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Martin MCGuinness 1950-2017

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Martin MCGuinness 1950-2017

Old 22nd Mar 2017, 22:15
  #141 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Effluent Man View Post
My in laws live in an upmarket suburb of Liverpool. They very much have a down on Catholics.
Weird family
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 22:16
  #142 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by BehindBlueEyes View Post
My remaining family in Eire wanted no part of the Troubles but there is, and I'm of the same blood, a tendency by the Irish to bear grudges against the past and even other families - sometimes over a slight by a forefather. I've heard my own mother repeat tales of a dispute that was decades old but somehow needed to be kept alive! It's a nation with a bloody and turbulent history but they need to look forward and not keep harking back to the bad old days.
That's a bit rich, the British would celebrate a victory in a gang fight. You name it, the U.K. Has VE Day, the poppy, they remember the armada, Wellington, D Day, Trafalgar, Charge of the Light Brigade, etc. etc. etc.

I have seen brits abroad wearing Union Jack shorts singing 2 World Wars and 1 World Cup to a bunch of German across the street. If there was ever a nation that needs to look forward and not keep harking back to the beads old days its the UK. It is the same colonial, empirical, delusions of grandeur mentality that were a major force in the Brexit vote.
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 22:17
  #143 (permalink)  
 
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You're telling me!
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 22:18
  #144 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Effluent Man View Post
My in laws live in an upmarket suburb of Liverpool. They very much have a down on Catholics.

Sffp, yes it does wash, very much so. Bloody Sunday was a major raising of the ante. And before you make excuses for that Cameron apologised in parliament for what happened.
Are you saying that the events of Bloody Sunday are justification for 2 decades or more of death and destruction of predominantly innocent non com's?

If you are then that sure sounds like you are using the 'he started it' argument.
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 22:20
  #145 (permalink)  
 
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William of Orange started it.
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 22:42
  #146 (permalink)  
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William of Orange started it.
A moot point, there were Catholics and Protestants on both sides at the battle of the Boyne - and William had the support of the pope.

Most Irish would go back a lot further to Cromwell.....
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 22:51
  #147 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
A moot point, there were Catholics and Protestants on both sides at the battle of the Boyne - and William had the support of the pope.

Most Irish would go back a lot further to Cromwell.....
Which demonstrates very clearly how ridiculous sectarian hatred really is.
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 23:02
  #148 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Effluent Man View Post
My in laws live in an upmarket suburb of Liverpool. They very much have a down on Catholics.

Sffp, yes it does wash, very much so. Bloody Sunday was a major raising of the ante. And before you make excuses for that Cameron apologised in parliament for what happened.
Liverpool was just as much a bigoted city as Glasgow was for many decades, they had and still have their own Orange Order parades.

A good friend grew up in the city and said around July 12th every year his parents ensure they were out of the as it was so vile.
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 23:03
  #149 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by racedo View Post
Liverpool was just as much a bigoted city as Glasgow was for many decades, they had and still have their own Orange Order parades.

A good friend grew up in the city and said around July 12th every year his parents ensure they were out of the as it was so vile.
And why Liverpool in particular?
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 23:09
  #150 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Seldomfitforpurpose View Post
And are you saying those actions gave McGuinness and Co the right to murder and maim predominantly non combatant innocents in the manner they did for so many years?

The argument that someone else started it first does not wash.
British Govt had already lost control before Bloody Sunday, it was just the culmination of what had been happening.

The Whitewash report of the events showed the State really cared little for the minority population and their lives were worthless.

Powerless people with no chance of being heard within the Democratic process as it was Gerrymandered to exclude them, a state which had already shown that they had no civil rights............... what is left to people when Belfast and most definitely London doesn't want to see or hear what is happening.
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 23:16
  #151 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by engineer(retard) View Post
And why Liverpool in particular?
It just has it possibly because it is a port that served Dublin and Belfast.

It wasn't the only place either
https://radicalmanchester.wordpress....lyne-may-1868/
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 23:17
  #152 (permalink)  
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And why Liverpool in particular?
Try Lewes on Guy Fawkes night.

Thousands come from NI and others parts just for the day.
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 23:19
  #153 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
Try Lewes on Guy Fawkes night.

Thousands come from NI and others parts just for the day.
So it's Irish Sectarianism that has been exported
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 23:25
  #154 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
Try Lewes on Guy Fawkes night.

