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UK politics - Hamsterwheel

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UK politics - Hamsterwheel

Old 6th May 2018, 15:14
  #14361 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
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strong and stable Coalition
Remind me of what happened to one of the parties at the next election.
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Old 6th May 2018, 15:32
  #14362 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Fareastdriver View Post
Remind me of what happened to one of the parties at the next election.
Oh, absolutely, but that doesn't alter the fact that the Coalition was strong and stable compared to the following two weak and wobbly governments.

At the special conference I voted to go into the Coalition government (don't recall what the Tory decision making process was, but ours was to call a special conference; elected reps only had votes in those days, but now it would be one member one vote for anyone who chose to turn up). Would I have done so knowing what I do now? - actually I don't know.
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Old 7th May 2018, 13:48
  #14363 (permalink)  
 
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Remind me of what happened to one of the parties at the next election.

Same could be asked of UKIP, those instigators of the dubiously misrepresenting Brexit campaign. That is not a comment for or against Brexit; it is about the honesty of the campaign on both sides. UKIP was the catalyst and strongest proponent of Brexit and then disappeared at the ballot box. Interestingly, at that election T.May emphasised it was not a for/against Brexit vote. That had been decided. One wonders what UKIP's attitude to that election was, before the debacle. It could be suggested that the motivators of Brexit were thrown out in no uncertain fashion. The conclusion was.............?????
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Old 7th May 2018, 14:13
  #14364 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by RAT 5 View Post
The conclusion was.............?????

Their job was done?
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Old 7th May 2018, 14:49
  #14365 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Highway1 View Post
Their job was done?
Spot on. Probably the most successful political party in history. They had one aim and they achieved it. No longer required but a 100% success rate nonetheless.
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Old 7th May 2018, 15:04
  #14366 (permalink)  
 
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Bit like the male of the black widow spider.
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Old 8th May 2018, 15:58
  #14367 (permalink)  
 
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The trouble with UKIP is/was that there is no responsibility for anything and therefore its not really very democratic is it.

And are the Conservative party trying to destroy Britain.? i know many conservatives believe that they are the only really loyal party and that labour are secretly or openly trying to sell us out to the Russians and that the Libs are well just bad people, I read that in the daily mail so it must be right , yes?.

But when it comes down to it , it seems it is the Conservative party trying to tear itself and Britain apart over the Eu.. I mean, after today shouldn't Mother T have just called Boris and said don't even bother coming over just walk away before security take you away.. Then there is Boris himself a complete idiot willing to wreck the countries economy for a chance at being PM.
Michael Gove , already tried it but failed
Home Sec Sajid Javed already has his sights on the top job.
Hammond too boring
Amber Rudd err.........
Fox , Davies too old too useless
Hunt- no chance being a smug, rhymes with name, and has messed up NHS
Rees-Mogg ., bizarrely often quoted although a complete nobody , unlikely , as his advocating a return to serfdom and feudalismare too extreme even for the shire parties

Cabinet split. Stayers vs Quitters
Party split. Same lines but without understanding much of it

Time for another General Election ? Another general election?/ if you can have so many general election then why not another referendum

So after all those years of ' We put Britain first' the Tories end up putting Britain last
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Old 8th May 2018, 16:23
  #14368 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by pax britanica View Post
The trouble with UKIP is/was that there is no responsibility for anything and therefore its not really very democratic is it.

Time for another General Election ? Another general election?/ if you can have so many general election then why not another referendum

So after all those years of ' We put Britain first' the Tories end up putting Britain last

Another referendum about what ??

No....Don't tell me....Let me guess.....

Actually, it's not too difficult to guess....That's the way the EU does business - always has and if left to yourself, presumably always will.

Yawn....
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Old 8th May 2018, 16:57
  #14369 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by pax britanica View Post
But when it comes down to it , it seems it is the Conservative party trying to tear itself and Britain apart over the Eu..
Errr..

Emily Thornberry: Norway EU option won't work - BBC News

Believe me, Labour are every bit as divided. They're just in the luxurious position of not having to take responsibility for delivering Brexit.
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Old 8th May 2018, 17:05
  #14370 (permalink)  
 
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Iím definitely 100% in favour of another referendum. However not on membership of the EU that has already been decided despite huge efforts to derail it.

The next one should be on the future of the House of Lords. The question should be simple Abolish it or not.

If the result is to abolish the following should apply.

It should be replaced with a new elected body consisting of one third politicians from parties based on their representation in the commons.

One third ordinary members of the public elected locally.

One third a mix of legal and business people.

The term of office should be fixed to coincide with the Parliamentary cycle.

No titles would be attached to these people other than during their term of office which may be Senator or similar.
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Old 8th May 2018, 17:07
  #14371 (permalink)  
 
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Not really news though is it..as has been mentioned a few posts back as far as Labour is concerned the current situation suits Mr Corbyn quite nicely......

