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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

Old 31st Jan 2019, 20:54
  #3861 (permalink)  
 
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Read the post. A general election would filter out extremists in the Tory party. This is no time for complacency. The May/Corbyn power summit resulted in the goverment offering to shake the magic money tree for Labour constituencies ... provided they are vote leave areas.

How about that for Alternative Arrangemets.

That is not corruption. It is criminal behaviour.
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Old 31st Jan 2019, 21:06
  #3862 (permalink)  
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Why does the thought that sfm818 is a RussiN troll float to the top of my mind?....
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Old 31st Jan 2019, 21:34
  #3863 (permalink)  
 
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Get a GRIP!
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Old 1st Feb 2019, 00:09
  #3864 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Mac the Knife View Post
Yes, when this STOPS being a little Gedankenerfahrung it is going to be uncomfortable for people in the EU and remarkably painful for people in the UK {except the really wealthy naturally}.
Thanks to the self-serving machinations of Dominic Cummings, Boris Johnson, the odious Farage, Corbyn, that fool Cameron, Paul Dacre, Matthew Elliott, Daniel Hannan and a few others.
Never a thought for the real hard consequences for the man on the Clapham omnibus, just faffling and posturing without any belief that it really could happen - playing with fire and people's lives.

I never thought I'd see the day when HMG would do so much damage to the UK, the EU and all the other little dominoes that nobody's mentioned.
Even if Article 50 was withdrawn tomorrow, EU would never trust us again and who can blame them? As Thomas Wolfe said, 'You Can't Go Home Again.'
Right now the best of all possible Deals (which we will not get) will leave us perpetually pleading on the periphery while the big boys get on with it.

A very sad and worried Mac
Well, Mac, it probably is fair to say that nearly all of us are sad and worried.

Perhaps the greatest sadness is that none of this had to happen. The lack of direction and leadership of the hopeless Maybot and her sycophantic cohorts has caused a vacuum into which all manner of opposing views and aspirations have been drawn to unsettle a normally placid nation and allow an acrimonious and damaging dissent. There has been no need for the Remain against Leave antagonism - indeed these two factions are wasting emotional energy in engaging in this internecine confrontation when the real enemy against whom they should pit their combined strength is the two Houses of Parliament. As an aside, I find it curious that Caroline Spelman's amendment was carried by a majority smaller than that enjoyed by the referendum result, yet there has been unquestioned acceptance of this.

There seems to be a widespread view that our society is decadent and effete; we are in a sort of fin de siecle time warp and the mores which have sustained society for so long are being discarded. There is a loss of respect for and confidence in our institutions - that the system is broken and the world is falling about our ears while the pathologically self-absorbed in Westminster continue to oil the hinges of their revolving door. Could this decadence offer a better example of its existence than the abominable Nick Clegg? Clegg's astonishing passage from failed politician to mega-rich apologist for a company he once claimed to hate seems to typify the type which pretends to represent us in Parliament. He petulantly stormed out of the Commons because the Speaker refused to call a Lib-Dem amendment demanding the national referendum contained in his party's manifesto. Subsequently, the twerp was booted out of domestic politics. Clegg then sought to reinvent himself as a lobbyist seeking to persuade Brussels to delay the outcome of the referendum he was so keen to promote only a few months before. That got him nowhere. When in office, he roundly condemned Mark Zuckerberg and all his works but after another minute of a rate 1 turn and having abandoned his Remainer chums, the former Deputy PM emerges once again, this time as an apologist for, yes you guessed it, Facebook where he is a vice-president with emolument sufficient to buy a £7 million house. As a reward for failure, this must take the biscuit - the hypocrisy of it all is sick-making. Perhaps he has the slimy Blair as a role model.

Another example of the moral probity of the HoC's finest is the (still serving) member for Peterborough, determined to conduct her representation of the people from prison. How can this possibly be? However, in deference to the easily-bruised sensibilities of the right-on PC adherents of this thread, I shall make no comment other than that I prophesied in an earlier post that it was guaranteed that she would be sentenced to less than 12 months.

