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Jamal Khashoggi....so what happened then??

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Jamal Khashoggi....so what happened then??

Old 15th Oct 2018, 22:15
  #61 (permalink)  
 
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I think it likely that the fifteen were there for abduction purposes, after all it doesn't take that many to kill a man but may take that many for a transporting operation (via a private jet), additionally the KSA although backwards I doubt would want to kill him on the premises, thought this from the start and I suspect from recent news this is what they may present and only because now they have been backed into a corner.

The fifteen no doubt will be "cut loose" and penalised (even though they were likely following orders that originated from the top), the leadership will wring their hands stating they'd never dream of doing such a thing, conveniently ignoring the last two weeks they have had full knowledge of the situation but lied through their teeth.

In the end though, however they spin it, and spin it they will, they have been exposed to a much wider audience for what they are, there will always be the suspicion he was murdered, and that it were allegedly an "accident" makes it no less abhorrent.
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Old 15th Oct 2018, 23:10
  #62 (permalink)  
 
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I'd wondered if someone got a little too enthusiastic during an interrogation.
Aside from poor Mr Khashoggi I suspect members of the `abduction' squad may not be in a very good place at the moment either, if they are still on this earth.
Having globally embarrassed a vain and bullying King.
Oh dear...
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Old 15th Oct 2018, 23:13
  #63 (permalink)  
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No doubt it was self-defence.

So that's alright . . .
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Old 16th Oct 2018, 05:00
  #64 (permalink)  
 
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Given his age and portly build, it's quite possible that an overenthusiastic attempt to persuade him to complete the necessary paperwork in the home country triggered a fatal cardiovascular event - or an adverse reaction to any drugs administered.

Toxicology or marks on the body would result in embarrassing questions should an ambulance be called.

So it was decided to return the snatch crew and hope denials would be believed.

The scapegoats will be doing time in the Riyadh Ritz-Carlton where they can make themselves useful in other interrogations.
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Old 16th Oct 2018, 05:09
  #65 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by chuks View Post
Trump is already parroting the fall-back position, that Mr. Khashoggi might have been killed by "rogue agents" of Saudi Arabia. That's okay then?
.
Such a “convenient” explanation....
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Old 16th Oct 2018, 08:27
  #66 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by flash8 View Post
The Saudi's complete and utter denial is farcical and further down the line they may hope this blows over....... The weight of evidence against them however is overwhelming, you can even remove components of the evidence and it is still overwhelming. I don't think they'll fool anyone to be honest, this is almost as clear cut as you can get.
The same could be said of Russia and the Skripals of course, yet some will still insist there is no evidence and the whole thing is a bizarre anti-Russian plot.......
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Old 16th Oct 2018, 09:55
  #67 (permalink)  
 
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Fingerprints = visit
Blood = Violent visit
Brain matter = Terminal visit.
Interesting to note that Trump has started to set up a potential, if doubtful, alibi "Rogue elements"
Be lucky
David

Last edited by The AvgasDinosaur; 16th Oct 2018 at 09:57. Reason: spull chucker
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Old 16th Oct 2018, 12:17
  #68 (permalink)  
 
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Give a thought to what is the end game here between parties.

Is it to confess and promise not to do it again (without any punishment?

is it to explain it's somebody else fault and let's not let it interfere in the business of trade?

Is it to ignore all outsiders and continue as if nothing will come of it?

Is it to announce some sort of punishment that involves as many innocent parties as well, such that the punishment will be mostly symbolic in hopes that other issues will take over the news interest?
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Old 16th Oct 2018, 14:50
  #69 (permalink)  
 
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Game?

Well it is like dealing with a bunch of not very bright children in a playground somewhere with a sandbox.
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Old 16th Oct 2018, 18:23
  #70 (permalink)  
 
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The news this morning is that the Saudis are contemplating admitting a "mistake". Some years ago this was called a "modified limited hang-out". Anyone else remember?

