Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > PPRuNe Social > Jet Blast
Reload this Page >

UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

Jet Blast Topics that don't fit the other forums. Rules of Engagement apply.

UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

Old 21st Mar 2019, 07:35
  #6521 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 1,878
“That only she can lead...”. Who then? Genuine question -she’s not my favourite either. Remember “lend me your vote”: Did anyone? Corbyn? He has pursued a GE with no real indication of what Brexit he’d pursue even if he won. He would have “won” last weeks commons second-referendum vote had he not ordered his MPs to abstain. Can anyone say, even now, what his policy is?
ShotOne is offline  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 07:36
  #6522 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Sunny Sussex
Posts: 778
Your turn to misunderstand me, Orac. Whether or not this Terminator of a prime minister gets her way or not, we face years of negotiations with the EU and the rest of the world after March, June or 2021 or wherever this withdrawal farrago ends up. We are currently a million miles from the end of Brexit & I doubt it will be concluded in the next decade never mind the next week.
Parapunter is offline  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 07:51
  #6523 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Cambridge, England, EU
Posts: 3,398
Here is the reaction of "the people" to May telling us what we should be thinking

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/241584
Gertrude the Wombat is offline  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 07:58
  #6524 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Near the coast
Posts: 1,515
GtW

What you are experiencing with that petition is classic confirmation bias.

If all of your remain voting friends think we should revoke article 50 that is hardly surprising.

If 18 million people sign that survey then fair enough, I will start to believe that it is the will of the people to remain.

BV
Bob Viking is online now  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 08:21
  #6525 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: England
Posts: 29
Originally Posted by Curious Pax View Post
So, May makes an supposedly important address to the nation. And says - not my fault guv, it’s them MPs and the Speaker who won’t do what I tell them. As unimpressive leadership as ever.
This the kind of stuff her soon to be trading partner in the USA is better at. Maybe she is now taking his advice. Let's just hope she doesn't start tweeting her Brexit demands as well.
Grayfly is offline  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 08:22
  #6526 (permalink)  
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 76
Posts: 16,534
Originally Posted by Gertrude the Wombat View Post
Only if you vote for them.
Do we have a choice?

You only need one vote more to be first past the post. Only if we have 'none of the above' as an option and a minimum level of voting for an individual - 50% of those voting - would we have better a choice.
Pontius Navigator is online now  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 08:30
  #6527 (permalink)  
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 76
Posts: 16,534
Originally Posted by Bob Viking View Post
What you are experiencing with that petition is classic confirmation bias.

If all of your remain voting friends think we should revoke article 50 that is hardly surprising.

If 18 million people sign that survey then fair enough, I will start to believe that it is the will of the people to remain.

BV
Bob, you obviously looked at the petition, did you look at the map? Initially is appears as you might expect. Then you realise the hotspot is Gertishire. Clearly if you live in that hotspot you will indeed think that is the WOTP.
Pontius Navigator is online now  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 08:33
  #6528 (permalink)  
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 76
Posts: 16,534
Originally Posted by Parapunter View Post
.Brexit & I doubt it will be concluded in the next decade never mind the next week .
Never a truer word.
Pontius Navigator is online now  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 08:51
  #6529 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,233
What you are experiencing with that petition is classic confirmation bias.
I'm not sure where confirmation bias comes in to it BV...

The petition notes:

The government repeatedly claims exiting the EU is 'the will of the people'. We need to put a stop to this claim by proving the strength of public support now, for remaining in the EU
Yes, the majority of those who voted in the Referendum voted leave.

or, putting it another way 17.4 million of the British electorate voted leave....

I for one would appreciate it if the phrase used by TM and other politicians was e.g. "exiting the EU is the will of a large number of the British people, but not all"....it would actually make life a bit easier for some of us..
wiggy is online now  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 08:55
  #6530 (permalink)  
Thought police antagonist
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Where I always have been...firmly in the real world
Posts: 911
You do wonder if she's been consulting Sir Alex as to how to get a result by going into extra time.....and watching Wenger for how to blame everybody else but herself techniques
Krystal n chips is online now  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 08:58
  #6531 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Lincoln
Age: 67
Posts: 453
Rough figures show approximately 45 million people eligible to vote, so just over 1% of the voting population sign another petition to Revoke Article 50 and that is going to make the Westminster shower take note, and the map patterns of those signing the petition won’t change that either, I have no doubt this one will get the same response as the other previous petitions on the subject have, despite more people signing this latest one:
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/239706
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/223729
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/224908
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/202629

In all fairness, with Westminster's prevalence for flip flopping on decisions it would not surprise me if they did change their minds, as it stands now IAW Article 50 we have turned down the only deal, so at this moment in time there is only one option legally in place and that is a default exit, if the deal does go for another vote and is voted down again, that still legally only leaves a default exit, to avoid that they are going to have to throw all their previous decisions, both in response to petitions and votes in the HoCs, out of the window and start again and that would make their performance to date seem good by comparison.

