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War in Australia (any Oz Politics)

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War in Australia (any Oz Politics)

Old 20th May 2019, 04:55
  #21 (permalink)  
 
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I thought we might be up for another hung parliament so it's good to have a definate result and not have the Clive Palmers of this world having a say.

Painting the people who negative gear as fat cats was a big mistake, as nurses and teachers are among the top seven professions listed https://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-04-...pation/7357718 and ironically they are probably one of the few professions that are still unionised.

Fiddling around with people's long-term investments and retirement plans was never going to end well.

As far as I'm concerned it's no different to who wins the grand final as none of them give a stuff about small business, we are just their unpaid tax collectors. Though I must say the left are behaving a bit like Collingwood supporters did when the best team won last year
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Old 20th May 2019, 07:34
  #22 (permalink)  
 
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Smile

Originally Posted by Clare Prop View Post
.......................... I must say the left are behaving a bit like Collingwood supporters did when the best team won last year
Collingwood supporters are much better behaved than some elements of the Labour left Clare
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Old 20th May 2019, 12:29
  #23 (permalink)  
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If anyone knew beforehand that they were in for a tumble then it was Penny.
A pity; a very talented lady
Quite possibly, WingNut60; However, regardless of how talented Penny Wong may be; I still clearly remember what an acquaintance of mine now sadly deceased*, of Chinese ancestry, once said to me of people such as Ms Wong.

The last I remember reading of Ms Wong's bio was that she could not speak or understand any Chinese language or dialect!
My acquaintance remarked to me that such people ''would be treated like shit..."(his exact words) in any dealings with Chinese Government Authorities! His statement of opinion was along the lines that if you appear to have Chinese ancestry you had better bloody well speak the language.......or else!!!

And don't squeal racist, discrimination or whatever the current PC term is/was, because the Chinese Government would not give a shit!!

*Any old PNG lapuns from the early 90's would know of whom I speak.
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Old 20th May 2019, 13:09
  #24 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Pinky the pilot View Post
Quite possibly, WingNut60; However, regardless of how talented Penny Wong may be; I still clearly remember what an acquaintance of mine now sadly deceased*, of Chinese ancestry, once said to me of people such as Ms Wong.

The last I remember reading of Ms Wong's bio was that she could not speak or understand any Chinese language or dialect!
My acquaintance remarked to me that such people ''would be treated like shit..."(his exact words) in any dealings with Chinese Government Authorities! His statement of opinion was along the lines that if you appear to have Chinese ancestry you had better bloody well speak the language.......or else!!!

And don't squeal racist, discrimination or whatever the current PC term is/was, because the Chinese Government would not give a shit!!

*Any old PNG lapuns from the early 90's would know of whom I speak.
I don't doubt it.
But, not necessarily a lot more-so than if you're not of Chinese ancestry.

Any encounter will be along the lines of "What's in it for us. How can we divert ALL benefits to us. We don't care how long it takes, we want it all; and some"
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Old 20th May 2019, 20:57
  #25 (permalink)  
 
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Australia had some wins & some losses from the election ... Just a few thoughts:
  • Liberals/ Nationals / Labor - take your pick
  • Fraser Anning unsuccessful - not too many redeeming features
  • Clive Palmer unsuccessful - couldn’t buy a seat
  • Tony Abbott - first rate disrupter but even a senior Liberal said his (excellent) concession speech should have come 3 years ago
  • Malcolm Roberts. Surely Pauline Hansen had better options
Whatever your political persuasion, yesterday the sun still rose, the coffee was good, & the golf no better than last week ☹️
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Old 20th May 2019, 22:08
  #26 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by layman View Post
  • Liberals/ Nationals / Labor - take your pick
  • Tony Abbott - first rate disrupter but even a senior Liberal said his (excellent) concession speech should have come 3 years ago
I remember well a presenter at a seminar I went to in about 1975 who said pretty much the same about the insignificant differences between Liberals/ Nationals / Labor.
He firmly attributed it to the robustness of the Australian constitution, and the provisions that prevent it from being easily changed.
You cannot and never will have a government that diverges much from mid-field party policies which the current parties follow.

