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EU Consultations.

Old 1st Apr 2019, 08:12
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EU Consultations.

I was musing on the recent statement from the EU that following on from consultations with citizens of the EU, countries will need to decide on whether to stay on BST or GMT. I was wondering why I didn't know about this particular consultation and wondered how does the EU go about consulting with its citizens on matters like this?

Is it up to the UK government to publicise this consultation? Should I have expected to have received some sort of notification through the letter box? Newspaper advert? How was I expected to know about this process and how to respond to it? perhaps it is a representative sample of the population?

Just curious.
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 08:51
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This just serves to highlight a problem, which I suspect in many ways contributed to the referendum result.

The UK media has been lamentable, for 40+ years in properly reporting what goes on within the anals of power in Brussels and Strasbourg; only taking an interest when the PM (of whatever hue) is in Brussels "battling" against some directive, proposal or another and railing against the Eurosausage (I know that was fictional!) chocolate or bent cucumbers. Our politicians, at the same time are very comfortable with that situation, enabling them as it does (or, perhaps did) allow them to blame every bit of overburdening regulation on some EU directive or another - when in reality it has little or nothing to do with the EU, and everything to do with the UK's risk averse attitudes to life. Case in point is PAT testing, not an EU regulation, not even a government regulation, but has become standard at the behest of the UK insurance industry. It also enables government to blame the EU for overzealous application and enforcement of directive in UK.

Had the UK had a more Europe focused media the public might understand better "what the EU has done for us", and the government held better to account.
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 09:10
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The UK media has been lamentable, for 40+ years in properly reporting what goes on within the annals of power in Brussels and Strasbourg
I don't think that the mundane utterings of the EU would in any way be of "interest" to the average newspaper buyer, whether here or in Europe. Any directive or proposal from the EU is normally not reported unless it directly impinges upon the local populace.
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 09:16
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Originally Posted by ATNotts View Post
This just serves to highlight a problem, which I suspect in many ways contributed to the referendum result.

The UK media has been lamentable, for 40+ years in properly reporting what goes on within the anals of power in Brussels and Strasbourg; only taking an interest when the PM (of whatever hue) is in Brussels "battling" against some directive, proposal or another and railing against the Eurosausage (I know that was fictional!) chocolate or bent cucumbers. Our politicians, at the same time are very comfortable with that situation, enabling them as it does (or, perhaps did) allow them to blame every bit of overburdening regulation on some EU directive or another - when in reality it has little or nothing to do with the EU, and everything to do with the UK's risk averse attitudes to life. Case in point is PAT testing, not an EU regulation, not even a government regulation, but has become standard at the behest of the UK insurance industry. It also enables government to blame the EU for overzealous application and enforcement of directive in UK.

Had the UK had a more Europe focused media the public might understand better "what the EU has done for us", and the government held better to account.
Or perhaps if the Remain campaign had focused more on this instead of project fear then the result of the referendum might have been different. Let's face it they were the right people with the right opportunity to show the good that the EU has done, and they blew it.
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 09:20
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Originally Posted by denachtenmai View Post
I don't think that the mundane utterings of the EU would in any way be of "interest" to the average newspaper buyer, whether here or in Europe. Any directive or proposal from the EU is normally not reported unless it directly impinges upon the local populace.
All I can say is take a look at Euronews that does cover EU affairs rather better than our own domestic media does. If nothing else it gives a rather more complete insight into the workings of the EU, and allows viewers to hear the views of MEPs other than the usual suspects, Farage and his ilk lambasting, or just being down right rude / disrespectful to his elected colleagues. i found out about the public consultation on the ending of the winter clock change from that outlet; not a dickie bird from the UK media.
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 09:22
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Originally Posted by Groundbased View Post
Or perhaps if the Remain campaign had focused more on this instead of project fear then the result of the referendum might have been different. Let's face it they were the right people with the right opportunity to show the good that the EU has done, and they blew it.
Perhaps so, and certainly, without dragging this thread into yet another Brexit one, I would say their approach was abysmal. However I think 40+ years and negativity and inadequate / twisted reporting is now ingrained within the public psyche.
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 09:29
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ATNotts, never having heard of EuroNews, how would the average person find out about it?

The nearest I have seen in Euro was EuroTrash on TV and the name says it all. The odd, and I mean odd, Italian TV programme simply reinforces prejudice.

