Sir Kim Darroch resigns -: Why ?
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Exit stage right.
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Originally Posted by ehwatezedoing
No kidding lol
Sad backward time though.
Tell the truth and your loose your job, lie every single day and get to be a president...
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Stockport MAN/EGCC
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Originally Posted by racedo
Lying wasn't invented after US Presidential elections in 2016.
Be lucky
David
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Exit stage right.
Posts: 289
Originally Posted by ehwatezedoing
you missed the part saying every single day.
2 1/2 yrs into Trump administration he has not nuked anybody, started any major wars but instead has talked to North Korea, stopped US getting more heavily involved in Syria and not supplied Ukraine with the thousands of troops promised by the Dems for a war.
You may not like it but the parents and family members who would have potentially had to mourn their lost kin under HRC will be thankful.
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Beyond the Blue Horizon
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Perhaps Trump wants to increase the size of his golf courses by buying up the old country, and Boris is just the man to sell it, just like he sold our Ambassador down the river. What ever political persuasion you, are there is something deeply wrong in English society at the moment, and I do not just mean Brexit as that is just one thing, but values and norms seem to have been challenged, sometimes for no apparent reason but almost just for devilment, and I think England is poorer for it.
Cavorting cheetah
Are you mad ? I think German intelligence would love to have the skill and tech to intercept coded e-mails to HMG even if not used, but they do not have the resource.
On that unhappy note its time to go find a stiff drink !!
Regards
Mr Mac
Cavorting cheetah
Are you mad ? I think German intelligence would love to have the skill and tech to intercept coded e-mails to HMG even if not used, but they do not have the resource.
On that unhappy note its time to go find a stiff drink !!
Regards
Mr Mac
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: UK
Age: 51
Posts: 0
Once trump said he would not deal with the ambassador anymore he was essentially out of a job.
Nothing left for him but to step down.
It it looks like the only person who has done wrong here was the leaker. Trump rightly aggrieved at the tone of the message. The ambassador rightly sent his opinion of the new government to his superiors rightly feeling that is was safe and secure
Nothing left for him but to step down.
It it looks like the only person who has done wrong here was the leaker. Trump rightly aggrieved at the tone of the message. The ambassador rightly sent his opinion of the new government to his superiors rightly feeling that is was safe and secure
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: cheshire
Posts: 245
Originally Posted by racedo
Not in the slightest.
2 1/2 yrs into Trump administration he has not nuked anybody, started any major wars but instead has talked to North Korea, stopped US getting more heavily involved in Syria and not supplied Ukraine with the thousands of troops promised by the Dems for a war.
You may not like it but the parents and family members who would have potentially had to mourn their lost kin under HRC will be thankful.
2 1/2 yrs into Trump administration he has not nuked anybody, started any major wars but instead has talked to North Korea, stopped US getting more heavily involved in Syria and not supplied Ukraine with the thousands of troops promised by the Dems for a war.
You may not like it but the parents and family members who would have potentially had to mourn their lost kin under HRC will be thankful.
But he never pretended to be anyone else, his behaviours since becoming POTUS have been exactly the same as those exhibited during the campaign trail, upon which he was elected.
I dont like or agree with many of his viewpoints but, as Racedo says, hes actually started a damn sight less wars than Clinton would have done.
Whether he can continue to exercise restraint with Iran will probably be his biggest test on the global stage.
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Kelowna Wine Country
Posts: 469
Saw today Boris is getting the blame for Darroch's resignation. That is so ridiculous it's almost criminal. Once the leak was out Darroch was doomed and could not possibly be ambassador anywhere, (except maybe Iran if they ever have one again.)
He may have been telling the truth, or only his opinion. It does not matter. Really as a diplomat he should have been able to express his opinion in language that did not show his personal antipathy so openly. Granted most of what we read was interpreted by the newspapers but if his language was even close to what we heard his words displayed his personal contempt. Not good and he could not possibly continue to improve GB relations with a major head of state afterwards.
He may have been telling the truth, or only his opinion. It does not matter. Really as a diplomat he should have been able to express his opinion in language that did not show his personal antipathy so openly. Granted most of what we read was interpreted by the newspapers but if his language was even close to what we heard his words displayed his personal contempt. Not good and he could not possibly continue to improve GB relations with a major head of state afterwards.
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Sweden
Posts: 448
Originally Posted by ChrisVJ
Saw today Boris is getting the blame for Darroch's resignation. That is so ridiculous it's almost criminal. Once the leak was out Darroch was doomed and could not possibly be ambassador anywhere, (except maybe Iran if they ever have one again.)
He may have been telling the truth, or only his opinion. It does not matter. Really as a diplomat he should have been able to express his opinion in language that did not show his personal antipathy so openly. Granted most of what we read was interpreted by the newspapers but if his language was even close to what we heard his words displayed his personal contempt. Not good and he could not possibly continue to improve GB relations with a major head of state afterwards.
He may have been telling the truth, or only his opinion. It does not matter. Really as a diplomat he should have been able to express his opinion in language that did not show his personal antipathy so openly. Granted most of what we read was interpreted by the newspapers but if his language was even close to what we heard his words displayed his personal contempt. Not good and he could not possibly continue to improve GB relations with a major head of state afterwards.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Reading, UK
Posts: 13,921
Originally Posted by ChrisVJ
Saw today Boris is getting the blame for Darroch's resignation. That is so ridiculous it's almost criminal.
But when the likely future PM fails to take the opportunity to voice his support for your position, your days are pretty well numbered.
