Jet Blast Topics that don't fit the other forums. Rules of Engagement apply.

Formula 1

Old 3rd Sep 2017, 12:19
  #6001 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Hampshire
Age: 72
Posts: 784
Watching qualifying yesterday, I had to chuckle at the commentator's remarks regarding Alonsos' grid place penalties, when he said "Alonso has so many penalties, he will have to start from Spa". It is heartening to see that both McLaren drivers have made some rapid progress. We just need to wait and see which lap will the Hondas give out!
KelvinD is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 12:38
  #6002 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Everett, WA
Age: 64
Posts: 2,654
I'm currently in Asia and been watching what I assume is the UK feed on Fox Sports. I'm jealous - Martin Brundle is great as a commentator. In the US we get David Hobbs, Steve Matchett, and Leigh Diffey. Hobbs (former F1 driver) and Matchett (Benneton mechanic when Michael Schumacher won championships) are competent to good - sometimes even brilliant. Leigh Diffey, not so much
But while Hobbs is far from bad, he's been out of the game for a long time - Brundle's comments tend to be far "fresher".
I wonder how the rest of the world views Will Buxton (he's done some post-qualifying interviews - including Spa as I recall - certainly better than whoever did Monza ). Buxton is the pit reporter for the US coverage and I have a bit of a love/hate opinion - sometimes he's great, other times it's 'what the f are you talking about.
BTW, I'm taking a Mulligan on my "Ferrari will be fortunate to make it on the podium at Monza" comment - I didn't realize that the Red Bulls would be starting behind due to the (expletive deleted) grid spot penalties (in my defense, I watched qualifying in the lounge without sound )
tdracer is online now  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 12:59
  #6003 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Hadlow
Age: 56
Posts: 592
This penalty thing is getting beyond ridiculous now. Hamilton was the only driver to start in the position he qualified in. They might just as well draw lots to determine the starting position.
Super VC-10 is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 13:19
  #6004 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Everett, WA
Age: 64
Posts: 2,654
This penalty thing is getting beyond ridiculous now.
Brundle had some great comments during the pre-race. It's one thing to discourage changing the power train every race (as was standard practice when he was driving) - it's a whole different story when people are starting at the back because something in the engine didn't last more than five races - and penalize the team, NOT the driver...
I watched the pre-race in the lounge (they let me chose the channel) but went to my room for the race as having sound is rather nice. A Dutch fellow came up and wanted to know what channel we were watching. I happily gave him the relevant information, but he took minor offence when referred to "Mad Max". Bet he was mightily upset in th early laps.
BTW, rather unrelated, how do Europeans/Brits pronounce "Petronas"? In the US we tend to say "Petron-as", but here they say "Petro-nas". Given Petronas is a Malaysian company, it's hard to dispute how they pronounce it, but was the American pronunciation unusual?
(yea, I know, pretty anal, but that goes with being an engineer)...
tdracer is online now  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 13:51
  #6005 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: east ESSEX
Posts: 3,527
tdr, if you want some real speed,go to `pursuit aviation`,and see Steve Hinton in `Voodoo` at 554mph.....
sycamore is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 13:59
  #6006 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Bali H'ai
Posts: 412
Petronas

Try Pe-tronas.
That's how it's pronounced in Malaysia.
Sultan Ismail is online now  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 15:39
  #6007 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Farnham, Surrey
Posts: 1,243
Originally Posted by Super VC-10 View Post
This penalty thing is getting beyond ridiculous now. Hamilton was the only driver to start in the position he qualified in.
I heard this comment made by several people, but all it means is that the car that qualified second got penalties. Any time the car on pole gets penalties NO ONE starts from the position they qualified in (u.less a strange permutation of penalties bumps someone back up again).

If we ant to have penalties being the exception rather than the rule but still want to discourage the rich teams using 3 races per car per weekend (which is what happened in the "golden era" - one race for practice, one 10-mile sprint-spec engine of quali and one new 200-mile race spec for the race) then we could recognise that the teams aren't achieving the reliability they'd hoped for and go back to 6 engines a year. They could also get rid of the silly rule on gearboxes, or at least replace it with a fine. They could also stop levying penalties for replacing parts damaged in crashes.

