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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

Old 3rd Jan 2019, 08:46
  #2261 (permalink)  
 
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they are not getting credit from the government they are getting it through normal means, all it means now when they go in with thier business plan they have a valid contract with a source of income. It costing the UK tax payer nothing. And if its a success then the contract gets paid as in any other public contract and jobs are created in the UK.

And actually the airline example happens quiet frequently especially with PSO contracts and mail contracts. Then there is a mad rush of phone calls to get conny's in to train and fly the aircraft when they turn up.. Last one I was contacted for was the SAS ATR contract in Sweden under the flybe AOC.

The company that got the contract had zero aircraft zero crew, no AOC Within 3 months they started.

Engineering wise its quite common to sign a contract with a supplier that's not got current capacity to fulfil the order with a long lead time so they can gear up. Contract signed, they then go to the bank show the business plan, show that they have the costs of the install period covered and can service the debt for a period and the bank says good luck here is the cash.

calmac is a bit screwed at the moment they have several boats with issues, and the two new boats have just been delayed and the capacity is having to be reduced below 1000 pax due to something to do with the bogs.

Most calmac boats can't fit 40 cars in them never mind 40 lorries.

And you won't be getting me on a front drop ramp loading boat going Ramsgate Ostend. It was bad enough in a Mil landing craft and that took 16 hours of vomiting hell to get across the channel just because some tosser wanted to re-enact D day. . It takes 2 hours in one of them to get across Scapa Flow to get to the museum. I would be extremely surprised if they were legal to be used on the open sea for transporting pax. To my knowledge they are only used in Scapa which is classed as a harbour not open water. And they have limited sea states they can operate in. The ferries will be cancelled in the flow but the dive boats will still be dropping people onto the scapa wrecks.

Everyone things of the lord of the Isles operating in ruff conditions

It can only take something like 500 pax and 50 odd cars. a lorry takes 5-6 car spaces.
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 08:56
  #2262 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tescoapp View Post
If they don't do anything then they get nothing.
I wouldn't sign a contract like that!!!

If I'd spent 100k putting in a bid (modest estimate that, surely), and I had to put in five bids for each actual contract I won (modest estimate again) then I'd need at least 500k up front before I did any work, even if I were never eventually called upon to do any work, just to cover the cost of bidding for the contract.
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 08:59
  #2263 (permalink)  
 
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Dancing on the head of a pin to justify an absurd position is a very commonly observed phenomenon with Brexiteers. What we have here is a gale of incredulity at Her majesty's guv slapping a chunky contract on a firm with a p.o. box in London & sweet fanny all else and the usual queue of the usual ideologically wedded types coming up with all sorts of reasons of how this is fine, nothing to see here.

With regret, it is my solemn duty to inform you there is plenty to see here. Eyebrows have been raised far and wide for very good reasons & no matter how many time you repeat your insistences that Seaborne Freight (UK) Ltd (Est. 2017) have got this one nailed, it doesn't make it any more credible.

And about that long lead time you mentioned...
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 09:17
  #2264 (permalink)  
 
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For Seaborne read Brexit.
Signing up for an idea without a clue how it will work.
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 09:19
  #2265 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Gertrude the Wombat View Post
I wouldn't sign a contract like that!!!

If I'd spent 100k putting in a bid (modest estimate that, surely), and I had to put in five bids for each actual contract I won (modest estimate again) then I'd need at least 500k up front before I did any work, even if I were never eventually called upon to do any work, just to cover the cost of bidding for the contract.
That might account for the 360k that is showed as owing on their balance sheet.
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 09:19
  #2266 (permalink)  
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Well we will soon find out - because from JC’s interview yesterday it seems he has even more interest in running down the clock than TM.

I get get the impression that his perfect world is one in which we leave the EU with no deal, then he forces a general election blaming the Conservatives and takes over able to do what he wants without EU interference, and then blaming the Conservatives again when his plans blow up in his face.
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 09:34
  #2267 (permalink)  
 
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MAybe the BBC sems sometimes biased -most overseas people I speak towho follow it do not think so but 80% of the UK press is fervently pro brexit as the Foreign owners and oldies are all pro brexit which wont affect them as they are either rich or dead . There again there are different standard, ludicrous claims over immigration and economics being the truth and any form of expert objectivity being lies.

However one paper has to tell the truth because it would never be bought otherwise and that the FT And that is objectively remain and fervently anti no deal and published a long article yesterday as to what any form of leaving is very very negative for the UK economy. And if you dont want to buy it just check out the front page in the supermarket of your choice.

