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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

Old 24th Jul 2019, 12:03
  #9121 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: In the circuit
Posts: 177
Originally Posted by Gertrude the Wombat View Post
It'll be to rejoin, sooner or later. Yes that means the Euro, and Schegen, and no opt-outs, and no rebates, but we have the #brexshitters to thank for that - we'd rather just stay as we are. But any such policy can only be delivered by an overall majority government - in any other scenario we'd have to take what we could get.
Or maybe that manifesto is not a winnable proposition in election terms.
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 12:32
  #9122 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: UK
Age: 55
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As a pro EU remain voting constituent I would be very hard pressed to approve a return to the EU if we had to adopt Schengen/Euro etc.

If we actually leave, then we will be out for good. Whether that is a good or bad thing remains to be seen.
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 12:34
  #9123 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Clarty Waters, UK
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Originally Posted by TURIN View Post
As a pro EU remain voting constituent I would be very hard pressed to approve a return to the EU if we had to adopt Schengen/Euro etc.

If we actually leave, then we will be out for good. Whether that is a good or bad thing remains to be seen.
However hard it's been getting out, getting back in will be even harder.
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 13:12
  #9124 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Andy_S View Post
However hard it's been getting out, getting back in will be even harder.
As has been pointed out several times, there is no absolute commitment for EU members to join the euro, only an undertaking to do so when considered appropriate. Which may be never, as demonstrated by Poland.

However we would not regain the current favourable conditions that will be thrown away by Brexit.

It won't happen. Once we have 'taken back control' and handed it over to the US there will be no way back.
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 13:35
  #9125 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Florida
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It won't happen. Once we have 'taken back control' and handed it over to the US there will be no way back.
fear not, everything will be fine if you behave yourselves and don't sas us back. Meanwhile we have some useful work for you to managed our money as long as you don't sample it.
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 16:13
  #9126 (permalink)  
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
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If the LibDems killed off the PeoplesVote campaign by saying they wouldn’t accept another leave result, then the Greens have driven a stake through its heart but saying the same thing.

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Old 24th Jul 2019, 16:18
  #9127 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Surrey, UK.
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Originally Posted by ORAC
If the LibDems killed off the PeoplesVote campaign...
How can you kill something already dead? As usual, all the dimmers are doing is saying as "news" something which has a) already happened, and b) out of their control in any event.

Laughable really.

Hurrah for Boris
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 16:43
  #9128 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: UK
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
If the LibDems killed off the PeoplesVote campaign by saying they wouldn’t accept another leave result, then the Greens have driven a stake through its heart but saying the same thing.

https://twitter.com/montie/status/11...565606912?s=21
Are you suggesting that if there were a referendum regarding the existence of God, and that in that referendum a majority voted for there being no God, then a churchman, or any other believer who continued to maintain there was a God is undemocratic. The result of a referendum does not confer on the majority the right to decide how the minority thinks - or perhaps that is what Brexiteers truly believe. In which case democracy effectively died on 24th June 2016.

If Jo Swinson or Caroline Lucas wish to continue fight for the UK to be a member of the EU that is their prerogative. If, through new referendum on Johnson's final deal (or no deal) the majority vote to go, then go we should, the following day, if the that was practical. We would know what we were voting for or against. I would still be with Swinson, Lucas and anyone else who believes that decision be a bad one, and would, until I am in my box, lobby to rejoin unless and until it can be proven I (and others are wrong) and that those sunny uplands are reached and we are clearly better off outside the EU. I don't expect that to happen in the time I likely have left on my mortal coil.
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 16:50
  #9129 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Yorkshire
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Originally Posted by ATNotts View Post
... I don't expect that to happen in the time I likely have left on my mortal coil.
Would that be based on fact or your opinion? Sort of puts you in the position of those churchmen that you mentioned earlier?
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 16:58
  #9130 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
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Originally Posted by Sallyann1234 View Post
As has been pointed out several times, there is no absolute commitment for EU members to join the euro, only an undertaking to do so when considered appropriate. Which may be never, as demonstrated by Poland.

