20,000 miles a year mostly on motorways. Over the last few years I have discovered that driving close to the permitted speed is less stressful than driving as fast as possible and having to be alert for and slow down for cameras. It also makes little difference to journey time over my 50 mile journey.

Equally maintaining an appropriate distance behind the car in front is also less stressful and also makes no difference to journey times!
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Old 26th Jun 2020, 21:41
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Originally Posted by M.Mouse View Post
People do occasionally pull into the gap but, weirdly, a slight adjustment on my part re-establishes that gap.
I have often had people try to pull in just after my truck, ... which was pulling a horse trailer.
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Old 26th Jun 2020, 21:46
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I suspect that VP's milk-float on steroids stops quite quickly aswell.
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Old 26th Jun 2020, 23:08
  #56 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by M.Mouse View Post
I agree entirely that a motorcycle may well not stop as quickly as a car, although I do not know the definitive answer. As somebody says the front brake does most of the braking although with my motorcycle weighing around 250kgs. the increased weight shift to the front wheel, on a dry road, makes for some fairly impressive stopping ability. This was something we were encouraged to experiment with in some exercises during an advanced bike control day (conducted on an airfield) organised by my local advanced motorcyclists group.

It is very true that a rider is more vulnerable on a motorcycle than in a car. Perhaps that one of the factors which leads people to drive far too closely to other cars.

I stand by my statement that it is a desire to prevent anybody gaining a perceived advantage by pulling into that gap that causes people to not leave a sensible distance behind other cars. I drive some 20,000 miles a year mostly on motorways. Over the last few years I have discovered that driving close to the permitted speed is less stressful than driving as fast as possible and having to be alert for and slow down for cameras. It also makes little difference to journey time over my 50 mile journey.

Equally maintaining an appropriate distance behind the car in front is also less stressful and also makes no difference to journey times!
20,000 miles a year is not really that much. My daily commute down the M4/M25 was 50,000 miles a year. But I digress.
I agree that driving at 65mph is more relaxed. However, that requires constant lane shifting, to get away from the 80 mph brigade in lane 3, and then overtaking the hgv going at 56mph in lane 2. It was actually more conducive to my blood pressure to join the lane 3 train of vehicles all going at a steady 75mph, always keeping a look out at least 4 vehicles in front. I managed 500,000 miles without an accident, and just one speeding ticket during my commuting years.
Nowadays, I wonder how I endured it.

Last edited by wowzz; 26th Jun 2020 at 23:27.
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Old 27th Jun 2020, 07:31
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If you are undertaken when you leave sufficient braking (not “breaking”) distance from the car in front, then simply drop back a little. You will lose about 2 seconds.

On my drive home from work one day I counted how many times I had to do this. The result was 18 times. So now I leave work 36 seconds earlier!
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Old 27th Jun 2020, 09:32
  #58 (permalink)  
 
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On a motorcycle, my experience is that motorists behind you allow a stopping distance between them and the car in front of you, not between them and you.

Agree with M.Mouse re practicing emergency stops. You'd be surprised at how quickly a motorcycle can stop when you've learned to keep it under control.
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Old 27th Jun 2020, 09:43
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My father was a passenger in a military jeep when they wondered why a wheel suddenly rolled by.

"Where did THAT come from?"

Moments later, question answered...
My father had a 1935 Morris 8, with the spare wheel resting across the back, and secured with a leather strap. Remember ? One day he noticed in his mirror, a wheel following him up the road. His own spare ! Leather strap broken, wheel bounced out.
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Old 27th Jun 2020, 09:46
  #60 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by TWT View Post
What happens in a Lambo if you inadvertently select 'Reverse' while doing 70mph ?

I know what happens if you do that in a Hillman Hunter
Think the gearbox is computer controlled so it wouldnít let you 🙂 If it were possible a four wheel lock up at 70mph would be.......interesting, briefly!
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