The whole penalty thing is being blown out of proportion by the pathetic performance of Honda. This is their third year and they STILL haven't built a power system that has a 50% probability of surviving ONE race meeting, let alone 5, and despite that their engines are also at least 80BHP down on the competition due to excess friction and poor combustion design. They also seem to be struggle to design a hybrid system that can deploy power reliably. It's embarrassing to the point of humiliation so they should probably quit. The current Maclaren seems to be a very tidy car which is held back by this engine - if they get a decent one next year we could at least be spared the incessant spanish whining...

PDR

Last edited by PDR1; 3rd Sep 2017 at 15:53.
PDR1 is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 15:49
  #6008 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Farnham, Surrey
Posts: 1,243
Originally Posted by tdracer View Post
It's clear that Mercedes still has the upper hand with regard to power and straight line speed. It says a lot for the Ferrari (and Vettel) that they can run with the Mercedes while being pretty obviously down on horsepower.
Originally Posted by PDR1 View Post
From the Spa performance I'd have said that the Ferrari is pretty much on a par with the Merc for power
Well from the race it would seem that you were right and I was way off! Mercedes claim their new engine is a reliability upgrade, but they clearly had a large power or speed advantage. OK, so it's easy to overtake at Monza, but even so the ease with which Valtiry breezed past the others to take up his shotgun position was impressive, as was the way they extended and maintained such a huge lead apparently with engines turned down...

I wonder if they are sandbagging about Singapore. Everyone at Mercedes takes every opportunity to announce to the world that they will be lucky to get points at Singapore. I think they're laying it on a bit thick, myself. I guess we'll see in a couple of weeks.

PDR
PDR1 is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 16:39
  #6009 (permalink)  
Resident insomniac
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: N54 58 34 W02 01 21
Age: 75
Posts: 1,859
Originally Posted by PDR1 View Post
Mercedes claim their new engine is a reliability upgrade, but they clearly had a large power or speed advantage.
Reliability upgrades mean that they can (more reliably) increase the power.

Many years ago I was involved on the periphery of a project to create a DKW racing engine (for saloon car racing).
Achieving increased power wasn't that difficult, but it was usually short-lived.
G-CPTN is offline  
Old 4th Sep 2017, 08:03
  #6010 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Farnham, Surrey
Posts: 1,243
Originally Posted by PDR1 View Post
Well from the race it would seem that you were right and I was way off! Mercedes claim their new engine is a reliability upgrade, but they clearly had a large power or speed advantage.

Actually I'm going to retract part of that. Having watched bits of the highlights (quali and race) again whilst making supper last night I think the bigger/biggest influence was tyres. Mercedes in general and Lewis in particular seemed to find setups that turned the tyres on more effectively than Ferrari in both the dry AND the wet. And I think both Lewis and Toto have made this quite clear whenever they speak to the press - they keep saying it has been about finding ways to better optimise what they have rather than having more to play with.

PDR
PDR1 is offline  
Old 4th Sep 2017, 08:40
  #6011 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: last time I looked I was still here.
Posts: 4,509
And back to watching racing: did you see F2 race 2 and the battle for 7th. In the last 5-10 laps that was real wheel to wheel stuff with even a bit of opposite locking thrown in for good measure.
There were also some fisty-cuffs in the F1, in the lower orders. Never saw LH or Bottas for the whole race after about lap 10. They were in another country.
RAT 5 is offline  
Old 4th Sep 2017, 09:22
  #6012 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Farnham, Surrey
Posts: 1,243
Yep - some superb racing from Ricciardo, Vestapen and a few others. Valtiry's run to the front was quite fun as well.

PDR
PDR1 is offline  
Old 4th Sep 2017, 12:09
  #6013 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Hadlow
Age: 56
Posts: 592
Christian Horner: 'This engine has done nothing positive for Formula 1' | F1 News
Super VC-10 is offline  
Old 10th Sep 2017, 10:09
  #6014 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Farnham, Surrey
Posts: 1,243
As opposed to the preceding few years when every year was won by Horner's own team, I suppose...

"Can someone call room service and get Mr Horner a couple of kilos of sugar to go with his grapes please"

PDR
PDR1 is offline  
Old 10th Sep 2017, 10:18
  #6015 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Farnham, Surrey
Posts: 1,243
Singapore and Mercedes-Patronas

Is it just me, or does anyone else think Mercedes are laying it on a bit thick about how they will struggle to stay with the back markers in Singapore?

We all know that it's an aero track which benefits cars which perform in bad air, and we already know that for the last couple of years their car has done badly there. But we've had Toto saying they will do badly there, and then we had Niki briefing the same thing. Now we've had Valtiry briefing that "they have no special upgrades to take to Singapore", and Lewis has briefed that "he will do his due diligence, but has no serious prospect of a result".