I was born into the British Empire which must make me a rabid, jingoistic fascist and selfish bed-blocker at the very least, but witnessing the decline of my country over the last 70 years has been heartbreaking. So much of this has arisen from political self-harm. It was as a reflection of this that I posted Auden's "Epitaph". Under the lamentable oversight of the Maybot, this dreadful Parliament and the breathtaking self-satisfaction of the political elite, this process continues apace. Of course, such sentiments are frightfully unfashionable and not to be tolerated by the non-platforming, inclusivity addicted hiding in their safe spaces and who have contributed nothing to their claimed entitlement.

I expect torrents from the usual suspects.

Last edited by Gipsy Queen; 12th Feb 2019 at 17:26.
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Old 1st Feb 2019, 06:49
  #3865 (permalink)  
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Women of the House

POLITICO:

“Sky News’ Tamara Cohen has spoken to Tulip Siddiq, the Labour MP who delayed her caesarian to vote in a crucial Brexit division, about reforms to the way MPs vote this week. Siddiq said having a female prime minister had helped drive the proxy voting change, which allows MPs on maternity and paternity leave to have a proxy vote. Siddiq lamented the 13 years Labour was in government when change didn’t happen. “We now have a lot more women, and women at senior levels, so it has make a big difference having Theresa May as prime minister, Andrea Leadsom as leader of the house, Harriet Harman as mother of the house, Valerie Vaz as shadow leader of the house,” she told Cohen.........


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Old 1st Feb 2019, 07:15
  #3866 (permalink)  
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Excellent article. I5 helps 3xplain why the repeated economic arguments have failed to shift the vast majority of Brexit voters, particularly northern Labour voters, from their view.

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...-class-leavers
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Old 1st Feb 2019, 07:16
  #3867 (permalink)  
 
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https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...decade-economy

https://www.theguardian.com/business...on-its-germany

[color=left=#121212]To make matters worse for Germany, the global economy is also slowing, making it harder for companies to pick up new export orders. Protectionism is not helping either. Donald Trump sees China as his No1 trade target, but Germany – with its colossal current account surplus – comes a close second.[/color]

[color=left=#121212]All of which brings a slightly different perspective to Britain’s debate about Brexit, which currently seems to be based on three key propositions: that continental Europe is thriving; that Europe’s politicians will come under no pressure to cut a deal from their big companies; and that Britain is well adrift at the bottom of Europe’s economic league table. All three are false.[/color]
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Old 1st Feb 2019, 07:49
  #3868 (permalink)  
 
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It might be worth being aware that Larry Elliot (the author of the second Guardian piece re Germany) has been the Guardian’s pet Brexiter economist for some time....


That doesn’t mean he is wrong, it doesn’t mean he is right, but also it doesn’t mean the Guardian has had a change of heart or editorial policy re Brexit either.
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Old 1st Feb 2019, 08:09
  #3869 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by wiggy View Post
It might be worth being aware that Larry Elliot (the author of the second Guardian piece re Germany) has been the Guardian’s pet Brexiter economist for some time....


That doesn’t mean he is wrong, it doesn’t mean he is right, but also it doesn’t mean the Guardian has had a change of heart or editorial policy re Brexit either.
I was not implying anything, and you are right most views/opinions on the subject in here can be considered in the same vein, although had I posted that article from the Daily Mail, or similar rag, it would most certainly be derided as being leave fake news or similar
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Old 1st Feb 2019, 08:10
  #3870 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Gipsy Queen View Post

the real enemy against whom they should pit their combined strength is the two Houses of Parliament.

There seems to be a widespread view that our society is decadent and effete;

I was born into the British Empire which must make me a rabid, jingoistic fascist and selfish bed-blocker at the very least,

I expect torrents from the usual suspects.
I've picked the greatest breathtaking zingers from that ranticular multi salvo.

So you should. An authoritarian streak a mile wide is something your forebears fought in the war to rid the world of. The same war you didn't experience by the way, just as you didn't experience the empire.

