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Safety-Critical Jobs Working Longest Hours?

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Safety-Critical Jobs Working Longest Hours?

Old 24th Jan 2019, 08:16
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Safety-Critical Jobs Working Longest Hours?

Driving home a couple of nights ago, listerning to the radio, the DJ (Jo Whiley) read out a message from a listerner, a Bus Driver who’d just completed his 12 hour shift. Now, obviously, I don’t know if that means 12 hours of driving (presumably not) or includes time sitting in depos but my first thought was ‘That’s a long time to be driving a bus.’ Why is it that the average office worker would moan if asked to regularly work long, antisocial hours but people who can kill others if they f*** up, Bus Drivers, Pilots, Doctors etc, do?
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 08:32
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11.25 hour shifts on aircraft maintenance and an unspoken obligation to work on if a defective aeroplane is required for the following morning's early start. Goes with the job but I'll be *%$*#[email protected]* glad when I retire.
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 09:20
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Domestic driving rules for bus drivers are no more than 10 hours driving and a duty limit of 16 hours per day [spreadover] or 11 hours duty continuous, 10 hours rest between days which can be reduced to 8.5 hours up to three times a week and at least 24 hours off after 14 days duty. Domestic rules apply to routes less than 50km point to point and tachographs are not used. Coach drivers are normally subject to EU tachograph rules which are considerably more restrictive.

https://www.gov.uk/drivers-hours/eu-rules

Train drivers have no rules in law but have recommendations brought forward by Lord Hidden after the 1988 Clapham rail disaster. They basically say no more than 12 hours on duty, a break after 5.5 hours driving, 12 hrs rest between working days, no more than 13 consecutive days at work with at least 24 hours rest before another 13 day period can start. The 12 hr daily limit can be broken if driver and manager agree that the driver is fit to continue until a relief is available [my personal longest shift was 17.5 hrs due to the network being affected by snow].

Lots of tired drivers out there.

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Old 24th Jan 2019, 16:37
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Here in the US the rules for fire fighting pilots is 14 hour duty day, no more than 8 hours flight time per day. If we fly more than 36 hours in preceding 6 days we get the next day off. Oh and we work 12 days on, 2 days off.
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 17:00
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Originally Posted by stevef View Post
11.25 hour shifts on aircraft maintenance and an unspoken obligation to work on if a defective aeroplane is required for the following morning's early start. Goes with the job but I'll be *%$*#[email protected]* glad when I retire.
True, about the unwritten moral obligation, however, engineers were always their own worst enemy in this respect. Mention the word "overtime " and you always find somebody only too willing to oblige.

That said, in days gone by, the infamous "ghoster " shift held a special attraction for those so inclined.....until, eventually, everybody's favourite UK regulator decided enough was enough and they were ( officially at least ) no longer permitted.

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Old 24th Jan 2019, 18:46
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The 'winners' here must be junior doctors working in the NHS.

Last edited by Blues&twos; 24th Jan 2019 at 19:29.
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 23:58
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Originally Posted by stevef View Post
11.25 hour shifts on aircraft maintenance and an unspoken obligation to work on if a defective aeroplane is required for the following morning's early start. Goes with the job but I'll be *%$*#[email protected]* glad when I retire.
No it isn't. If you believe that then good luck in court when it goes wrong.
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Old 25th Jan 2019, 06:00
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Originally Posted by Blues&twos View Post
The 'winners' here must be junior doctors working in the NHS.
Not so sure, had this discussion with some friends a while back, dug out some old time sheets and could prove that during a three month period in the early eighties, I worked an average of 16 hours/day, 7 days/week for the whole period.
Safety critical? Was to us. I was first engineer on a RoRo ship on a Zebrugge/Felixstowe/Wallhamn rotation. Winter, bad weather, constantly stand by in/out of port main reasons.
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Old 25th Jan 2019, 11:36
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The length of duty isn’t even the word of it: typing this after a 13 hr duty - but it started just before my natural bedtime last night. Whacked-and not even close to max flight duty period
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Old 25th Jan 2019, 13:32
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Would it be insensitive of me to mention the EU Working Time Directive at this point?
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Old 25th Jan 2019, 13:42
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Seafarers are one of the top contenders, in my opinion and experience. I spent 5 months at sea doing 12hrs on 12hrs off or 4hrs on 8hrs off.

"In accordance with MLC 2006 the minimum hours of rest for all seafarers are: 10 hours in any 24 hour period; and. 77 hours in any 7 day period. Hours of rest may be divided into no more than 2 periods one of which shall be at least 6 hours in length."

