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Pedestrians – help to reduce pollution and traffic congestion

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Pedestrians – help to reduce pollution and traffic congestion

Old 10th Apr 2018, 18:51
  #21 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by MG23 View Post
That's because they block the road cycling side-by-side and have a dozen cars crawling along behind them at 10mph as they try to find a safe place to pass.
There is always room to overtake side-by side cyclists safely, provided you can see there's nothing coming the other way.

And if you can't see whether there is something coming the other way, there probably isn't room to overtake even a single cyclist safely (though that doesn't stop some drivers from trying).
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Old 10th Apr 2018, 18:59
  #22 (permalink)  
 
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Talking to a bus driver in Aberdeen crawling along behind a single cyclist in the bus lane he was under the impression that they ride slowly, deliberately.
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Old 10th Apr 2018, 19:30
  #23 (permalink)  
 
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There is one pelican crossing I regularly use. If traffic is light I wait for a gap and cross. If there is a steady stream of traffic in one direction or both I press the button and wait. Often there is somebody else wanting to cross at the same time. Pelican crossings serve a useful function provided they are used sensibly.

Outside our Tesco there is a zebra crossing (no lights). Visibility of pedestrians coming out of the shop is a bit restricted so drivers can't see you until you are virtually at the crossing. Despite it being a 20mph zone and parked cars on one side many seem to want to speed through the crossing, if you don't wait until you see the drivers slowing you risk being hit. Would be better as a pelican but it would be unpopular with drivers.

We should not criticise these crossings, in our area they are only put in place where there is an accident issue or places with lots of pedestrians.
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Old 10th Apr 2018, 19:53
  #24 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Fareastdriver View Post
Talking to a bus driver in Aberdeen crawling along behind a single cyclist in the bus lane he was under the impression that they ride slowly, deliberately.
Umm...so out of interest what sort of speed would have satisfied the driver? A pro probably can sustain 50 km/h (30 mph) on the flat but for most of us old gits....
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Old 10th Apr 2018, 19:57
  #25 (permalink)  

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Originally Posted by DaveReidUK View Post
There is always room to overtake side-by side cyclists safely, provided you can see there's nothing coming the other way.

And if you can't see whether there is something coming the other way, there probably isn't room to overtake even a single cyclist safely (though that doesn't stop some drivers from trying).
May be so in the towns but round here many roads are narrow, or single track. If I'm cycling I pull in to let cars safely by, but many cyclists don't and continue to ride two abreast, almost in defiance of a car driver trying to safely pass them.

Road manners should be a "two way street" (see what I did there?). Cyclists can't expect to receive good road manners from others if they don't give them.
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Old 10th Apr 2018, 20:08
  #26 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ShyTorque View Post
May be so in the towns but round here many roads are narrow, or single track. If I'm cycling I pull in to let cars safely by
Fair enough.

Most roads in this part of the world are wide enough to allow two cars to pass each other, and since two side-by-side cyclists are still narrower than a car then it should be possible to overtake them, too. If it isn't then most cyclists, in my experience, are sensible enough to single off.

Originally Posted by ShyTorque View Post
Cyclists can't expect to receive good road manners from others if they don't give them.
No argument there.
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Old 10th Apr 2018, 20:35
  #27 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by MG23 View Post
That's because they block the road cycling side-by-side and have a dozen cars crawling along behind them at 10mph as they try to find a safe place to pass.
I'm sure you do know really that if a bunch of cyclists fill the lane rather than stringing themselves out in single file it's quicker and easier for motor vehicles to get past.
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Old 10th Apr 2018, 21:05
  #28 (permalink)  

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I'm sure you do know really that if a bunch of cyclists fill the lane rather than stringing themselves out in single file it's quicker and easier for motor vehicles to get past.
Let's face it, if some drivers get annoyed with a pedestrian using a pedestrian crossing and daring to use the stop traffic button, then the above will be beyond them. After all, it's all about the car...
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Old 10th Apr 2018, 21:40
  #29 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ShyTorque View Post
No, it's not hard to research these things. I checked the UK government figures and they show that your calculations are well adrift!.
Yes, the same government calculations which don't take all the factors into account. I see DaveReid has already addressed that so I won't labour the point.

As I said before, anyone looking to blame cyclists or pedestrians for pollution has the wrong target in their sights.
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Old 10th Apr 2018, 21:48
  #30 (permalink)  
 
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That's because they block the road cycling side-by-side and have a dozen cars crawling along behind them at 10mph as they try to find a safe place to pass.
In all my years of driving and cycling, I've never seen a traffic jam caused by cyclists, but I've seen plenty caused by cars. Ban the things, I say (tongue firmly in cheek).
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Old 10th Apr 2018, 21:59
  #31 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Buster11 View Post
Are we pedestrians losing all traffic sense? Are we no longer able to assess a road situation and decide whether or not it’s safe to cross the road? Do we imagine that pressing a pedestrian crossing button makes it safer to cross the road than crossing it when there isn’t any traffic in sight?
Seems like a great idea.
In fact, you could apply the same logic to cars at an intersection controlled by traffic lights. After all, a pedestrian crossing is really just an intersection with pedestrian traffic in one direction, activated by a button instead of a loop.
Nothing within range? Just head straight across.