After an excellent landing etc...
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Old 16th Oct 2018, 18:26
  #71 (permalink)  
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I remember an American (?) politician admitting that she 'mis-spoke'.
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Old 16th Oct 2018, 18:53
  #72 (permalink)  
 
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The news this evening is reporting that of the 15 people that arrived before the disappearance of Mr Khashoggi, one was a forensics expert and one was carrying a bone saw in his luggage...
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Old 16th Oct 2018, 19:49
  #73 (permalink)  
 
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Of far greater importance than how this fellow met an untimely demise is the impunity in the manner in which the act was carried out.With the full knowledge of the immunity afforded to its perpetrators and falgrant abuse of its privileges. Such an act could not have been carried out without the full knowledge and consent of those holding high rank in office.
Here is an extract from Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations:
Article 29 of the VCDR states that:

"The person of a diplomatic agent shall be inviolable. He shall not be liable to any form of arrest or detention. The receiving state shall treat him with due respect and shall take all appropriate steps to prevent any attack on his person, freedom or dignity."

It is possible that this event lead to reconsideration of the Vienna Convention.

Our CPS guidance is informative on this subject. The link is

https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidanc...matic-premises
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Old 16th Oct 2018, 21:15
  #74 (permalink)  
 
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I can't figure out why we think this behavior is something new in the Mid-East mindset. And somehow we think that we will be able to get a "transparent investigation and report". When has that ever been the case when it comes to countries like Turkey and Saudi Arabia? The truth is of no importance to them.
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Old 16th Oct 2018, 21:34
  #75 (permalink)  
 
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OB, doing satire now, are we?

"The truth is of no importance to them," says one of the biggest boosters of Donald Trump to be found here on Jet Blast!

How important is the truth to Donald Trump? With him it was first that it did not matter, and now that it was probably rogue killers. (Yeah, it's a known problem, rogue killers haunting the halls of embassies and consulates.) Could it be a much more likely truth that the real power behind the Saudi throne it was who sent those people to deal with one of the Kingdom's critics? No, not the King, but certainly the ruler of Saudi Arabia. Not according to Donald Trump and his loyal clique, because "the truth is of no importance to them."

Feel free, OB, to tell us how much you care about objective truth as you celebrate the way that Trump is "winning."
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Old 16th Oct 2018, 21:55
  #76 (permalink)  
 
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@chuks, could you please keep that personalization and baiting in the US Politics Hamsterwheel rather than derailing this discussion?
Seriously.
OB's point about the lousy track record the Saudis have on transparency is on-topic for this thread.
Your knee jerk having-a-go-at-him over the usual hamster wheel crap you two trade with each other isn't.

While I am pretty sure that the US official PR machine will make a meal of this, that ball's still in play; we'll see how messy it gets.

@VP959
Was this a humorous post, or are you dead serious about this bit?
The news this evening is reporting that of the 15 people that arrived before the disappearance of Mr Khashoggi, one was a forensics expert and one was carrying a bone saw in his luggage...
If true, then
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Old 16th Oct 2018, 22:02
  #77 (permalink)  
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Details of the Saudi citizens who travelled to Istanbul were released amid a claim that they had brought with them a bone saw to dismember Khashoggi.
It was in the Guarniad . . .
details of alleged Saudi hit squad emerge
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Old 16th Oct 2018, 22:36
  #78 (permalink)  
 
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No doubt the Saudis did it, but it will be denied as to what level that ordered it.

So once again the press and many posters are wringing their hands and calling for punishment of the highest level

but what should that be? and who should decide?

and just who was harmed??? and what laws were broken?

Should it be only the US that decides? or can we take it to a UN court for a few years?
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Old 17th Oct 2018, 00:45
  #79 (permalink)  
 
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Mike Pompeo looked pretty relaxed, smiling & laughing, as he arrived to give MBS a good telling off - i.e. passing the message that that 'stern measures' will be announced by the US against Saudi, but that 'stern measures' will never be implemented.
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Old 17th Oct 2018, 03:07
  #80 (permalink)  
 
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Yes I also noticed... continuously smiling... seemed like he was on holiday. No sense of decorum.
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