14 hour days work with a 10 hours off duty, which can be split up into only 6hrs unbroken + 4hrs rest. Add to that it's not uncommon for a lot of seafarers to do 9 months on / 3 months off contracts, that's exhausting. How it's legal in this day and age I've no idea.
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Old 25th Jan 2019, 13:50
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I guess it all depends. The longest shift i ever did was close to 48 hours in a row as a union negotiator. Although negotiating for a full week with a maximum of 4 hours sleep a night (mostly around 2 to 3) was not nice either. None of that was safety relevant, safe for the sanity of all present. That said, 18 hour flight duty with very unpleasant weather all through it and just a 3 hours rest inbetween (legal under JAR) was probably the worst duty that can be considered safety relevant.
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Old 25th Jan 2019, 17:20
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Once had a "discussion" with an HR person about being a "poncy overpaid pilot" with huge amounts of time off. A quick calculation showed that in reality pilots got 3 days more off a year than her, but were also available to cover all public holidays. We held professional qualifications that were difficult to get and could be lost easily on a medical snag or bad simulator ride. We spent most days 8 hours at our "desk" out of a twelve hour shift when she did an 8 hour day with copious coffee breaks and time away from her office talking to her mates about Crucifixion Street or Dead Enders, and that when we were arriving at work as she went home we were looking forward to a ten hour night shift with around 7 hours flying, finishing in the middle of the night, then travel home and try to sleep while the rest of the world carried on in its' normal, noisy fashion.

As this was a helicopter company we worked in a high noise environment, dressed in an immersion suit, life jacket and other protective clothing in an environment that baked in summer, froze in winter due to the poor heating/ventilation and if we made a mistake, or a serious mechanical event took place we could be drowning in freezing salt water while she had her fourth coffee of the day. An FO was paid £5000 P.A. more than her, a captain £22, 000 more. calculate the hours worked and the actual earnings ratio swung heavily towards her. Add the responsibility for lives which the pilots and ground engineers took and we were suddenly remarkably cheap.

Now I fly a desk for 50% of the time and I'm looking forward to retirement and getting used to a "normal" clock and space to stretch when I want to, Looking back the worst shifts were on a private jet, (I've been lucky enough to fly both in my career) West Coast USA to London, minimum rest, off to Hong Kong. Not done by the airlines as far as I know, but a thoroughly knackering way to spend a couple of days at work.

SND
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Old 25th Jan 2019, 23:42
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Add to that it's not uncommon for a lot of seafarers to do 9 months on / 3 months off contracts, that's exhausting. How it's legal in this day and age I've no idea.
That's why many seafarers are from third world countries, take a cruise and most of the staff will be from Philippines/Vietnam/India/Bangladesh etc. and mixed in so that one nationality doesn't predominate in a particular area to prevent unionisation. A mix of Philippine and Indian waiters with a Chinese supervisor won't unite and start agitating for better conditions. Normally just the officers will be from a western nation.

Junior hospital doctors must be at the top of the list with their shifts involving days on duty and breaks taken when available.
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Old 26th Jan 2019, 00:00
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Regular occurance in power stations ,at least in the 70s when I was working in the uk industry to work an 8 hr afternoon shift and then do an 8 hour night shift as some bozzo had not turned in .Always a weekend!Then I start working abroad and in Algeria worked six straight weeks of 12 hr shifts followed by three weeks off!My working life has mostly been 12 hr shifts.
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Old 26th Jan 2019, 02:53
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How closely does reality follow the regulation though...
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Old 26th Jan 2019, 09:09
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The 'winners' here must be junior doctors working in the NHS.
It's not just "junior" doctors; my daughter, a Consultant anaesthetist in a large teaching hospital, regularly works for 12 hours without a break except 10 minutes for a coffee between operations. She then has to push huge amounts of paperwork in her own time. That leaves just enough time to update on various publications, and to move forward some ground-breaking research she's involved with. Most, perhaps all, of the additional pay she gets as a Consultant is burned on child care. Her husband is also a Consultant and does the same in his field.

When she's doing her proper job, ie anaesthetising, she can kill the patient simply by mis-reading 10mg as 100mg. Her colleagues around the table are equally as tired as she is; there is no "error capture" system.

To say that the NHS is already understaffed is to put it mildly. And now, thanks to efforts of the 37% of eligible voters in 2016 who were/are mentally incapable of working out that leaving the EU may not be a very bright idea, skilled staff at all levels are quitting to go back home before they are forced to.
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Old 26th Jan 2019, 10:42
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Originally Posted by old,not bold View Post
skilled staff at all levels are quitting to go back home before they are forced to.
Show me anywhere where it says that as a policy or retract it.

You would be better using your time investigating the drugs supply scandal that is being operated by Big Pharma RIGHT NOW.
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Old 30th Jan 2019, 15:03
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Wow!
Head biting contribution, or just a troll?
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Old 30th Jan 2019, 21:40
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As a Printer for a Contract Newspaper firm in the UK we regularly worked from 1300 to 0300. Sometimes, if things went wrong or we had a special to run we did 1300 to 0700.
On one occasion due to a major power failure which our generators could not cope with I did a 0700 to 2000 shift, others on the crew did a 24hr. After any and all of these I had to drive the thirty miles home, come rain, snow or shine.
One time I had to drive to work for a night shift in heavy snow when I could not ever see the front of my Fiesta, no choice as my shift manager was in the back of the car !
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