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Huawei 5G for British Intelligence

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Huawei 5G for British Intelligence

Old 16th Jan 2020, 10:25
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Huawei 5G for British Intelligence

I think the USA is being perfectly reasonable in advising the UK that if GCHQ and British intelligence services in general adopt the Huawei 5G system then security will potentially be compromised and the subsequent exchange of information will be limited.

GCHQ and the British Government seem to disagree and think that the Chinse Government will never flex it's muscles and demand that Huawei provide data from their global systems to them. A tad nave I think!

There should be a debate in the House of Commons as a very minimum but the last attempts to get this issue examined failed to reach the necessary numbers to qualify......
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Old 16th Jan 2020, 15:35
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Well I guess they think that as the US has access to everything its only fair the Chinese do as well - after all the UK isn't likely to fight a war with the PRC...............
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Old 16th Jan 2020, 16:29
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I thought that we had restricted the use of Huawei equipment to dumb parts of the system, where they posed no risk of interception?

I know that the plan was to originally use loads of Huawei stuff, but this then got vetoed, I thought, on the basis of there being security flaws/potential Chinese government back doors into the Huawei code, so the decision was made to not use Huawei stuff in any part of the new network where it could potentially pose a threat.
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Old 16th Jan 2020, 17:35
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The saddest aspect of this fiasco is that if certain British electronics companies hadn't been mis-managed out of existence at the end of the last century, we would now be installing home built telecoms systems and exporting them​​​​ to the world, instead of importing from China and elsewhere.
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Old 16th Jan 2020, 18:24
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Originally Posted by Sallyann1234 View Post
The saddest aspect of this fiasco is that if certain British electronics companies hadn't been mis-managed out of existence at the end of the last century, we would now be installing home built telecoms systems and exporting them​​​​ to the world, instead of importing from China and elsewhere.
Isn't that the truth. Years ago we used to work fairly closely with Plessey, and I was visiting their place at Templecombe on the morning that GEC took over. The first thing I saw was that the Plessey logo on everything, from the vans to the buildings, had been covered with black tape. The next thing I found was that the coffee machines, which had always been on free vend, now needed coins. This was just hours after the Weinstock takeover. Mind you, Plessey, GEC and then later Marconi, were all appallingly badly managed. I had the misfortune to work with them on several programmes over the years, and my lasting memory is that they had some really good engineers, who were effectively neutered by wholly incompetent management.
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Old 16th Jan 2020, 23:26
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China is in the same class as Russia when it comes to friend or foe classification by the West.
If Huawei were Russian, would there even be any question about who not to use for highly sensitive and critical applications?
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Old 17th Jan 2020, 01:10
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Yup, it's my way or the Huawei.
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Old 17th Jan 2020, 07:07
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Yup, it's my way or the Huawei.
Congratulations, you win the ppruner of the day award!
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Old 17th Jan 2020, 07:36
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Jolihokistix

🤣🤣 brilliant. !!
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Old 17th Jan 2020, 18:40
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Seems to be a sad reflection on the intelligence of our ruling classes that there should even be a discussion on the subject.
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Old 17th Jan 2020, 21:10
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Devil

Guess the end result will show us whether or not there is such a thing as British intelligence.......
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Old 17th Jan 2020, 22:03
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While throwing their teddy out of the pram, the US have not come up with any "hard" evidence yet (or if they have, it is invisible). And, predictably, they have threatened the UK with a cessation of the intelligence swapping arrangements we have with them. Good! They can then dismantle the likes of Memwith Hill, RAF Croughton etc and these sites can then be returned to nice bits of countryside instead of giant crazy golf theme parks. And the losers will be the Septics as these sites allow them one thing that is forbidden in the US: they can spy/eavesdrop on their own citizens. I can almost hear the squawking now as all that domestic intelligence dries up.
Before any Huawei kit is installed over here, it will be installed and tested in kit belonging to the likes of GCHQ and, no doubt a few more government agencies.
I heard an American commentator today pointing out the real reason for this hysteria; the big players that traditionally provided infrastructure for cellular systems were once American. Not any longer and they want that market back.
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Old 17th Jan 2020, 22:46
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And for why are big players not American anymore in this sector?
There must be a reason. (rhetorical)
Haven't heard of any home grown 5G "we can build it" blitz.
Now kind of late.
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Old 18th Jan 2020, 07:54
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meadowrun: I wish I "knew" the answer to your question but I can offer this as a possible contributing factor:
I worked for a (perhaps the) major communications company. A world leader in terms of innovation, invention, production and sales. It was a family owned and run company and was going from strength to strength. One of the things that became apparent pretty soon after my joining them was customer care. It really was amazing. I was telling my son's young lady yesterday about how I once worked in 16 countries in 10 days. This involved a lot of "jump on plane, get to customer, fix problem, back to airport, jump on plane" (rinse and repeat!). Anyway, it was made clear to me when I started work with them that I will fly business class everywhere and will always stay in the likes of Intercon, Hilton etc type hotels. The reason for this was that this was what the customers expected. They also expected that, if they had problems with their systems, they could make a phone call or send a telex to the UK and there would be someone such as myself there to assist, worst case by the next day.
The customers paid for this and knew they were paying for it, via unusually high equipment prices, but it was never written into a spec or business plan etc. It was just accepted that the customer got what they paid for.
And things were just rosy.
Until the company decided to go public. Shareholders jumped in, did some asset stripping etc but, worse than that, they ensured a culture of penny pinching and stiff, formal relations with customers, for example insisting on "proper" formal Service Level Agreements. I was at first amazed and then outraged. And then the customers realised what was going on and, in their turn, also became amazed and outraged. And it got worse. In the end I was kicked out (technically made redundant) for making too much noise and predicting too often that we were doomed. And where is that manufacturer now? I am not sure but I do know that factories here in the UK, built specifically to manufacture mobile telephone infrastructure and handsets, have long since closed. I think that part of the business was flogged off to Google and I know a lot of their kit is now made in China.
Serves the greedy buggers right; they very quickly killed the goose that was laying golden eggs on a regular and growing basis.
And this wasn't a Radio Shack sort of business. This was Motorola, pretty much the inventor of the cellular telephone business!
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Old 18th Jan 2020, 08:49
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It's an economic battle with some security elements dressed up as security theatre. I'm pretty sure GCHQ have people who can reverse engineer Huawei kit and find out exactly what it's doing, analyse the network traffic it puts out, etc. That's their job. The US is just using it as an excuse to force the UK to by US kit.
Most major government intelligence agencies have the talent to implant their own back doors in any piece of kit whoever made it... it's just easier to do it if the factory happens to be in your own country and you can plant people in the company to do it.
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Old 18th Jan 2020, 09:49
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The US is just using it as an excuse to force the UK to by US kit.

That sentence - or one closely like it - just about defines US foreign policy. Would apply to the UK, methinks, if we had anything left to sell...
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Old 18th Jan 2020, 12:35
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AS I understand it there is NO suitable US kit for all the stuff Huawei provides. And even they don't provide the full package.

No-one can produce any evidence, it's all just the US bullying to put pressure on the Chinese

And then maybe Trump cuts a deal with Xi, they US gets cheap chinese telecomms and the rest of the world has been stuffed .. again.......
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