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War in Australia (any Oz Politics): the Original

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War in Australia (any Oz Politics): the Original

Old 27th Jun 2015, 02:51
  #17821 (permalink)  
 
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From vice.com

Last month the Australian government, with the support of the opposition, passed the Border Force Protection Act through both houses of Parliament. It will come into effect on July 1.

If the act defines you as an "entrusted person," you might be facing jail for up to two years if you reveal anything about what happens in Australia's immigration detention centers to anybody else.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 06:46
  #17822 (permalink)  
RJM
 
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I'm suspect there are similar provisions relating to many things in Australian life - defence, police, finance, etc.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 07:02
  #17823 (permalink)  
 
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Most businesses have a provision in their terms of employment whereby you are in for the high jump should you reveal inner workings to the outside world.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 07:13
  #17824 (permalink)  
 
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Islamic State 'coming after us': Abbott

Islamic State 'coming after us': Abbott

Cookies must be enabled. | The Australian

I would earnestly request that all here look under their respective beds before retiring tonight.

What a sad little man.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 07:15
  #17825 (permalink)  
Nemo Me Impune Lacessit
 
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Every pilot's contract I have signed, going back to 1968, said that there should be no communication of company matters to anyone outside the company without the express permission of the company first, failure to comply would be punishable by dismissal. The military have a very similar clause in their contracts too.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 07:20
  #17826 (permalink)  
Nemo Me Impune Lacessit
 
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Allison, do you live in a city centre? Nothing sad about Abbotts statement at all, the IS have said they are going fight their war on Australian soil. Past attacks, in various countries, have taken the form of random gun attacks, kidnapping and suicide bombers, most of these attacks occur in cities/large towns.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 08:02
  #17827 (permalink)  
 
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For people like alisoncc, De Nile, it would seem, is not just a big river in Egypt.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 09:02
  #17828 (permalink)  
 
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So one disgruntled employee in France tops his boss and tries to blow up the factory, and Arabs have been killing each other since time immemorial and killing anyone else who gets in their way. For this we should all panic ?

I did earnestly recommend that you all look under your beds tonight, didn't I?

When the Soviets were threatening to nuke the western world in the early sixties, I don't recollect any panic then. We just took it in our stride, whilst doing all we could to deter them. Did many 12 hour shifts on QRA in Bomber Command fully in the knowledge that when we lauched our Vulcans they may not have been coming back. Not that we would have been there to welcome them.

And had no compunction in paying regular visits to Khormaksar and other places around southern Saudi Arabia and the Gulf, spending nearly 18 months there courtesy of HM. Arabs were killing each other then to. Suspect we were made of different stock back then. Still didn't panic.

The media see it as their duty to scare the shits out of everyone whether it's nuclear armageddon, climate change with rising sea levels or the Arabs coming to get us, And the Pollies use it to clamp down on our basic freedoms, whilst seeking to increase their control of our daily lives. And you people just buy into it. That's sad too.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 09:07
  #17829 (permalink)  
Nemo Me Impune Lacessit
 
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Having lived and worked in the Middle East for ten years as well as a year in Aden in the sixties, whilst in the Army, I am in no doubt that when these lunatics make threats they have every intention of following them through.


The sad ones are the ones who think it could never happen to them.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 09:10
  #17830 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by parabellum View Post
Every pilot's contract I have signed, going back to 1968, said that there should be no communication of company matters to anyone outside the company without the express permission of the company first, failure to comply would be punishable by dismissal. The military have a very similar clause in their contracts too.
Of course they can say that, your contract can say anything. Whether it is legally binding is up for argument in the courts and depends on the laws of the land which are set by the government, ostensibly the "better man".

Certainly, revealing the inner workings of your employer is not a criminal offence punishable by imprisonment even if you can be sued for damages later.

If you really wanted to continue working for your company after rightly blowing the whistle on them, I see no reason why FWA should not force them to reinstate you. Whistle blowers are an extremely important part of holding powerful people in our society to account - exactly the point MTOW was attempting to make before when complaining about J.G's refurbishment expenses (presumably Liberal ex-PMs are quite frugal with their entitlements).