We believe we already know all this, so why the detailed briefs - do we really need so much "expectation management"? I am beginning to wonder if they're actually sandbagging about something and are lulling RB and the Reds into a false sense of security...

PDR
PDR1 is offline  
Old 10th Sep 2017, 16:00
  #6016 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Andalucia
Posts: 717
From "Autosport"


Sainz Renault deal sets up McLaren Honda changes



Carlos Sainz has signed a deal to join Renault and trigger a series of domino changes that will secure McLaren the French car manufacturer's engines for 2018, Autosport has learned.
While news of McLaren's progress in its efforts to switch from Honda engines has not been forthcoming in public, behind-the-scenes developments have been taking place that appear to show it has succeeded.
High level sources have confirmed that Sainz's deal has been agreed as part of a sweetener for Renault to end its Toro Rosso contract early.
With the Sainz deal arranged, that has opened the way for Toro Rosso to finalise a switch to Honda engines for next year, which in turn ensures McLaren will get hold of a supply of customer Renault power units for 2018.
After a frantic Italian Grand Prix weekend, where discussions to sort the McLaren-Honda situation were intense, it emerged that Sainz was becoming a key part of the equation.
Renault indicated that it wanted some incentive to switch its customer supply from Toro Rosso to McLaren.
With Sainz, it has a promising youngster that to run alongside Nico Hulkenberg to help its efforts to move up the grid.
Although the provisional deal is for 2018, sources have suggested that Sainz could join Renault as early as this year's Malaysian Grand Prix if the outfit elects not to continue with Jolyon Palmer.
If that development happens from Sepang, then it is likely that Pierre Gasly will be given the call-up to join Daniil Kvyat at Toro Rosso.
No firm decision has been taken regarding Sainz's full-time replacement for 2018, but one contender would be Honda junior driver Nobuharu Matsushita, who will likely be released from his McLaren development driver role.
However, Matsushita does not yet have enough superlicence points to be able to race in F1, and needs to have a strong end to his 2017 Formula 2 campaign to secure third place in the championship to get the required 40 points to step up.
The Sainz-Renault deal has cleared the way for Toro Rosso to complete a switch to Honda engines, with the Faenza-based team also taking a supply of McLaren gearboxes for the to use with the Japanese company's power unit.
Once the Toro Rosso-Honda agreement has been finalised, then the final issue to be sorted will be McLaren's Renault contract - although that will then likely be a formality.
It is thought that all the deals will be completed by the start of next week, to ensure that announcements can be made ahead of the Singapore Grand Prix.


So that's the end of Palmer's F1 career then.
Wodrick is offline  
Old 10th Sep 2017, 16:21
  #6017 (permalink)  
Resident insomniac
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: N54 58 34 W02 01 21
Age: 75
Posts: 1,859
Interesting - if true (I am not doubting it).
G-CPTN is offline  
Old 10th Sep 2017, 16:25
  #6018 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Andalucia
Posts: 717
Don't think Autosport would print it otherwise, they have declined to print some things that others did that turned out false in the past. And it probably is the only way out. Think it's a bit hard on Torro Rosso unless Honda suddenly find the magic bullet.
Wodrick is offline  
Old 10th Sep 2017, 16:40
  #6019 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Clarty Waters, UK
Age: 54
Posts: 910
Originally Posted by PDR1 View Post
Is it just me, or does anyone else think Mercedes are laying it on a bit thick about how they will struggle to stay with the back markers in Singapore?

We all know that it's an aero track which benefits cars which perform in bad air, and we already know that for the last couple of years their car has done badly there.
I seem to recall Nico Rosberg won the race in his Mercedes last year.
Andy_S is offline  
Old 11th Sep 2017, 05:58
  #6020 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Everett, WA
Age: 64
Posts: 2,654
I'm in Singapore at the moment (no, I'm not staying for the race - tempting until I think about how much it would cost) - in fact spent part of the day in the Marina area where track preparations readily obvious.
Something no one has been talking about (at least that I've seen), it's rained every day I've been here - often quite hard. If it's wet for qualifying and/or the race it could really throw the proverbial wrench in some teams plans.

BTW PRD, someone who should know what he's talking about thinks the Mercedes has a clear power advantage - his name is Lewis Hamilton.
tdracer is online now  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.