It really is media bias. Maybe the BBC should have had a proper EU news slot but prefers to focus on only relevant news and disasters.
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 09:33
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Originally Posted by Pontius Navigator View Post
ATNotts, never having heard of EuroNews, how would the average person find out about it?

The nearest I have seen in Euro was EuroTrash on TV and the name says it all. The odd, and I mean odd, Italian TV programme simply reinforces prejudice.

It really is media bias. Maybe the BBC should have had a proper EU news slot but prefers to focus on only relevant news and disasters.
Channel 508 on Sky. It is a pan European news broadcaster, based in Lyon, but now at least in part owned by NBC. Broadcasts in numerous languages, and to be honest, their Breakfast TV news offering is streets better than BBC Breakfast, as it does offer NEWS. It doesn't concentrate on EU maters, and usually the UK version headlines with UK (currently I'm afraid Brexit!) news. Euronews is also available on Virgin, but I don't know if it's on Freeview or Freesat.
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 09:49
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+1 for that, ATN. The UK has never seemed to recognise the fact that it's a part of Europe, let alone the EU. A previous poster on another Brexit thread mentioned the EU-funded placard on some project being hidden behind a door. We seem very grudging to acknowledge the positive aspects of EU membership, particularly when it comes to funding. And when did you last see an EU flag on a local government building in Britain? Yet when I'm in the rest of Europe it's there alongside the national flag and maybe that of the province or departement or region; major towns often have an EU information office too.

It would be interesting to see how much EU funding has gone into a few of our national and local projects, but I'm not holding my breath till the Daily Fail tells us about that.

A bit late posting there. I was referring to ATN's post #2.

Last edited by Buster11; 1st Apr 2019 at 09:52. Reason: Late posting
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 09:58
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Originally Posted by ATNotts View Post
This just serves to highlight a problem, which I suspect in many ways contributed to the referendum result.

The UK media has been lamentable, for 40+ years in properly reporting what goes on within the anals of power in Brussels and Strasbourg; only taking an interest when the PM (of whatever hue) is in Brussels "battling" against some directive, proposal or another and railing against the Eurosausage (I know that was fictional!) chocolate or bent cucumbers. Our politicians, at the same time are very comfortable with that situation, enabling them as it does (or, perhaps did) allow them to blame every bit of overburdening regulation on some EU directive or another - when in reality it has little or nothing to do with the EU, and everything to do with the UK's risk averse attitudes to life. Case in point is PAT testing, not an EU regulation, not even a government regulation, but has become standard at the behest of the UK insurance industry. It also enables government to blame the EU for overzealous application and enforcement of directive in UK.

Had the UK had a more Europe focused media the public might understand better "what the EU has done for us", and the government held better to account.
But whilst we would agree that the UK media’s coverage of matters ‘EU’ might be lacking, it cannot be that it is the responsibility of the UK media to bring my attention to the fact that the EU wishes to officially consult me on something.

That responsibllity lies 100% with the EU surely?

I think my question remains, if the ‘EU’ wishes to consult me over something what route does it take to instigate that process and follow it through to fruition?

How did the EU notify you that it wanted to consult with you about changes to time zones?
What form did your feedback take? (Questionnaire? Survey?)
Is the consultation a representative sample and you knew nothing about the consultation (officially) other than what you might have picked up on in the papers or on the telly?

Just curious as I say, I knew nothing about all this at all until the other day.


Last edited by yellowtriumph; 1st Apr 2019 at 11:03.
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 10:12
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The whole idea of not changing from winter to summer time and letting each country choose its own time zone is potty, you could drive for half an hour from Germany to Belgium and back again and go through four time zones. At the moment we all spend half an hour twice a year setting old clocks and then we're done for six months, in future we'll be missing trains and appointments all year round.

In the seventies Germany had summer time, the Netherlands didn't, and we worked in Zulu, at least one one of my colleagues (worked in Germany, lived in NL) had three cheap wristwatches.
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 10:12
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Buster11, it was I that commented on an EU grant to a garden centre. Mind you, the garden centre is diabolical. The car park is about 8 feet above the centre building with about a 1:4 drop of block paving. It is hard work pushing a trolley up the slope. The outdoor area also has a marked decline.

The centre had been in the family about 100 years, they got the grant then sold out to a chain.
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 10:15
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Originally Posted by yellowtriumph View Post


But whilst we would agree that the UK media’s coverage of matters ‘EU’ might be lacking, it cannot be that it is the responsibility of the UK media to bring my attention the fact that the EU wishes to officially consult me on something.