Fundamentally on one side of the House of Commons we have a party being steered by a minority of hard core MPs being supported by individuals with perhaps dubious methods and no doubt hidden motives.

On the other side we have Labour and Momentum...

I’m not sure the interests of the country really Is on either groups agenda.
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Old 8th May 2018, 18:01
  #14372 (permalink)  
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Well done Boris ! ......in God we may well trust, but, unfortunately, not you.....
The epitome of Tory cohesion really...

Boris Johnson and the politics of Brexit - BBC News
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Old 8th May 2018, 18:17
  #14373 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by pax britanica View Post

So after all those years of ' We put Britain first' the Tories end up putting Britain last
How does that work when they are trying to implement the result of the referendum - how would ignoring what the electorate voted for put Britain first?
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Old 8th May 2018, 18:25
  #14374 (permalink)  
 
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The word is appallingly overused in politics but, let's put it in capitals, it is UNPRECEDENTED for a senior member of the government to pour such scorn on their government's own plan; one they themselves signed up to not so long ago.
Not convinced about that claim. In the 1975 referendum it was Government Policy to remain in the EEC yet both Tony Benn and Peter Shore were Ministers in that Government and campaigned against the policy.
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Old 8th May 2018, 18:26
  #14375 (permalink)  
 
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As I've said before, BREXIT really is the best example to date of how the EU is like a computer virus.

It gets into member countries' Operating System, and you can't control it as it takes over bit by bit, lot by lot, virtually everything that country wants to do - and you can't just get rid of the annoying bits. The only way to get rid of it is to delete and then reload your complete operating system which is what the UK is now having to do.

But the strange thing is, the UK is now stuck with a pro-EU Prime Minister who is trying to lead the UK out of the EU, whilst Corbyn and his mates are fervently anti-EU but have to be seen to be opposing everything the anti-EU politicos are trying to do. Add on a couple of non-entities like that foreign woman ( whose name I forget ) and the irrelevant Lib Dems and Scots Nats, plus the slimey Blair, and the EU are just pis*sing themselves laughing and congratulating themselves on making it virtually impossible for any country to leave without tearing itself apart.

At least the UK doesn't have to deal with the nightmare of trying to introduce a replacement currency - imagine that on the agenda as well !!
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Old 8th May 2018, 18:33
  #14376 (permalink)  
 
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The reason I am singling out the Tories is because they and their mouthpieces are the ones always accusing labour and Lib dems as somehow being less patricotic.

ia gree Corbyn is focussing on what best for him , though I am not sure thatw ill work but we may get another hung parliament

Of course doing the right thing and putting the country first is disasterous for a party as evidenced by the Lib Dem massacre after the coalition.

Like the media icannot understand why Boris wasnt sacked outright and if there ares till fissuers in the aprty then if I am was Mrs M I would slope quielty off to the palace and call another election and et her see how her right wing 'friends' like that.

As always in Uk we suffer from lurches of left to right. A tory aprty that apys too much attention to its daft old buggers wing and alaboutr party that pays too much attention to its deep Red wing. Whereas we would be much betetr served witha Moderate tory plus moderate labour centrist government that had more in common with Josephine public than either of the current parties do.

And as for the Eu , it has nt been decided and probably never will be until we rejoin it and in the Euro in 2025-30 when a reasonable number of the quitters are dead or gaga and we are mostly a lot poorer.
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Old 8th May 2018, 22:56
  #14377 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by vctenderness View Post
One third ordinary members of the public elected locally.
Ha ha. You ever tried to get elected to public office (beyond, perhaps, a school governor's position) without a party machine? And in what way are politicians not "ordinary members of the public elected locally" anyway?
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Old 9th May 2018, 07:34
  #14378 (permalink)  
 
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........those not part of a political party actually. Bit of a revolutionary idea I know but hey ho!
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Old 9th May 2018, 11:13
  #14379 (permalink)  
 
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Interesting report about what the electorate thinks about business-related topics. Slides 22-25 show an interesting conundrum in that a lot of voters like Labour policies as long as they donít know they are Labour policies!

Britain Thinks survey
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Old 9th May 2018, 12:22
  #14380 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by vctenderness View Post
........those not part of a political party actually. Bit of a revolutionary idea I know but hey ho!
Like I said, ever tried it?

Assuming a new HoL around the same size of the HoC, and a third elected, each constituency would be the size of three current constituencies. How TF do you shove paper through 120k (say) letter boxes without a party machine? - the only other option is to be rich enough to pay a delivery service, which would rule out "ordinary" members of the public. (Yes I know that for parliamentary elections you get the freepost, and one might reasonably assume the same would apply for HoL elections, but you don't win an election on a single leaflet and you've still got to pay to have it printed.)
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