I find it so bizarre the regularity with which leavers bring up bygone eras as a form of legislated nostalgia for memories none of you actually possess and go on, as in your perfect example to pine for the same sort of fascistic governance. The House of commons is the real enemy. Really? You wrote that out in public?? For shame.

And if you must invoke Auden, then you should have acknowledged the first line of Epitaph and the undermining clause of 'of a kind' - 'Perfection, of a kind was what he was after'. It points to an unrealistic dream. Fitting.
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Old 1st Feb 2019, 08:50
  #3871 (permalink)  
 
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I'm not sure whether to be amused or sad that the one group of MPs who are doing their best to carry out what the electorate voted for are derided as fanatics.

Meanwhile Streatham Labour party has been taken over by Momentum last night. so they can deselect Chuka Umunna and install a communist Corbynite. That worries me more than Brexit.

Last edited by Fitter2; 1st Feb 2019 at 09:12.
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Old 1st Feb 2019, 08:58
  #3872 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
Excellent article. I5 helps 3xplain why the repeated economic arguments have failed to shift the vast majority of Brexit voters, particularly northern Labour voters, from their view.

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...-class-leavers
Northern Powerhouse and all that...
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Old 1st Feb 2019, 08:59
  #3873 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Parapunter View Post
I've picked the greatest breathtaking zingers from that ranticular multi salvo.

So you should. An authoritarian streak a mile wide is something your forebears fought in the war to rid the world of. The same war you didn't experience by the way, just as you didn't experience the empire.

I find it so bizarre the regularity with which leavers bring up bygone eras as a form of legislated nostalgia for memories none of you actually possess and go on, as in your perfect example to pine for the same sort of fascistic governance. The House of commons is the real enemy. Really? You wrote that out in public?? For shame.

And if you must invoke Auden, then you should have acknowledged the first line of Epitaph and the undermining clause of 'of a kind' - 'Perfection, of a kind was what he was after'. It points to an unrealistic dream. Fitting.
Isn't it time for your morning meds?
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Old 1st Feb 2019, 09:27
  #3874 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by weemonkey View Post
Isn't it time for your morning meds?
This is amusing.
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Old 1st Feb 2019, 09:59
  #3875 (permalink)  
 
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I know it's Jetblast, but play nicely chaps.

And in further Brexit horror news,
New data published by the Higher Education Statistics Agency has revealed that numbers of both EU and Non-EU students attending British universities have risen again, despite Brexit. In 2017/18, 458,490 international students a rise of 16,000 from the year before, and a rise of 20,000 from the year of the referendum.
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Old 1st Feb 2019, 10:11
  #3876 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Fitter2 View Post
I know it's Jetblast, but play nicely chaps.
Only one correspondent attempting an insult in the previous two posts, as they do repeatedly. It IS amusing, though, they think it lands whereas in fact it rebounds every time, quite simply, they can't grasp that.
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Old 1st Feb 2019, 10:12
  #3877 (permalink)  
 
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That is hardly surprising as starting degree courses until 2019 was the last chance for EU students to benefit from their EU citizenship status in the UK, i.e. paying much lower tuition fees:

https://www.bbc.com/news/education-44676843

The real benchmark are the 2020 figures.
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Old 1st Feb 2019, 10:53
  #3878 (permalink)  
 
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An interesting perspective reported in some papers today. Could this be the kernel of a sensible solution?

https://www.fxstreet.com/news/brexit...y-201901311135

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Old 1st Feb 2019, 11:46
  #3879 (permalink)  
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More of their comments reported in the Telegraph...

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business...-euideologues/

group of top German economists has told the EU to tear up the Irish backstop and ditch its ideological demands in Brexit talks, calling instead for a flexible Europe of concentric circles that preserves friendly ties with the UK. Brussels must “abandon its indivisibility dogma” on the EU’s four freedoms and come up with a creative formula or risk a disastrous showdown with London that could all too easily spin out of control.

A joint report by the influential Ifo Institute and universities across Germany and Europe warned that Brussels may be deluding itself in thinking that the EU has the upper hand in all respects or that the British will inevitably capitulate before March 29.