Last edited by Exrigger; 21st Mar 2019 at 09:12.
Exrigger is offline  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 09:02
  #6532 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Near the coast
Posts: 1,515
Wiggy

When I use the term confirmation bias I mean that all we hear is remainers stating ‘it is the will of the people’ to remain in the EU.

Those people are subject to confirmation bias if all they do is mix and converse with people whose stated aim is to remain.

I agree that maybe the politicians should state that it is the will of the majority of people to leave.

Lets remember that every time we have an election, almost (or even more than) half the people don’t get the government they voted for. Does that mean we have to whinge about it for the next five years and say it isn’t fair?!

BV

Last edited by Bob Viking; 21st Mar 2019 at 09:32.
Bob Viking is online now  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 09:05
  #6533 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Sunny Sussex
Posts: 778
Originally Posted by wiggy View Post

But I for one would appreciate it if the phrase used by TM and other politicians was e.g. "exiting the EU is the will of a large number of the British people, but not all"....
I would caveat that by adding in June 2016.

Although I cannot possibly prove it one way or the other, it would take a zealot of the highest order to insist there can have been no movement in either direction in the intervening two & a half years, in light of a vastly improved comprehension of how Europe operates, of how the government has bungled everything, of how the man in the street, who may well not be the handful of politicos that bother with this sort of thing but let's say the man on the Clapham omnibus, who if you'd told him in 2016 that by this year he would possess a working knowledge of WTO regulations, would not have believed you.

We may well not get to test that idea yet we are witnessing a national humiliation where 'taking back control' has ultimately placed our national fate in the hands of the European Union. A government that has lost authority, squandered goodwill & now abdicated responsibility will have lefty a mark on the people. But it's not listening, not to us, not to anyone.
Parapunter is offline  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 09:08
  #6534 (permalink)  
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 76
Posts: 16,534
What we need is some brave leaver to post a counter petition.
Pontius Navigator is online now  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 09:14
  #6535 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,233
BV

OK thanks, see what you mean.

PN..

A "leaver" petition (something along the lines of parliament must respect the "will of the people") was started about 5 months back and I think had "hung" at about 300K but funnily enough started to move again last night...

Looks like the new petition's site has just crashed (getting a bad gateway message at 0910 UTC)....overloaded? or displaying an inconvenient trend?

Wonder when the claims about Russian interference will start??
wiggy is online now  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 09:16
  #6536 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Sunny Sussex
Posts: 778
Originally Posted by Pontius Navigator View Post
What we need is some brave leaver to post a counter petition.
I did try to find one but the petitions website appears to have cancelled itself in sympathy.
Parapunter is offline  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 09:21
  #6537 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Lincoln
Age: 67
Posts: 453
There was at least one of those I posted was a leave one, but as has been pointed out the petition site seems to keep crashing, not that it makes any difference, unless one is into conspiracy theories.
Exrigger is offline  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 09:35
  #6538 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Currently within the EU
Posts: 315
Originally Posted by Parapunter View Post
We may well not get to test that idea yet we are witnessing a national humiliation where 'taking back control' has ultimately placed our national fate in the hands of the European Union.
Yes there is a certain irony. We've made such a mess of taking back control that at the very last minute our PM has had to go back to Brussels to get her instructions on how to do it.

And then we must go about getting our new instructions from the US. Our next PM will be earning a few air miles from that.
Sallyann1234 is online now  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 09:42
  #6539 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Southwold
Age: 67
Posts: 58
Originally Posted by Krystal n chips View Post
You do wonder if she's been consulting Sir Alex as to how to get a result by going into extra time.....and watching Wenger for how to blame everybody else but herself techniques
.

Bet she doesn't get an invite to the Pizza Club!
Effluent Man is offline  
Old 21st Mar 2019, 10:01
  #6540 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Southwold
Age: 67
Posts: 58
Last night saw the best example of synchronised stupidity ever. May tried to blame all her travails on parliament whilst Jezza stormed out of a meeting because he didn't like Umunna being invited. This epitomises more than anything the reason why we are in the current state of political paralysis. The people at the top are stupid!
Effluent Man is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.