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US Politics Hamsterwheel v2.0

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US Politics Hamsterwheel v2.0

Old 10th Feb 2017, 16:53
  #6041 (permalink)  
 
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So....The Government removes the offensive bit about Green Card Holders and Dual Nationalities.....and rescinds the current EO and issues a new one.

Job done....unless the Appeals Court that gets Overturned/Reversed 90% of the time sticks its beak back into business not of its jurisdiction anyway.
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 17:04
  #6042 (permalink)  
 
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Anyone who disagrees with the right-wing nutjobs and their grate Messiah Generalismo Donaldi is immediately branded an enemy of the people - these despots even want to "smash the judges" if they have the temerity to actually apply the law.

Never mind Putin - you people are making Mugabe look like a moderate...

PDR
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 17:50
  #6043 (permalink)  
 
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Osama would be so proud at how things are shaping up.
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 17:53
  #6044 (permalink)  
 
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How about this for doing something about those disenfranchised young armed males....seems about right to me!



Video shows teen killed for pointing gun at Baltimore cop | Daily Mail Online
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 17:57
  #6045 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
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Here is how "the law" WRT admitting aliens reads:
(f) Suspension of entry or imposition of restrictions by President
Whenever the President finds that the entry of any aliens or of any class of aliens into the United States would be detrimental to the interests of the United States, he may by proclamation, and for such period as he shall deem necessary, suspend the entry of all aliens or any class of aliens as immigrants or non-immigrants, or impose on the entry of aliens any restrictions he may deem to be appropriate.


I direct your attention to the relevant "by proclamation". Here's where it came from. The framers of the constitution knew full well that legislatures, and judicial processes were not sufficiently speedy in deciding on and enforcing immediate needs of the security of the nation. That's why the president has unlimited power to wage war. He has the nuclear football within 20 paces of himself at all times.



Sadly, the 9th circuit was completely silent in their 30 pages of hand-wringing and they forgot to address this exercise of the law in question.


Too busy worrying about the possible(but not stateful) damage which may be done in some future to some potential immigrant which may have some standing.



There's ample history, and case law on the non-reviewability of the plenary power in international law to back this up. The most glaring, and so far not mentioned is Roosevelt(Dem) exec order 9066. This order, was challenged and made it all the way to the SCOTUS in Korematsu v US. This decision goes down in history as one of the worst, and most egregious lapses in judicial conduct by any court. However, it has NEVER been overturned, and still stands as a legal Canon(not boom kind of canon) for case law. Further, execs after Roosevelt, many of them from the liberal side of the house have used the plenary power to exclude large swaths of potential immigrants from the US.



One more thing on the muslim part of all this. Of all the protections and all the restrictions on the litmus test for denying immigrants, one attribute is glaringly missing. Madison wrote that while restricting voting and running for public office to citizens, he extended the rights in general to all ALIENS. An alien in this case is a person, who by some method or another has come to the country, but who was not born in this country, and has not undergone the requisite swearing. So, since the appellant in these cases are in fact aliens(persons who live in US but NOT citizens), they have standing - and yet, the order does not apply to them. So we devolve to standing. If a person in the US has standing to sue for other immigrants who are not here but want to come here, does that not render the plenary power by exec proclamation moot? What good is having plenary(non-reviewable) power if the alien in the country can sue on behalf of someone a 1000 miles away? Is the alien themselves a proxy for someone else? Do we want as a nation to extend our presidential powers to an alien who cannot vote or run for office? The decision rests on the flimsiest of exceptions, and foundation on ethereal probabilities.



But - they are letting in more terrorist, so when another attack happens it can and will be blamed on Trump.

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Old 10th Feb 2017, 18:43
  #6046 (permalink)  
 
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Why doesn't the Donald simply issue a new executive order.
Sure he continues to fight the old one though the courts in the hope he wins in the Supreme Court - but in the meantime the new executive order will be in place with immediate effect.
Then the objectors can start the court process all over again on the new executive order to get that one overturned.....
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 19:06
  #6047 (permalink)  
 
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For those with a touch of patience, consider this. In 2010, the advent of the "Tea Party" got our attention. It basically morphed into an orphan wing of the RNC, somewhat misrepresented as "AstroTurf..." (Instead of 'grass roots', a more genteel phrase) by Hillary Clinton.