Be very wary of any politician who espouses making our constitution "easier to maintain".

Re Abbott, I liked Bob Hawke's assessment - "Basically a good bloke, but as mad as a cut snake."
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Old 21st May 2019, 01:34
  #27 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by WingNut60 View Post
I remember well a presenter at a seminar I went to in about 1975 who said pretty much the same about the insignificant differences between Liberals/ Nationals / Labor.
He firmly attributed it to the robustness of the Australian constitution, and the provisions that prevent it from being easily changed.
You cannot and never will have a government that diverges much from mid-field party policies which the current parties follow.
That's pretty much correct. Australia rarely gravitates away from centrist policy. For political junkies and die hard supporters of each party they can boast and moan at election time and in between in the media and on social media but for the vast majority we hold our noses and pick whomever we can stomach the most, they get on with life and exclaim "all politicians are useless wankers".

Even more so to back this up is that the Two Party Preferred vote has never really been more than a 3% majority within the last 40 years. In 3 of the last 4 elections it's been less than 1%. From last election to this one there was barely any change in the vote counts. The nation is fairly centre based, more radical parties (Clive Palmer this time around) fail to achieve any impact. Whereas in other nations huge swings and vote changes of 20-30% are seen by various parties with more substantial differences at election time. Australia is far more stable, only changing between two parties which both essentially run the country the same way. Putting it down to compulsory voting, the preferential system and the Australian public's overall dislike of politicians.

Last edited by dr dre; 21st May 2019 at 01:47.
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Old 21st May 2019, 02:23
  #28 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by dr dre View Post
.........Putting it down to compulsory voting, the preferential system and the Australian public's ever-growing dislike of politicians.
Even the right-wing swing in some areas (Ginger and Clive) was just a re-allocation of otherwise Liberal votes. Similar with the Greens and Labor.
It has been a while since any Oz government was any more than two or three seats away from minority government at best.
No matter what your views on the disproportionate influence of the cross bench it is still probably much better overall than having a government with a 30 seat majority.

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Old 21st May 2019, 02:45
  #29 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by WingNut60 View Post
No matter what your views on the disproportionate influence of the cross bench it is still probably much better overall than having a government with a 30 seat majority.
Last time we had a government with a majority in both houses they lasted one term before getting turfed out comprehensively (including a sitting PM). If Australians dislike politicians in general they especially hate them being given absolute power. With the current voting patterns that's unlikely to happen again soon.
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Old 21st May 2019, 03:00
  #30 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by dr dre View Post
Last time we had a government with a majority in both houses they lasted one term before getting turfed out comprehensively (including a sitting PM). If Australians dislike politicians in general they especially hate them being given absolute power. With the current voting patterns that's unlikely to happen again soon.
Ah yes, Work Choices.
I'd not be surprised to see that one re-flagged and put up again.

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Old 22nd May 2019, 10:15
  #31 (permalink)  
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But, not necessarily a lot more-so than if you're not of Chinese ancestry.
With respect WingNut60; I would disagree! If you are of Chinese ancestry and cannot speak Chinese you will be treated with even greater contempt than if you were a 'round eye.' That was the statement as I heard it from my acquaintance.

And I had no cause to doubt the veracity of his statement, given it coincided with what I had learned from my time living in Darwin many years earlier, having Chinese born friends in the Martial Arts Club that I joined there.
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Old 22nd May 2019, 12:17
  #32 (permalink)  
 
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So, where to now for Bill Shorten and Malcolm Turnbull?
Scott Morrison has a majority now. Surely, to stamp his leadership firmly on the Liberal party, the rapid expulsion of Turnbull must be one of his first priorities. With Turnbull gone from the Libs, and the Labor party having rejected him years ago due to his enormous wealth, that would signal the end of Turnbull's public life? Leaving him embedded in the Liberal party surely isn't an acceptable option any more?
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Old 22nd May 2019, 13:07
  #33 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Pinky the pilot View Post
With respect WingNut60; I would disagree! If you are of Chinese ancestry and cannot speak Chinese you will be treated with even greater contempt than if you were a 'round eye.' That was the statement as I heard it from my acquaintance.

