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Climate protests in London

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Climate protests in London

Old 20th Apr 2019, 18:19
  #141 (permalink)  
 
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I spent three seasons working on a weather research project where we had aeroplanes targeting specific clouds and attempting, with very focussed scientific effort, to alter the behaviour of those clouds. After several seasons the results were that we were having no more than a 1% effect on the behaviour of those very targeted clouds. If, with very concentrated and focussed scientific effort, we could have hardly any effect on very, very, very localised weather, I simply do not understand the argument that we are accidentally influencing the climate of the entire planet. There are just far too many external factors (that several have recently mentioned) influencing it that our influence has to be very, very, very insignificant.

When water vapour is about 27 times as much a greenhouse gas as CO2, why, why, why aren't human H20 emissions into the atmosphere 'taxed'? When you have a cup of tea you are putting more greenhouse gasses into the atmosphere with the steam from the kettle than the CO2 that is put into the atmosphere from the energy used by that kettle. But hey! Nobody can see that CO2 'stuff' and most don't really understand it, so it is easy to turn it into a 'mysterious demon' and allow swathes of money-grabbers to use it as a way to fleece to populace. The gilet jaunes have called 'bollocks' to this 'climate change fleecing'. On balance they have caused immensely more disruption opposing the 'climate change fleecing' than this present rent-a-crowd mob in London have managed on their 'CO2 is bad' mantra. Seeing the exact opposites in those two protest campaigns:

First world protest is delightfully hypocritical.
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Old 20th Apr 2019, 18:27
  #142 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ATNotts View Post
You'll be trying to convince us next that ... the moon [is] made of cheese.

...
It is. Wensleydale. Wallace confirmed that in A Grand Day Out.


(Sorry, that level of comment just deserved that level of response.)
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Old 20th Apr 2019, 22:23
  #143 (permalink)  
 
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Perhaps you could explain why the city of Emphases, Turkey, a port on the Mediterranean Sea two thousand years ago...is now 6 miles inland! Does that mean when the sea level reaches that port once again that we are back to NORMAL sea levels? Maybe 2ooo years ago that sea level was normal and sea levels have recede in the recent past two millenniums'...OMG I'm so confused!! OK let's all gather on Oxford and run in circles , carrying signs and...what were we protesting, and what the hell are we doing in Oxford...we could have done this in Miami or Nice or...oh I'm gonna watch Nye that science guy he knows the answers HMMM!
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 05:54
  #144 (permalink)  
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Rod Liddle in The Times:

”The competition is hotting up in the race to win the prestigious Whitest Protest of the Year award for 2019. It seemed to be a straight fight between the two sides of the Brexit argument, both of whose marches featured almost exclusively white faces. But Extinction Rebellion, which consists entirely of top-knotted hipsters and berserk menopausal women in tie-dye outfits, has now become the bookies’ favourite.

An awards organiser told me: “It was a remarkably white turnout by the eco-loons, to be sure. But we are investigating allegations that they explicitly banned black and minority ethnic people from attending, which is contrary to the spirit of the event.”

The trophy — a statuette of the broadcaster Jon Snow looking very smug while wearing a colourful tie — will be awarded to the winner in September, when the English middle classes have got all this stuff out of their system for a bit and have just returned from the Dordogne.

Meanwhile, what a delight to see the actress Dame Emma Thompson ferried to the protests by aeroplane, leaving a carbon footprint equivalent to her personally strangling nine polar bears. Rumours that fellow thespian and social justice warrior Emma Watson was also due to make an appearance — on a golden litter slung beneath 12 helicopters — proved sadly unfounded.”..........

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Old 21st Apr 2019, 08:03
  #145 (permalink)  
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Nevertheless, I am not a climate change specialist so I rely on the experts.
So do many people. Unfortunately many of the "experts" know no more about it than you, and many of the research "experts" have been caught fidddling their results, which tends to reflect badly on the whole scientific community.
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 08:08
  #146 (permalink)  
 
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The competition is hotting up in the race to win the prestigious Whitest Protest of the Year award for 2019.
I always say that to assess if something is racist, 'turn the tables' and see if that would be considered racist.

If someone said...
The competition is hotting up in the race to win the prestigious Blackest Protest of the Year award for 2019.
...that would justifiably cause howls of "Racist!" protests.

Therefore that original quote is blatantly racist.

Race had absolutely nothing to do with this. Stupid thinking has and that is by choice not by birth.

And the likes of grandstanding Emma Thompson has shown in bucket-loads that:

First world protest is delightfully hypocritical.
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 08:15
  #147 (permalink)  
 
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A couple of facts:

Yes water vapour is a 'greenhouse gas'. But it responds to temperature and thus forms a positive feedback mechanism. So it makes no sense to ask why we are worrying about CO2 and ignoring the bigger effect of water vapour. CO2 exerts much of its effect through water vapour.

Yes other gasses such as methane have a bigger effect than CO2. But we do not ignore them and focus only on CO2. If you look at greenhouse gas emission data you will usually see it expressed as CO2-equivalents. This allows different gas emissions to be combined together as total greenhouse effect.
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 08:41
  #148 (permalink)  
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Therefore that original quote is blatantly racist. Race had absolutely nothing to do with this. Stupid thinking has and that is by choice not by birth.
You miss the sarcasm, which is referenced by the award being one of Jon Snow.