As the daily of 'The City' its hard to call them traitors, enemies of the people and project fear

And after the last few months who can make a serious case that being governed by the Eu, which is not and never realy will be the case anyway except when it comes to common interest/generic issues is not much better than being governed by own own who have proven themselves incompetent, dishonest and interest in nothing but themselves and their party. And the land of Hope and Glory Tory party have after all these years emerged as the real enemy within and the party of treachery and betrayal .
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 09:45
  #2268 (permalink)  
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In the meantime......

https://order-order.com/2019/01/03/a...g-corbyn-tory/

AC Grayling (Campaign for a People’s Vote): Corbyn is a Tory supporting lickspittle and liar......
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 09:48
  #2269 (permalink)  
 
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Pax All very true, but which paper/broadcaster tells the truth is rather irrelevant
The people who have pushed Brexit from the start are very clear that they want it purely out of principle, and damn the consequences .
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 09:51
  #2270 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by pax britanica View Post
MAybe the BBC sems sometimes biased -most overseas people I speak towho follow it do not think so but 80% of the UK press is fervently pro brexit as the Foreign owners and oldies are all pro brexit which wont affect them as they are either rich or dead . There again there are different standard, ludicrous claims over immigration and economics being the truth and any form of expert objectivity being lies.

However one paper has to tell the truth because it would never be bought otherwise and that the FT And that is objectively remain and fervently anti no deal and published a long article yesterday as to what any form of leaving is very very negative for the UK economy. And if you dont want to buy it just check out the front page in the supermarket of your choice.

As the daily of 'The City' its hard to call them traitors, enemies of the people and project fear

And after the last few months who can make a serious case that being governed by the Eu, which is not and never realy will be the case anyway except when it comes to common interest/generic issues is not much better than being governed by own own who have proven themselves incompetent, dishonest and interest in nothing but themselves and their party. And the land of Hope and Glory Tory party have after all these years emerged as the real enemy within and the party of treachery and betrayal .
Hard to disagree with any of that. the rhetoric is extremely amped up on either side. The actual facts are we're putting up barriers with our closest trade partners & making life choices harder for our citizens whilst simultaneously setting the country against itself & splurging billions of pounds to make everything slightly to much worse, depending on your pov than it is now. But in any event, no better and all in pursuit of nebulous notions of nostalgic Britannia.
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 09:55
  #2271 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
I get get the impression that his perfect world is one in which we leave the EU with no deal, then he forces a general election blaming the Conservatives and takes over able to do what he wants without EU interference, and then blaming the Conservatives again when his plans blow up in his face.
Like I've been saying for two and a half years. The Trot socialist workers' paradise will of course destroy (what's left of) the economy but he'll blame this on the Tory #brexit. And he'll get away with it. And I dunno about the rest of you, but I don't qualify for an Irish passport so I'm stuck with it.
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 10:00
  #2272 (permalink)  
 
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Meanwhile, in some corner of a foreign field. That is forever England. The local constabulary has put out an appeal for riot police from "all parts of the UK".

There it is again. The assumption that 'all parts of the UK' will shake the magic money tree. If someone had been quicker off the mark they could have acquired a pair of water cannons for a bargain. Handy for putting down riots, except for July, when they might be needed to put out massive bonfires.

Timing is everything and this publicity stunt follows within days of the Home Secretary photo shoot on a border patrol vessel.
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 10:04
  #2273 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Gertrude the Wombat View Post
I dunno about the rest of you, but I don't qualify for an Irish passport so I'm stuck with it.
I do

Said before, I don't know why Corbyn is a hate figure for the right. He shows every intention of flying in the face of the people he's meant to represent to deliver the Tory party's biggest wet dream of all time. You'd think the average euro hating Tory would be showing him some love.
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 10:24
  #2274 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tescoapp View Post
I can't see what the fuss is about awarding a contract with no money up front to a new supplier.
Good point, I see no downside in using a Boaty free McBoatfree ferry operator whose terms & conditions include a clause that appears to have been copied & pasted from Deliveroo. These guys definitely, 100%, no question know what they're doing.

https://seabornefreight.com/terms
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 10:29
  #2275 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Sprogget View Post
Corbyn ... deliver the Tory party's biggest wet dream of all time
I see it the other way around - the Tories are delivering Corbyn's biggest wet dream of all time, the ending of (outgoing) freedom of movement.

Because as other attempts to create a Trot socialist workers' paradise have shown, such as North Korea, Soviet Russia, East Germany, Cuba, the workers' reaction to finding themselves in a Trot socialist workers' paradise is to try to leave. And freedom of movement makes this just too easy.

Quite why the Tories think it's a good idea to hand Labour on a plate this essential precursor to their Trot socialist workers' paradise is beyond me, though.
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 10:51
  #2276 (permalink)  
 
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I wouldn't say its anywhere near 80% pro Brexit not even 50%. Personally I consider BBC pro remain and a mouth piece of project fear.

FT has its own agenda as well don't kid yourself. The financial types do not want exit because it will cost them profits and limit their markets and increase there legal compliance load. They per say don't give a stuff about the UK or EU only how much money they can make. If they can make a quick buck with return in 6 months compared to a large buck in 10 years time they will always go for the quick buck to increase this years bonus.