Currently we are witnessing the unbridled iteration of the far left wing of the DNC, the "rabid" Statists, whose prose flows in milliseconds on Facebook, due to an automatic dogma.

As the Republicans did before, the Dems are flummoxed, unable and unwilling to alter or dismiss this powerful ground swell of fascistic Statism...

It will marginalize these angry Clintonians, at least. At worst, the Party may code...
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 19:24
  #6048 (permalink)  
 
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Cap in hand to the Chinese

Ah.... is not reality such an efficient corrective.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/10/w...mentsContainer
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 19:28
  #6049 (permalink)  
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atpcliff, Vapilot, oicur12 - You guys really 'take the biscuit', proudly banging the constitutional drum and ignoring the real threat to the USA. Don't think for one moment that ISIS won't have noticed this division and will use the opportunity to infiltrate. They have done it in Europe and they are almost certainly doing it to you.

Had those Democrat legal eagles, so anxious to hold press conferences on TV, really had the interests of the American people at heart they would have got their respective heads together and, without raising any publicity, approached the Trump camp and said, "you can't do it like this and here is why", then going on to explain a well thought out solution, no razz mataz, no publicity, just the urgent need to get a border security system in place and save American lives, but no, they have each to seek their fifteen minutes of fame in the limelight, make no attempt to disguise their political agenda and instead seek maximum controversy. International terrorism is a bi partisan problem, the Democrats simply don't see this now, after Obama. These people do not have the best interests of America and Americans at heart, they think only of themselves, totally impervious to what is going on in the real world. How can you support them?

And the terrorists keep coming.

Bury your heads in the sand if you will, deny there is any threat, but as we type ISIS will be slipping past your doorstep
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 19:59
  #6050 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Uncle Fred View Post
Ah.... is not reality such an efficient corrective.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/10/w...mentsContainer
"Tough" guy having his face ripped of. Embarrassing
Per
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 20:14
  #6051 (permalink)  

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ORAC, I'm surprised at you - ".. the anomaly being Spain"

I don't have to be Spanish to point out that they've had 'em before...

Mac



And as for the good SHAIKH MOHAMMAD blaming poor Johnson for the Second Indochina War, well really. The first American advisors arrived under Truman, continued under Ike and flourished under Kennedy. The much underestimated LBJ loathed the Vietnam war - it ruined the accomplishment of his Great Society (which would have given Americans a decent version of "Obamacare" 40 years ago)!

But to return to the odious Trump - I rather like what vapilot2004 said:

"Perhaps that's how they do it in Trumpland, but this ain't no tight-lipped, steel-flanked corporation full of kow towed minions and rats scratching for the top of the pile, nor is it a banana republic, although our current el presidente seems to (unfortunately) fit the part to a *cough* "T". The fight over this bungled order is not about partisanship, nor is it about national security, it is about who we are as a nation and what that means."

G'night now!

Mac
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 20:44
  #6052 (permalink)  
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Trump Fails Basic Literacy Test.

Does Donald Trump Know How to Read?
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 21:10
  #6053 (permalink)  
 
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No comment required.....the video pretty well sums it up!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZhpK--yMRhg
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 21:41
  #6054 (permalink)  
 
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SASless, cute, but all of those quotes are taken out of context and no Democratic administration has acted in the racist, xenophobic manner as Trump has. Nice try, though.

Had those Democrat legal eagles, so anxious to hold press conferences on TV, really had the interests of the American people at heart they would have got their respective heads together and, without raising any publicity, approached the Trump camp and said, "you can't do it like this and here is why
That would be a laughable exercise, considering the amount of hubris this cocky, yet discombobulated Trump administration holds.

Their anti-Islamic, racist, and xenophobic rhetoric, threatened actions against Iran, proposed embassy in Jerusalem will do more towards provoking an attack than any immigration ban could possibly contain. It is an escalating war of words and wills and TrumPus and his collection of merry morons have just upped the ante rather than ratchet things down.
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 21:48
  #6055 (permalink)  
 
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Why doesn't the Donald simply issue a new executive order.
Pride and hubris.

Absolutely true, it is about whether we are governed by officials chosen thru elections OR are we to governed by unaccountable judges.
Nice try, but all of the accounting bits required are clearly scribed on a curly bit of parchment under glass at the National Archives.