Resident insomniac
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: N54 58 34 W02 01 21
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Should Boris have been required to offer his support to a diplomat that he (Boris) had no inclination to want as Ambassador?
As stated, Darroch was doomed once his opinion (however justified) was made public, and, particularly once Trump had declared Darroch to be persona non grata, there was no going back and he could not be saved whatever Boris said or did.
As stated, Darroch was doomed once his opinion (however justified) was made public, and, particularly once Trump had declared Darroch to be persona non grata, there was no going back and he could not be saved whatever Boris said or did.
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: England
Posts: 454
Originally Posted by G-CPTN
Should Boris have been required to offer his support to a diplomat that he (Boris) had no inclination to want as Ambassador?
As stated, Darroch was doomed once his opinion (however justified) was made public, and, particularly once Trump had declared Darroch to be persona non grata, there was no going back and he could not be saved whatever Boris said or did.
As stated, Darroch was doomed once his opinion (however justified) was made public, and, particularly once Trump had declared Darroch to be persona non grata, there was no going back and he could not be saved whatever Boris said or did.
No doubt Trump will feel satisfied with the way that the two countries' future relationship is heading. Ractopamine pork anyone?
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Eu
Posts: 308
As a so called brilliant diplomat, after all , Ambassador to the United States is considered to be the pinnacle of diplomatic postings, I was surprised at the poor quality and one might say undiplomatic use of English used to express his opinions. Whether the language has been manipulated by the newspaper in question I don’t know.
Of course he had to resign, no real choice, all sorts of shenanigans going on behind the scenes and as for the chap, a senior civil servant, who accuses Boris of throwing him under a bus... I,m afraid he has to go as well ... far too political .
Of course he had to resign, no real choice, all sorts of shenanigans going on behind the scenes and as for the chap, a senior civil servant, who accuses Boris of throwing him under a bus... I,m afraid he has to go as well ... far too political .
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 0
G-CPTN ; Finally, after wading through most of the thread, you, alone, got it in one. Look, it is the "Diplomatic Service" isn't it ?. And a top Diplomat in one of the most sort after positions in the Service should have known better. You have to watch your motor mouth ON and OFF duty. He was very undiplomatic , albeit in private, got recorded and got leaked. Bye .Bojo is utterly correct & Hunt is a clot for suggesting that he would be kept on under his Premiership. You insult the President of the United States and get kept on. Clowns ! Nevermind, the Old Pal's brigade will come to the rescue.
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Manchester, England
Age: 56
Posts: 879
Originally Posted by Jack D
As a so called brilliant diplomat, after all , Ambassador to the United States is considered to be the pinnacle of diplomatic postings, I was surprised at the poor quality and one might say undiplomatic use of English used to express his opinions. Whether the language has been manipulated by the newspaper in question I don’t know.
The cables need to be looked at through the prism of them being from 2017, when even many Trump supporters would acknowledge a degree of chaos in the early days of Trump’s White House, with turf battles and hiring and firings happening frequently. Bannon v Jared/Ivanka would just be one example as they all tried to get Trump’s ear. The other main issue for foreign governments was to assess whether this was going to be the way things were for the next 4/8 years, or just ‘teething troubles’. Either way, if an ambassador now has to write briefings on the basis that they may appear in the press then that reduces their effectiveness dramatically.
Next is Trump’s response, and how to deal with it. He undeniably threw a strop about it all, at which point the British government needed to decide whether it was a storm in a tea cup or likely to do lasting damage with trade treaty negotiations coming up. May and Hunt seemed to think Trump would get over it, and so were able to express support, no doubt helped by the knowledge that Darroch would be retired by Christmas, while Boris for whatever reason refused to give even lukewarm backing. The thought that a diplomat shouldn’t have his career politicised only came out as the excuse for this afterwards, presumably after the Boris spin doctors got involved in damage limitation. Even Boris now acknowledges that he should have done better - for a guy who has made waffle and bluster into an art form you would have thought he could have come up with a sentence that gave support without winding Trump up further.
That he didn’t raises 2 possibilities- either there is history between Darroch and Boris from the latter’s Foreign Secretary days, or he wanted Darroch replaced for whatever reason (Brexit related, or currying favour with Trump perhaps) and saw the opportunity.
Finally, and perhaps most importantly, should a President of any country be dictating who gets to be an ambassador from another country. Imagine if the UK ambassador to the Russia’s cables were leaked, saying that Putin was a brainless maniac who struggled to understand words of more than 4 letters. If Putin then demanded he was sacked, and the U.K. government complied would this have had the same reaction from the folks supporting Trump in the current spat? I suspect no.
And after all this the theories as to why someone leaked in the first place remain very thin on the ground.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
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Trump’s response, and how to deal with it. He undeniably threw a strop about it all, at which point the British government needed to decide whether it was a storm in a tea cup or likely to do lasting damage with trade treaty negotiations coming up.
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Southwold
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Law of Unexpected Consequences. It is suspected that the leaker's motive was to damage people seen as against Brexit. The outcome however may well be to further weaken Bozza's position as PM by allowing him to be exposed to the wider electorate as the charlatan that he is. He hasn't handled this well at all and his clumsy attempt at claiming that he had no effect on the ambassadors decision to resign has been exposed as yet another lie. Boris is damaged goods before he becomes PM. It will be interesting to see the final outcome of which PM is worst, Cameron, May or Boris. My half crown is firmly on the latter.