However we would not regain the current favourable conditions that will be thrown away by Brexit.
I've no doubt that the EU would take us back. I was thinking more in terms of domestic resistance. Especially if the terms on offer aren't as good and the cost of the subscription increases.
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 17:11
  #9131 (permalink)  
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
 
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Penny Mordaunt gone, Liam Fox, Chris Grayling gone.

Thats plus all the ones who already resigned such as Hammond, Clarke, Livingston, Gauke etc.
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 17:20
  #9132 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Manchester, England
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
Penny Mordaunt gone, Liam Fox, Chris Grayling gone.

Thats plus all the ones who already resigned such as Hammond, Clarke, Livingston, Gauke etc.
Point of order - Clark was sacked, he didn’t resign.

If Failing Grayling was running to form he probably went in intending to ask to stay put, but asked to leave by mistake (it’s reported he left at his own request).
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 17:48
  #9133 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Cambridge, England, EU
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
If the LibDems killed off the PeoplesVote campaign by saying they wouldn’t accept another leave result, then the Greens have driven a stake through its heart but saying the same thing.
WTF is wrong with people?

I don't "accept" the result of any election in which my side didn't win.

I immediately start campaigning for it to be overturned next time.

This is normal. This is called "politics". This is called "democracy".
Gertrude the Wombat is offline  
Old 24th Jul 2019, 17:53
  #9134 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: South East England
Posts: 304
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.

17:25: Karen Bradley sacked as Northern Ireland Secretary. Brad-leave…

17:24: James Brokenshire
as Communities Secretary. Broken-fired…

17:17: Caroline Nokes sacked as Immigration Minister. That’s all, Nokes…

17:16: Damian Hinds
as Education Secretary. Hinds unwinds…

17:11: Chris Grayling quits as Transport Secretary. Grayling bailing…

17:00: Liam Fox
as International Trade Secretary. Out-Foxed…

16:59: Greg Clark
as Business Secretary. Clark parked…

16:44: Penny Mordaunt
as Defence Secretary. Penny drops…

23/7: Mark Spencer appointed Chief Whip. Off the Mark…

Earlier: Hammond, Stewart and Gauke pre-emptively announce resignations.
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 18:13
  #9135 (permalink)  
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
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Posts: 10,826
Jeremy Hunt gone as well - no prize for second place.
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 20:22
  #9136 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: cheshire
Posts: 227
Cool, having a bit of a clear out then. Getting shot of grayling is an important first step in the death of HS2, hopefully. Some of the names I didn't even recognise which probably speaks volumes.

As for the dimmers on here, and in Westminster, still banging on about PV and revoking A50, please, give it a rest and just let us all move on... Sure as eggs are eggs, if it does turn out to be the $hitshow you all hope for then we'll be back in within a decade.
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 21:41
  #9137 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: west of the tamar
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Whatever your views on Brexit, expressing the desire to crash the UK train before the driver has started the engine is the sort of negativity that has held this Country back. If in a few months Boris and the new cabinet have failed to deliver then by all means give them the flack they deserve, vote them out because for sure you will have that chance if that is the way it goes. Until then why don't we all show a little optimism and take the can do route.
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 21:51
  #9138 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 132
Originally Posted by GROUNDHOG View Post
... Until then why don't we all show a little optimism and take the can do route.
Optimism? Optimism??!! Wash your mouth out young man!! There appears to be a rule on this Thread where such words are inappropriate. Only grumbling Eeyores are allowed to post here.
NoelEvans is offline  
Old 24th Jul 2019, 22:05
  #9139 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: England
Posts: 356
Unfortunately a country cannot exist on optimism, much though Boris would like you to believe his flowery prose.
The country depends on confidence in policies and sound government, I await to be convinced.
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Old 24th Jul 2019, 22:21
  #9140 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: cheshire
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Originally Posted by Sallyann1234 View Post
Unfortunately a country cannot exist on optimism, much though Boris would like you to believe his flowery prose.
The country depends on confidence in policies and sound government, I await to be convinced.
Sure Sallyann, but we dont know yet if there is substance or not...

And surely nothing could be worse than the ineptitude of the May government? Apart from Corbyn or the LibDims of course!
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