“In a standard game of chicken, the actor who loses the most will dodge first. Can the EU really be sure that losses are sufficiently asymmetrically distributed that it ‘wins’ this game?” the report asked. “This is a very dangerous game, both for the UK and for EU. It is wiser to take the threat of a hard Brexit at face value and react accordingly. Recognising that a hard Brexit is in no one’s interest and that it would cause irreparable political as well as economic damage, we call both on the UK government and the EU Commission to rethink their ‘red lines’ and return to the negotiation table,” it said.

The report implicitly rebuked the European Commission for mishandling its negotiations with Britain and for trying to use the legal advantage of the Article 50 process to dictate a harsh settlement, with little regard for long-term strategic and diplomatic interests. “Since 2000, the United Kingdom paid a net contribution to the EU budget of €76bn. One may argue that this fact alone merits a fair treatment of the second-largest European economy,” it said......

The report is led by Clemens Fuest and Gabriel Felbermayr from the Ifo in Munich but includes the chairmen of the advisory boards of both the German finance and economics ministries. It proposes a new supranational trade body in which the EU and Britain both are members with full voting rights. It would cover goods but exclude services, intellectual property, foreign investment, or social areas such as health........ Both sides would be joining a new entity, dubbed the "European Customs Association’". The authors suggested that the European Court might be the final arbiter but accepted that disputes could equally be resolved by a bilateral tribunal - akin to the EFTA court - if this was unpalatable to Parliament.

Such a customs association would amount to a revolution in EU affairs. Brussels would be giving up a degree of control over an area that is already part of the EU acquis. This would go against the teleological thrust of an ever more integrated superstate structure that has prevailed for half a century. The EU’s trade officials are the shock troops of the European Project.

The plan is unlikely to be accepted, but is indicative of the shifting mood in senior policy circles in Germany. There is a growing sense that the EU has been captured by an ideological priesthood. It is failing to adapt to the realities of a complex Europe that is pulling in different directions and must be managed with supple statecraft.

“We have two visions over what Europe is going to look like in the future and they are in conflict. This is what Brexit is all about,” said Prof Felbermayr, the lead author. “I am very angry about what has happened. Everybody in Europe is pointing the finger at London and blaming Theresa May, but nobody has been questioning whether Brussels has been doing the right thing,” he said.

“From the German point of view we need Britain as hedge against countries with protectionist instincts like France and Italy. The British are closer to our liberal free-market tradition. We also need Britain in this customs association because it makes Europe’s GDP 20pc larger and gives us more bargaining power with China, India, and the US.”

Growing dissent in Germany also reflects worries that a no-deal Brexit could lead to a serious economic shock and crystallise the eurozone’s long-festering problems, starting with a pan-eurozone banking crisis and a fresh Italian debt drama.........

The Ifo-led report said the EU must stop trying to shoehorn Britain into a customs territory where it is reduced to a rule-taker with no say. This is unworkable over time. It will lead to friction and must break down in acrimony. “If it is going to have any credibility, it must offer mutual benefits,” said Prof Felbermayr. The EU’s current plan replicates the failed "Turkey model". Ankara has to accept tariff reductions whenever the EU does trade deals with other countries or blocs, but does not secure automatic reciprocation from these countries. “It is a colonial relationship and Britain would be in the same position,” he said.

The report said the EU needs a profound shake-up. Its habit of imposing a ‘one-size-fits-all’ integrationist regime on reluctant countries must be challenged. “In the long run, the current model may be inherently unstable,” it said. Europe’s tut-tutting over cherry-picking or "cakeism" evades the core issue. If countries are not allowed to participate in the European economy on a partial footing, they will seek allies elsewhere and gravitate to hostile camps. “It is a question of economic self-interest. Putting obstacles is irrational and strategically unwise,” said the report.

The authors said the EU doctrine of the four indivisible freedoms - goods, services, capital and labour – is dogma with no grounding in economic science. Under the standard Heckscher-Ohlin and Mundell trade models, free movement is necessary only for currency unions......









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Old 1st Feb 2019, 13:18
  #3880 (permalink)  
 
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Well worth reading, in full.
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