BTW, the administration screwed this up royally, maybe good intentions or not, but they need to start over.
You meant bad intentions, yes GF?
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 21:54
  #6056 (permalink)  

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Well, I was going to say goodnight, but one of the references - https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/10/w...a-fascism.html - mentioned that Bannon was an admirer of the little known Julius Evola, and was surprised that he had even heard of him (he is hardly well known these days, excerpt in high intellectual alt-right circles).

Now as it happens, I do know a little about Evola and have even read some of his writings. And why should the good Mac have encountered Evola?

Because I am interested in Aleister Crowley, the so called "Wickedest Man in the World", who perhaps even fewer remember these days. I found a fairly recent excellent biography of him by Martin Booth and by great good luck found a very rare volume of his poems in a fleamarket. Now why should I be interested in Crowley, (who wasn't nearly as wicked as all that - just a deluded old diabolist with odd sexual tastes and a talent for chess)?.

Because I am genuinely interested in Ian Fleming (and his brother Peter), and Fleming when ADNI in the Admiralty had a very brief correspondence with Crowley - another interesting story that will have to wait for another day

As it happens Evola and Crowley had much in common in their world view and each influenced the other.

"According to one scholar, "Evola’s thought can be considered one of the most radically and consistently antiegalitarian, antiliberal, antidemocratic, and antipopular systems in the twentieth century." Many of Evola's theories and writings were also centered on his idiosyncratic mysticismand esoteric religious studies, accordingly, he influenced apolitical esotericists as well."

You can read Evola on Crowley at - http://www.gornahoor.net/library/EvolaOnCrowley.pdf - A fascinating read.

Read more about Evola at Julius Evola - Radical Traditionalist Philosphy and Metaphysics - quite an unusual character to say the least. Wikipedia also has quite a good piece - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julius_Evola

Both were involved in the Occult (Black Magic - not the chocolates, silly) and had some totally out of the loony-bin ideas and philosophies. Quite leave even the most bizarre National Socialist Rassenhygiene writings in the dust.

Any way, the point to all this is that we have an even more peculiar person than I ever dreamed of whispering in Donald's ear and consequently caroming around his confused skull.

Filling a vain, insecure and confused POTUS head with all this garbage is unlikely to procure a happy ending.

Mac

Maybe it will end like Nixon, with the President weeping on Mattis shoulder...and a lot more tears from other folks as well.
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 22:02
  #6057 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by G-CPTN View Post
Wow, some boring guy with apple earphones hanging around his neck as if that makes him "cool" thinks he is some sort of intellectual, and likes to hear the sound of his own voice.

Shame its nothing but drivel coming out when he speaks.

Couldn't be bothered looking at the second video, if the first one is anything to go by.
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 22:05
  #6058 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SASless View Post
No comment required.....the video pretty well sums it up!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZhpK--yMRhg
yeah, great video, shame both of them had the right sentiment, but not the drive to make it happen. Donald will no doubt fix the problem, despite the early setbacks from the leftist establishment.
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 22:10
  #6059 (permalink)  
 
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Donald will no doubt fix the problem, despite the early setbacks from the leftist establishment.
Setbacks were clearly borne out of their own incompetence, and the leftist establishment you mention is a little something called the judicial branch, one of the checks and balances of the American government.

It was your so-called 'leftist establishment' in the judicial branch that moved Civil Rights forward, gave women the right to vote, blacks the right to vote, stood up against slavery, and kept secular our laws in a woman's right to choose, meanwhile the right-wing elements fought tooth and nail in an attempt to prevent all of the above - with some derelict, misguided holdouts still trying to turn back the clock on these social advancements.

Guess who turned out to be on the 'right' side of history?
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Old 10th Feb 2017, 22:10
  #6060 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ExXB View Post
Exactly as your founding fathers intended. Checks and balances.

Congress can get rid of any judge appointed by the President. Checks and balances.
You mean "cheques and bank balances", that old saying guilty until proven rich is a way of life for the American legal system, especially all the lawyers running around submitting "trumped up" (lol) charges on behalf of all the terrorists.

I'm looking forward to the end game where these judges with nothing better to do with their time than waste taxpayers money get moved to Siberia or retired by an Executive Order!
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