Thousands come from NI and others parts just for the day.
Lewes is a vile manifestation of it with links to Loyalist amd Orange Orders from Northern Ireland..................... FFS its is Sussex not Belfast.
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 23:30
  #155 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by engineer(retard) View Post
So it's Irish Sectarianism that has been exported
Really so the attacks of Catholics in the UK for centurys have been what exactly ?

What Irish media has promoted sectarianism and denial of Civil rights to people based on the church they go to.

If Irish were so sectarian why would their first President be Dr Douglas Hyde the son of a Protestant Clergyman or another Erskine Childers whose father was Riddle of The Sands author.
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 23:31
  #156 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by racedo View Post
British Govt had already lost control before Bloody Sunday, it was just the culmination of what had been happening.

The Whitewash report of the events showed the State really cared little for the minority population and their lives were worthless.

Powerless people with no chance of being heard within the Democratic process as it was Gerrymandered to exclude them, a state which had already shown that they had no civil rights............... what is left to people when Belfast and most definitely London doesn't want to see or hear what is happening.
Pick up a gun and some bombs and bomb/shoot the shit out of hundreds and hundreds of innocent civilians over a few decades?
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 23:32
  #157 (permalink)  
 
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I was born and brought up a protestant in East Belfast in a street of mixed religious inhabitants. My young brother´s best mate there was a catholic from a "mixed" marriage. My older brothers were friends with the brothers of this boys mother.
When I went to a new Tech High School I found myself sitting next to a catholic lad which surprised me as I knew that "taigs and prods" couldn´t go to the same schools. On getting home that first day I mentioned this to my father who said "So what son?"
I think this demonstrates that not all prods hated catholics and vice versa.


From age 16 in the RAF I spent 11 years living and working with guys of various religious backgrounds. I have no hatred of any religión.


My last 3˝ years of service were at RAF Ballykelly, starting January 1968.
I saw the Army arrive, met with open arms by the locals for getting between them and the protestant thugs who attacked their CR marches.
Then they started to arrive back at BK from patrol with various injuries from the bricks and bottles thrown at them. Got worse after that.


I went back to live in Belfast with my father and brothers on demob but also spending a lot of time away in my new civvy job.


For those advocating forgiveness for MM because of his political efforts in later life I say NO WAY. Firstly because the methods employed by him and his colleagues could never be compensated for by his work in politics and secondly, because he only took that route to protect himself from prosecution.


The disappearances of many people, the location of some of the bodies still not known, leaving their families in limbo. The kidnapping of mothers in the presence of their children followed by torture, killing and hiding the bodies and later acknowledging that some were innocent. Some of those "children" are alive today and know who took their mother but are too afraid to say.


Apart from the above, another of the MM/GR atrocities was the "Sticky bomb", a petrol bomb laced with sugar. This was placed in the window of the target, pub or nightclub and designed to explode into the interior. This had the effect of making it very difficult for victims to extinguish the flames once their clothing was alight.


The truck and van drivers who were forced to drive bombs to "target áreas" and died while their families were held hostage.


Don´t be under the impression that these thugs have gone away. The kneecappings continue to this day. Their latest claim to fame is visiting the home of a 14 year old girl to warn her she has to leave Northern Ireland. Try reading the Belfast Telegraph newspaper from time to time, it can be an eye opener. Not much appears in the English press these days.


My hatred of the IRA (all brands) is equalled only by my detestation of their protestant counterparts.


I for one will not forget, nor will I forgive.
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Old 22nd Mar 2017, 23:43
  #158 (permalink)  
 
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Jimmy Saville raised a fortune for charities, which enriched the lives of many people. But when the pros and cons of his life are weighed up, he's probably found somewhat lacking.

as is McGuiness
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Old 23rd Mar 2017, 00:47
  #159 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Interested Passenger View Post
Jimmy Saville raised a fortune for charities, which enriched the lives of many people. But when the pros and cons of his life are weighed up, he's probably found somewhat lacking.

as is McGuiness
Comparing Saville's life performance with McGuinness, now that I do like and will repost it elsewhere
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Old 23rd Mar 2017, 03:21
  #160 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Seldomfitforpurpose View Post
Pick up a gun and some bombs and bomb/shoot the shit out of hundreds and hundreds of innocent civilians over a few decades?
So when did Govt in London start to take the real grievances of the minority in Northern Ireland seriously ?

1965 ?
1968 ?
1969 ?
1984 ?

Just really curious.

NI Govt and London Govt made McGuinness because they refused to acknowledge there were grievances when the people who sought change peacefully were attacked and battered off the streets by the forces of law and order.

Once you let the genie out it is not going back in.
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