It is he who is/was the subject of a debate of exactly the point you make by commentating during a TV report concerning the “leave” march in Westminster square that, “I’ve never seen so many white people in one place.“

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/poli...-a4105051.html
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 08:47
  #149 (permalink)  
 
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The trouble with all this "whataboutery" is that it completely fails to address the issue. I find Liddle quite amusing but his piece entirely misses the point. As I have already said we don't know yet quite what human input is but the trouble is that if we wait until we can be 100% certain rather than 99% then it's probably going to be too late. I really think that we are going to need some kind of taxation on commercial flying. It's quite frankly ridiculous that you can fly several hundred miles for twenty quid or to Autralia for under £500 return. The amount of pollute I caused by this is out of all proportion to the price charged.

I accept that America won't take any part in this but the EU could impose landing/departure taxes. I would suggest that for Business and 1st class these levies should be say 200% and 500% of the fares respectively.
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 08:50
  #150 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by NoelEvans View Post
I always say that to assess if something is racist, 'turn the tables' and see if that would be considered racist.
Whereas, I always say that to assess if something is racist, see if the comment is a statement of fact and if it is, how can it be considered racist.

Would it be racist to state that professional swimming is predominantly a white orientated sport? or that rap music is, in the main performed by black people?
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 08:55
  #151 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Harley Quinn View Post
I post two inescapable facts
You might have been better to stop at one inescapable fact and forego the King Canute reference.
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 09:07
  #152 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Effluent Man View Post
I accept that America won't take any part in this but the EU could impose landing/departure taxes. I would suggest that for Business and 1st class these levies should be say 200% and 500% of the fares respectively.
This won't happen since the US would immediately apply a similar tax on flights from the EU, with some form of subsidy or arrangement so that US airlines did not suffer.
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 09:22
  #153 (permalink)  
 
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London (and U.K. in general) - soft target. Easy to demonstrate in. No hardline crackdown. No armed police. Free press. Entitlement to legal aid.


Try the same tactics in the following countries, who also happen to be the world,’s worst polluters and see how far you’ll get: China, India, Qatar, Pakistan, Egypt, Bangladesh.

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Old 21st Apr 2019, 09:46
  #154 (permalink)  
 
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Another couple of changes that would show real progress in this climate change debate would be to ban cruise ships and, to really p*ss off the masses, ban all night sporting activities.
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 10:11
  #155 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Effluent Man View Post
The trouble with all this "whataboutery" is that it completely fails to address the issue. I find Liddle quite amusing but his piece entirely misses the point. As I have already said we don't know yet quite what human input is but the trouble is that if we wait until we can be 100% certain rather than 99% then it's probably going to be too late. I really think that we are going to need some kind of taxation on commercial flying. It's quite frankly ridiculous that you can fly several hundred miles for twenty quid or to Autralia for under £500 return. The amount of pollute I caused by this is out of all proportion to the price charged.

I accept that America won't take any part in this but the EU could impose landing/departure taxes. I would suggest that for Business and 1st class these levies should be say 200% and 500% of the fares respectively.
This could construed as allowing only those wealthy enough can fly. With the ever increasing tax on motorists, congestion, ULEZ, then it would appear that the poor will just have to stay at home. Well I say home, but maybe they shouldn't be allowed them as heating them will be bad as well.
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 16:20
  #156 (permalink)  
 
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I wonder if all the excitement is dying down? Driving along the west side of Heathrow earlier, I was joined by 3 police vans, coming from the direction of the terminals (North side perimeter) . 2 of them were from Sussex, and peeled off before the M25, while the third seemed to be heading for Surrey (along the M3).
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 16:46
  #157 (permalink)  
 
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At the local bus./ skytrain station they have affixed largish signs to each of the dividing glass panels in the seating area. totally ruins several sightlines needed for seeing your arriving bus.

"No Smoking
This is a Smoke Free Environment."

Except for the diesel buses, gasoline powered support vehicles and the adjoining streets of course.
Next time walking along a city street, contemplate, if you will the diameter of a cigarette to the diameters of the hundreds of exhaust pipes that will pass by, right next to you, by the dozens and hundreds.

Climate Change as a Name or cause seems to be mostly a PR effort by government effort wasters.
It's really all about pollution (that old thing) of all sorts and the continuing need to reduce and remove it where possible, not fancy it up with Carbon Taxes that are essentially governments assigning numbers to all sorts of things and then moving the numbers around. Accomplishes little but it's what bureaucrats know and understand from their desks.

Get back to basics.
Pollution - Bad
Any type of pollution - Bad.
Just concentrate on reducing pollution by actually polluting less and then a bit more less, every single minute, everyone.

'course convincing China and India that power plants using inferior grades of coal is a bad, polluting thing - will be a Sisyphusian effort.

Last edited by meadowrun; 21st Apr 2019 at 16:58.
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 18:09
  #158 (permalink)  
 
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Sisyphean. This term for a task that is endless and ineffective comes straight out of Greek myth.

Just to save anyone else from needing to Google it.
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 18:12
  #159 (permalink)  
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k3k3,

You're on a roll......
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 20:26
  #160 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by DaveReidUK View Post
You might have been better to stop at one inescapable fact and forego the King Canute reference.
If you want to believe a man can hold back the tide through strength of will alone, fill your boots.
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