Might be worth a note to the highways department suggesting just that.

(Much the way it works in Indonesia)
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Old 10th Apr 2018, 22:03
  #32 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Hydromet View Post
In all my years of driving and cycling, I've never seen a traffic jam caused by cyclists, but I've seen plenty caused by cars. Ban the things, I say (tongue firmly in cheek).
I get held up by cars whilst cycling more often than I get held up by cyclists whilst driving - about "nearly every trip" vs "hardly ever".
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 02:26
  #33 (permalink)  
 
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Now I’ve forgotten what this thread was about. Had to go back and look.

Ah, yes, in the country where I am at present no-one will stop for you even if you dared to put a foot on the zebra crossing. Drivers from many countries outside the EU have increased in the UK, so blind faith in the law and your pedestrian rights on a road crossing could sadly get you killed.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 03:45
  #34 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Hydromet View Post
In all my years of driving and cycling, I've never seen a traffic jam caused by cyclists, but I've seen plenty caused by cars.
Can't be looking very hard, then. I used to see them (or be stuck in them) regularly when I lived in the UK.

One road in particular had free-flowing traffic if there were no cyclists and was pretty much impossible to pass on if they decided to ride two-abreast, because of the constant traffic coming the other way. Oh, yeah, there was a bike lane on the pavement for them, which took space away from pedestrians, but they were too Special Snowflake to use it.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 06:43
  #35 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by MG23 View Post
One road in particular had free-flowing traffic if there were no cyclists and was pretty much impossible to pass on if they decided to ride two-abreast, because of the constant traffic coming the other way.
It sounds like you're saying that you would happily overtake a single cyclist while within the confines of your lane, regardless of whether that's leaving them a safe amount of space.

It might help if you start thinking of those two-abreast cyclists as helping you to avoid committing to an unsafe manoeuvre.

Last edited by DaveReidUK; 11th Apr 2018 at 09:20. Reason: sp
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 08:12
  #36 (permalink)  

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Originally Posted by DaveReidUK View Post
Total of CO2 produced during manufacture + CO2 produced during use.
CO2 is also produced during the manufacture of bicycles and all the other paraphernalia cyclists like to have, such as specialist clothing. Most cyclists also have a car and only use their bicycles for recreational purposes, so those bicycles and everything that goes with them are a luxury.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 08:28
  #37 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Fareastdriver View Post
I read somewhere that four cyclists produce more Co2 than a small car would transporting them.
But that assumes that those four adults wouldn't exhale once when in the car.

Even for JB and an anti-cycling rant, that's especially stupid.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 09:15
  #38 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ShyTorque View Post
CO2 is also produced during the manufacture of bicycles and all the other paraphernalia cyclists like to have, such as specialist clothing.
The corresponding figures for cycles are about 16g/km when in use, and their manufacture accounts for about 5g/km on average, making the previously quoted total of 21g/km.

I don't know whether that allows for the fact that cyclists usually breathe even when they're not on their bikes.

I have no idea what point you're trying to make with the rest of your post.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 09:17
  #39 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ShyTorque View Post
CO2 is also produced during the manufacture of bicycles and all the other paraphernalia cyclists like to have, such as specialist clothing.
In your rabid anti-cycling ranting you're overlooking the fact that the "specialist clothing" that cyclists like to have is pretty much just clothing. It's just optimised for sitting on a saddle and riding a bike, that's all. I'm pretty sure it takes the same amount of CO2 to produce as street clothes do.

Do you drive around naked or something? Or do you also like to have "specialist driving paraphernalia" like, you know, shirts, and pants and stuff?

Originally Posted by ShyTorque View Post
Most cyclists also have a car and only use their bicycles for recreational purposes, so those bicycles and everything that goes with them are a luxury.
Where are you getting this crap from? Are you seriously suggesting that hardly anyone commutes to work on bikes? Nobody uses them as their main form of transport? Sheesh.

You need to stop being jealous of people who are walking, riding a bike or anything else similar, they're not some kind of demented pervert just because they're not in a car.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 09:35
  #40 (permalink)  
 
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The OP’s suggestion that pedestrians wait until all cars have passed to press the button to cross seems particularly unreasonable. I suggest it’s he, not the pedestrians who are “self-absorbed”.

The anti-cycling zealots on this thread seem even more idiotic than usual; it’s not even about cycling!
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