Apart from anything else the FT like the other producers of economic fiction on Brexit, have so far not got a single prediction correct.

I wouldn't sign a contract like that!!!
whose terms & conditions include a clause that appears to have been copied & pasted from Deliveroo
And DHL, UPS and amazon, when I was doing delivery's 30 years ago in a white van then progressing onto 45 ton artic's its was the same conditions of transport. I wouldn't be surprised if the freight on the titanic had the same clause as well just missing the telephone number and email address.

possibly not and its your choice. I have and earned my employers loads of money doing so both taking the contract and providing the product. If they were already more than half way there anyway and had started the process with Llyods being involved its not really a huge leap of faith. Under half a mil is peanuts in these things. An airline your talking 1.5mil in just paper work and setup costs over 9 months to get a AOC. And that's not including a hanger or aircraft to fly, Just post holders and a load of manuals. As soon as the aircraft turns up for proving flights as the final stage of AoC issue your talking 10lk plus a day fixed costs with nothing moving.

In fact the government pays nothing unless the service is provided. Seems a hellva load better than all of the pervious contracts that are talked about in the media which usually result for a lot paid and still they don't get anything.
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 10:52
  #2277 (permalink)  
 
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Corbyn is clearly anti EU. Would be nice if he had the courage of his convictions though. As for the Pinko Trot socialist super gulag theory, I find it hard to credit the idea that a shambling perennial agitator with a contrarianism record as long as your arm has enough gumption about him to hang on to a bunch of second rate front benchers let alone operate some deep state conspiracy jolly designed to overturn a thousand years of open borders. It's a very telling stat that in the midst of plainly the worst Tory government in generations that has descended into a farcical bread & circuses s**tshow of ministerial fiefdoms, jockeying for position, Labour still manage to be what? five, six points behind in the polls?

No pasaran, kids - truer than ever!
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 10:57
  #2278 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by tescoapp View Post
they are not getting credit from the government they are getting it through normal means, all it means now when they go in with thier business plan they have a valid contract with a source of income. It costing the UK tax payer nothing. And if its a success then the contract gets paid as in any other public contract and jobs are created in the UK.

And actually the airline example happens quiet frequently especially with PSO contracts and mail contracts. Then there is a mad rush of phone calls to get conny's in to train and fly the aircraft when they turn up.. Last one I was contacted for was the SAS ATR contract in Sweden under the flybe AOC.

The company that got the contract had zero aircraft zero crew, no AOC Within 3 months they started.

Engineering wise its quite common to sign a contract with a supplier that's not got current capacity to fulfil the order with a long lead time so they can gear up. Contract signed, they then go to the bank show the business plan, show that they have the costs of the install period covered and can service the debt for a period and the bank says good luck here is the cash.

calmac is a bit screwed at the moment they have several boats with issues, and the two new boats have just been delayed and the capacity is having to be reduced below 1000 pax due to something to do with the bogs.

Most calmac boats can't fit 40 cars in them never mind 40 lorries.

And you won't be getting me on a front drop ramp loading boat going Ramsgate Ostend. It was bad enough in a Mil landing craft and that took 16 hours of vomiting hell to get across the channel just because some tosser wanted to re-enact D day. . It takes 2 hours in one of them to get across Scapa Flow to get to the museum. I would be extremely surprised if they were legal to be used on the open sea for transporting pax. To my knowledge they are only used in Scapa which is classed as a harbour not open water. And they have limited sea states they can operate in. The ferries will be cancelled in the flow but the dive boats will still be dropping people onto the scapa wrecks.

Everyone things of the lord of the Isles operating in ruff conditions

It can only take something like 500 pax and 50 odd cars. a lorry takes 5-6 car spaces.
Ah, the Calmac option was clearly just a shade toooo dry for you it seems.

I'm sure there's still a few Clyde Puffers around though, both preserved and working.......

As for the "instant airline ", yep, forms , works for a while, then...oops.... " and the next contender please" .....it's hardly an unknown practice.
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 11:14
  #2279 (permalink)  
 
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Don't know those G reg ATR's are still flying about in SAS colours, I don't have a clue who is running them these days.

To be honest I was just presuming that the Southern English remainers where just as utterly clueless about Scottish issues as they were about Northern Island and the current state of play over there. But to be fair I am equally clueless about the parking issues in Kent, and to be honest the whole place could go grid locked for hours at a time and I wouldn't loose any sleep over it.
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Old 3rd Jan 2019, 11:23
  #2280 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tescoapp View Post
I wouldn't say its anywhere near 80% pro Brexit not even 50%. Personally I consider BBC pro remain and a mouth piece of project fear.
You've never listed to the Today Programme then.
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