And I had no cause to doubt the veracity of his statement, given it coincided with what I had learned from my time living in Darwin many years earlier, having Chinese born friends in the Martial Arts Club that I joined there.
My point was simply that the inscrutable deference sometimes shown, just as frequently conceals a more general measure of contempt for all things non-Chinese.
Perhaps with good reason, and acknowledging that it also often occurs in reverse.
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Old 22nd May 2019, 15:24
  #34 (permalink)  
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Can hardly wait to see the smirks of the usual ABC morning crew tomorrow.
I watched a bit of the ABC programme the morning after, (via the internet Australiachannel.com) and the collective decision was that Scot-Morrison had run a 'negative' campaign and the various members of the talk fest were most upset at all the 'negativity' the Lib Dems had shown in their campaign! Didn't understand it then and don't now, I think the Australian public gently woke up and on the appointed day said, "No Way".

We seem to have lost Hempy!
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Old 22nd May 2019, 22:42
  #35 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by parabellum View Post
I watched a bit of the ABC programme Didn't understand it then and don't now
I too have been shocked at the some of the Op-eds and headlines coming through my newsfeed since the election;

"Labor lost on a crusade for fairness - what does that say about us?" (Fairfax)
"I'm young, I voted Liberal and I am not a bigot" (SMH Fairfax)
"The secret history of News Corp: a media empire built on spreading propaganda" (ABC)

The narrative being spun appears to be that if you didn't vote Left in this election you are an old, greedy bigot, easily manipulated by Murdoch as part of some Evil Plan for world domination.
Forget the fact that our national broadcaster itself has all but abandoned any pretence of political neutrality and has partnered with Fairfax to spread plenty of propaganda of its own; apparently this election was just good people (themselves) vs Bad People.

Instead of some introspection, the Green/Left media retains its smug self-righteousness.
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Old 23rd May 2019, 02:31
  #36 (permalink)  
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Hempy is probably having a break after the election

https://www.smh.com.au/federal-elect...19-p51p0n.html
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Old 23rd May 2019, 10:27
  #37 (permalink)  
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My point was simply that the inscrutable deference sometimes shown, just as frequently conceals a more general measure of contempt for all things non-Chinese.
Perhaps with good reason, and acknowledging that it also often occurs in reverse.
I concede your point, Sir.
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Old 24th May 2019, 00:37
  #38 (permalink)  
 
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Forget the fact that our national broadcaster itself has all but abandoned any pretence of political neutrality
When you have the managing director of the ABC publicly telling everyone to vote Labor they have abandoned any pretence. Not "all but" as you say, as shown by their comedy program "Countdown to Glory", which ran for ten days immediately preceding the election, lampooning the Libs. Very apply named as it turned out. Shot in the foot?

https://iview.abc.net.au/show/countd.../LR1824V006S00
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Old 24th May 2019, 01:17
  #39 (permalink)  
 
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As much as I (generally) oppose attacks on or proposals to change our constitution, one change that I would support would be FIXED, FOUR YEAR terms.
Possibly even five year, but I doubt that would fly.

I know that it has been tried before (1988) but in that instance the proposal was coupled with other far less palatable changes.
It significantly failed to propose making the four years a fixed term and thereby leaving the pollies with the ability to call early elections if and when they felt it best suited there purposes.
On its own, I think it may have got through.

As a wish list item, I would further propose that no budget changes be allowed within 5 months, before or after, the scheduled fixed term elections.
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Old 25th Jun 2019, 02:23
  #40 (permalink)  
 
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Been out of country for a month, but I saw that the retired general Jim Molan garnered the greatest number EVER of first-preference votes in history. But some idiot greenie got the seat on preferences.

Sad that this can happen - obviously a lot of people wanted to see Jim in the senate, but the behind-the-scenes manoeuvring between the parties meant that the most popular person didn't get a look in.
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