Regardless, for our "accountable, transparent" government (and the opposition mind you) to bring in legislation that criminalises whistleblowing stinks in the worst possible way. Especially with respect to the sexual abuse of children - utterly indefensible.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 09:12
  #17831 (permalink)  
 
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Wasn't there someone famous who said words to the effect that "when you seek to change your lives because of their threats, then they have won".
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 09:15
  #17832 (permalink)  
 
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Alison, I cannot believe you said this:
When the Soviets were threatening to nuke the western world in the early sixties, I don't recollect any panic then. We just took it in our stride,
We took it in our stride?? I seem to remember huge rallies of... ummm... what today we would call Lefties demanding that OUR SIDE ban the bomb, on the premise (in their minds) that if we dismantled ours, the Soviets would dismantle theirs.

The Soviets had a name for such people - "useful idiots".

Meanwhile, whilst on the topic of re-writing history, here's an example of re-writing data. From the Tim Blair blog.

Dismayed by a poll showing decreased support for Canberra’s light rail proposal, greenists Will Steffen and Barbara Norman adjust the numbers:
On the surface of it, the union poll of 1446 residents showed that only 38.8 per cent of Canberrans support light rail, while 46.3 per cent oppose it and 14.9 per cent are undecided.

Buried in the detail of that outcome is the most striking number in the poll – only 15.8 per cent of intended Liberal voters support light rail, while for all of the other groups of intended voters (Labor, Greens, Others and Undecided) support for light rail varied between 42.0 and 63.5 per cent. That anomalously low level of support among intended Liberal voters immediately caught our attention and prompted us to do a re-analysis of the poll results …

In our reanalysis, we used all the percentages reported in the Canberra Times article in terms of level of support for light rail according to intended voting patterns. We then removed the intended Liberal voters from the analysis, giving a total of 980 remaining respondents to the poll, comprising the categories Labor, Greens, Others and Undecided in terms of intended voting pattern …

This gives a very different picture. Now a majority support light rail. In fact, for the more-than-two-thirds of Canberrans who are are not intending to vote for the Liberals, there is very strong support for light rail, a nearly 20 per cent lead over those who oppose it.
You couldn't make this up.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 09:16
  #17833 (permalink)  
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Alisoncc,

Times have changed. The next war was predicted many years ago to be won "By the wombs of the women of Islam".

In what country do you suggest that all these muslim immigrants, with their birth rates up to three times that of the locals, will not convert to Islam by using the Democratic system against itself?

Perhaps a system that could take the best of Sharia law, and the best of Western laws will eventually be the winner, but I would think not. There is no room for compromise with the Koran as the guiding light.
 
Old 27th Jun 2015, 09:21
  #17834 (permalink)  
 
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exactly the point MTOW was attempting to make before when complaining about J.G's refurbishment expenses (presumably Liberal ex-PMs are quite frugal with their entitlements).
chuboy, you may be reading more into my remarks that I intended. I by no means feel thoroughly p1ssed off only by ex-Labor politicians milking the taxpayer with their gold passes and far too generous perks. The damned Libs are just as guilty and I'd like to see them unmasked and brought to account as well.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 09:25
  #17835 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by MTOW View Post
chuboy, you may be reading more into my remarks that I intended. I by no means feel thoroughly p1ssed off only by ex-Labor politicians milking the taxpayer with their gold passes and far too generous perks. The damned Libs are just as guilty and I'd like to see them unmasked and brought to account as well.
Understood your post perfectly - my only comment is that it's just as well it's still legal for someone to reveal just how much is being spent.

Put another way, had Gillard decided to devote her time to working around detention centres in Nauru or Christmas Island, it will soon be a criminal offence for anyone in the know to disclose how much taxpayer money she is spending in the process.

Maybe now you damned apologists will be riled up by this awful legislation
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 09:31
  #17836 (permalink)  
 
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Alison, I cannot believe you said this: Quote:
When the Soviets were threatening to nuke the western world in the early sixties, I don't recollect any panic then. We just took it in our stride,
We took it in our stride?? I seem to remember huge rallies of... ummm... what today we would call Lefties demanding that OUR SIDE ban the bomb, on the premise (in their minds) that if we dismantled ours, the Soviets would dismantle theirs.
There have always been idiots around. When I wrote "We just took it in our stride" I was referring to rational people. The rallies weren't huge, in comparison to the mega-millions who didn't attend them. But like now the media seek to drive the debate based on fear, and the pollies take advantage.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 09:47
  #17837 (permalink)  
 
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Howard won two elections on propaganda. The 'useful idiots' have purpose come balot time.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 09:58
  #17838 (permalink)  
 
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Certainly, revealing the inner workings of your employer is not a criminal offence punishable by imprisonment even if you can be sued for damages later.
Correct, unless (as you point out) your employer is the Australian Government.