That responsibllity lies 100% with the EU surely?

I think my my question remains, if the ‘EU’ wishes to consult me over something what route does it take to instigate that process and follow it through to fruition?

How did the EU notify you that it wanted to consult with you about changes to time zones?
What form did your feedback take? (Questionnaire? Survey?)
Is the consultation a representative sample and you knew nothing about the consultation (officially) other than what you might have picked up on in the papers or on the telly?

Just curious as I say, I knew nothing about all this at all until the other day.
I suppose that the EU expects member governments to keep their electorate up to date with consultations that may effect them. I view it as a failing of them, as much as the EU, and in their case, had they gone over the heads of the UK government and spoken to the UK population about that the outcry from the Daily Mail, Express and Telegraph would have been predictable. I remember reading back when the consultation was underway that upwards of 1 million people across the EU had answered their consultation via the EU website; I think that gem came from one of the German national broadcasters who's news bulletins and websites I also tend to frequent to find out what's going on from different angles. It's really important, I think, to get news from a variety of sources, and that those sources not be exclusively from one's home country.
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 10:17
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K3k3, a typical short cruise on P&O is to Guernsey and Zeebrugge. Depending on which way round depends on the cruise time in day 2. In one trip the Captain stayed in UK local including the bus times back to the ship from Blankenburg. That worked really well 🙁
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 12:05
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Originally Posted by k3k3 View Post
The whole idea of not changing from winter to summer time and letting each country choose its own time zone is potty, you could drive for half an hour from Germany to Belgium and back again and go through four time zones. At the moment we all spend half an hour twice a year setting old clocks and then we're done for six months, in future we'll be missing trains and appointments all year round.
I don't think you need to worry about that.

Member states have three years to decide which time zone they want to be in. With their citizens crossing borders every day for work and pleasure there is every incentive for adjacent governments to come to agreement on their times.

There's no reason for there to be more time zones than there are now. And we'll all be relieved of the nuisance of times changing twice a year.
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 12:33
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I found some information on the process of evaluating the data for this actual consultation. I can’t readily see how the process is initiated though and it’s that part that I’m interested in.

https://publications.europa.eu/en/pu...d-01aa75ed71a1

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Old 1st Apr 2019, 12:34
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Originally Posted by yellowtriumph View Post
I was musing on the recent statement from the EU that following on from consultations with citizens of the EU, countries will need to decide on whether to stay on BST or GMT. I was wondering why I didn't know about this particular consultation and wondered how does the EU go about consulting with its citizens on matters like this?

Is it up to the UK government to publicise this consultation? Should I have expected to have received some sort of notification through the letter box? Newspaper advert? How was I expected to know about this process and how to respond to it? perhaps it is a representative sample of the population?

Just curious.
The European Commission (EC) has a "have your say" portal which is permanently (AFAIK) open.

https://ec.europa.eu/info/consultations_en.

That where the EC posts the various subjects that are currently open to public input (I think the time change one was only open for maybe a couple of months and got just short of 5 million replies) and the fact it was open was mentioned several times in our non UK local and national news...

To be aware of what's running on "Have your say" I guess you need to be a bit of a policy/politics wonk, failing that you are reliant on MSM directing you in the right direction....

Last edited by wiggy; 1st Apr 2019 at 13:23.
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 17:25
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Originally Posted by yellowtriumph View Post
I was wondering why I didn't know about this particular consultation
Probably because (like me, and like most other people) you didn't register with the web site to get emails when consultations are launched?
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Old 2nd Apr 2019, 07:57
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Here in continental European countries, these things are frequently mentioned in the press with the on-line versions having a link if you wish to take part.
There is clearly a different mindset on the mainland in that the general population takes an interest, and national governments share the information with the populace, Not so on the island!
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Old 2nd Apr 2019, 10:01
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Originally Posted by Pontius Navigator View Post
ATNotts, never having heard of EuroNews, how would the average person find out about it?

The nearest I have seen in Euro was EuroTrash on TV and the name says it all. The odd, and I mean odd, Italian TV programme simply reinforces prejudice.

It really is media bias. Maybe the BBC should have had a proper EU news slot but prefers to focus on only relevant news and disasters.
I believe Deutsche Welle TV (in English) is also available on SKY & gives good coverage of European news & affairs - & includes the UK in its features.
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