It sounds like an extension of the existing s70 of the Crimes Act, which has been in force for a very long time. In the last decade it has also been used against at least one whistle blower, the Customs Officer Alan Kessing who leaked shortcomings in airport border security to The Australian, prompting the Wheeler Report. Rudd & Co. promised to remove the imprisonment penalty, and promptly forgot all about it as soon as they were elected.
Feel free to read my earlier rants on the subject, though you'll have to go a few years back in time and pay a call to the Dunnunda forum archives. I don't mean to be depressing, but there is no such thing as an open and accountable government, even in the lucky country.

It sounds like this has widened the provisions of s70 to include non-APS employees such as contract security guards, cleaners and all the other non-government people who are now doing the government's work. Don't expect either side of government to rescind this stuff any time soon; it's how they've always kept the muck under the rug and out of the media.
CRIMES ACT 1914 - SECT 70

Disclosure of information by Commonwealth officers (1) A person who, being a Commonwealth officer, publishes or communicates, except to some person to whom he or she is authorized to publish or communicate it, any fact or document which comes to his or her knowledge, or into his or her possession, by virtue of being a Commonwealth officer, and which it is his or her duty not to disclose, shall be guilty of an offence.
(2) A person who, having been a Commonwealth officer, publishes or communicates, without lawful authority or excuse (proof whereof shall lie upon him or her), any fact or document which came to his or her knowledge, or into his or her possession, by virtue of having been a Commonwealth officer, and which, at the time when he or she ceased to be a Commonwealth officer, it was his or her duty not to disclose, shall be guilty of an offence.
Penalty: Imprisonment for 2 years.
The sad ones are the ones who think it could never happen to them.
Of course it can happen, but what is the likelihood in Australia? That's not to dismiss the risk, deny the previous event (and yes, there may be others ), shut down debate or apologise for the criminal proponents, but there has been a lot of very alarmist media commentary, ably encouraged by the PM.

Some self-proclaimed expert on channel nine this morning said (among other things) that 1. Australia Will Be Next and 2. one in twenty immigrants is a jihadist. Now maybe he's written a PhD on the subject and has oodles of evidence to back up those two very sweeping and scary statements, but if he does it sure wasn't mentioned.
Maybe he's actually pulled them out of the Book of Inflammatory Phrases that's issued to every 'expert' who appears on the morning breakfast programmes.
The rallies weren't huge, in comparison to the mega-millions who didn't attend them.
Same now, but the media is much, much huger. Twenty guys with signs can get world-wide coverage if the signs are scary/clickbaity enough.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 10:11
  #17839 (permalink)  
 
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So one disgruntled employee in France tops his boss and tries to blow up the factory, and Arabs have been killing each other since time immemorial and killing anyone else who gets in their way. For this we should all panic ?
What about Tunisia? Left out Kuwait, the lefts side the Sunni have been blowing up shia's for a while now so situation normal.

Of course it can happen, but what is the likelihood in Australia?
Well thats the question. Most of the ones so far are fruitloops in the noise. But the question is what are the pros up to if at all? Frankely the worst ones will be well planned and where their least expected. If indeed there are any being planned. Since they have stated thats their goal, then it all comes down to capability.
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Old 27th Jun 2015, 10:15
  #17840 (permalink)  
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but what is the likelihood in Australia?
Worrals; I really hope for everyone`s sake that those words do not come back to bite you on the bum!
Or in other words I hope that some lunatic jihadist never succeeds in carrying out a major terror attack in Australia.

Australia Will Be Next and 2. one in twenty immigrants is a jihadist. Now maybe he's written a PhD on the subject and has oodles of evidence to back up those two very sweeping and scary statements, but if he does it sure wasn't mentioned.
Maybe he's actually pulled them out of the Book of Inflammatory Phrases that's issued to every 'expert' who appears on the morning breakfast programmes.
Agreed re your comment of the `expert.` However, playing devil`s advocate here; What if there is some slight truths to the statements?

I know one thing though; I would never ever rely on a typical beat Copper in South Australia to protect me with his (or her) issued sidearm, knowing just how well trained and profficient they are in the use of those firearms!
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