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UK politics - Hamsterwheel

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UK politics - Hamsterwheel

Old 20th Mar 2018, 08:37
  #13901 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Hampshire
Age: 73
Posts: 798
Nope, you're wrong. The plans date back several years.
I would disagree with that assertion. Trawling back through history, I found that Vince Cable, in the heady days of coalition did indeed announce additional funding for Porton Down in 2014. The funding was for £12M for the science park at Porton. Given the aim of the funding (training, research and development for businesses dealing in life sciences and health care) and seems in fact to have been a bung for the company currently operating Porton Down, Defence Solutions Ltd., a private limited company. Williamson's sudden promise of funding appears to have no real basis, historically.
However, my point was and remains, the ability of the government to suddenly find £48M down the back of the sofa as a result of this one incident, when they can not find additional funding for the police when people are being murdered wholesale is depressing. In fact, let's go a bit further and point out how the government have made the task of the police harder by closing down in-house forensic services in an effort to reduce spending.
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Old 20th Mar 2018, 09:05
  #13902 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: West Wiltshire, UK
Age: 67
Posts: 378
Originally Posted by KelvinD View Post
I would disagree with that assertion. Trawling back through history, I found that Vince Cable, in the heady days of coalition did indeed announce additional funding for Porton Down in 2014. The funding was for £12M for the science park at Porton. Given the aim of the funding (training, research and development for businesses dealing in life sciences and health care) and seems in fact to have been a bung for the company currently operating Porton Down, Defence Solutions Ltd., a private limited company. Williamson's sudden promise of funding appears to have no real basis, historically.
However, my point was and remains, the ability of the government to suddenly find £48M down the back of the sofa as a result of this one incident, when they can not find additional funding for the police when people are being murdered wholesale is depressing. In fact, let's go a bit further and point out how the government have made the task of the police harder by closing down in-house forensic services in an effort to reduce spending.

OK, a quick recap as to how Trading Funds work. DSTL is a Trading Fund, which means that it earns revenue by selling services to government, at set prices. When it was DRA, then DERA, it could sell services outside of government, too, but when Qinetiq was forked off to the private sector, DSTL was retained as a Trading Fund as long as it didn't compete with Qinetiq.

Being a Trading Fund means that DSTL receives no "grant" funding from government, has no annual government dictated budget and so has to earn sufficient revenue from the sale of it's services to both cover all it's operating costs and earn a modest profit (called a fee, in Trading Fund terms) in order to build a capital fund for future investments, cover unexpected costs etc. Salaries and bonuses paid to those employed by Trading Funds are not set by government, but are set by the Trading Funds themselves, as a balance between what is affordable and what is needed to attract the right calibre of staff.

In the case of DSTL, it was allowed to build up a surplus investment fund to pay for new facilities that were required. It did this over several years, with new labs, office accommodation, replacement of equipment and a large rationalisation programme that closed places like Farnborough, Bedford, Malvern, Winfrith and most recently Fort Halstead, and relocated the staff and facilities from those establishments to the two main sites DSTL now operates from, it's HQ at Porton Down, plus another large establishment at Portsdown West, on the hill above Portsmouth.

One problem with all Trading Funds is that they are wholly owned by government, so whilst they operate semi-autonomously, with a Chairman, board of directors, their own finance and banking arrangements and a chief executive, just like any medium sized company, central government can decide to intervene. It very rarely does, and I only know of one case where this happened.

Shortly before I retired, central government chose to intervene, specifically the Treasury, and took £20M from the investment fund for the new lab facilities, as an "interest free loan" from DSTL to the government - A bit like robbing a pension fund, in principle. I can fully understand the reason behind this - austerity was being introduced and government was grabbing money from wherever it could. This set back the refurbishment and rebuilding of the labs for around 2 to 3 years, whilst DSTL built up the funds again to meet the capital expenditure.

What seems to have happened is that the government may have chosen not to raid the DSTL investment fund again, and may even have decided to pay back the old £20M loan they took around 7 years ago.

One thing is clear, central government is not directly paying for the refurbishment and new lab build, as that had already been planned, and money set aside for for some years.

The Science Park is not a DSTL facility, it is a separate "company" with it's own boundary fence and entrance. It does have one or two DSTL senior staff as directors, but that is really associated with the Ploughshares programme, a way of spinning off unclassified government funded research into the private sector. The Science Park is primarily a private sector organisation.
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Old 20th Mar 2018, 14:20
  #13903 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
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Corbyn says he would do business with Russia.

Cob Corbyn: "Here Vlad, test these nerve agent samples and let us know what you think?"

Vlad: "Well agent Cob, we tested them and they are definitely nothing to do with us."

Cob Corbyn: "Just as I thought Vlad, carry on (PS, is my cheque in the post?)."
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Old 20th Mar 2018, 16:52
  #13904 (permalink)  
 
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Didn't Thatcher once famously utter something about being able to do business with Gorbachev?
VP: Thanks for the update. I have since found I may have confused DSTL with Defence Solutions Ltd. Mea culpa! Having said that, I also found the science park is a joint venture between 3 partners, 1 of which is DSTL.
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Old 20th Mar 2018, 17:06
  #13905 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Manchester, England
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And of course who can forget Nigel Farage’s statement that Putin is the world leader that he most admired.
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Old 20th Mar 2018, 18:10
  #13906 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
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Originally Posted by KelvinD View Post
Didn't Thatcher once famously utter something about being able to do business with Gorbachev?
And she could. It's a bit sad that he ended up doing book signings for a living (my wife went and shook hands and got a book signed).
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Old 20th Mar 2018, 18:28
  #13907 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
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Originally Posted by Curious Pax View Post
And of course who can forget Nigel Farage’s statement that Putin is the world leader that he most admired.
because he was running rings around the EU - although admittedly a low bar..
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Old 20th Mar 2018, 18:33
  #13908 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Gertrude the Wombat View Post
And she could. It's a bit sad that he ended up doing book signings for a living (my wife went and shook hands and got a book signed).
isnt that what all ex-politicians do?



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Old 20th Mar 2018, 18:53
  #13909 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by KelvinD View Post
Didn't Thatcher once famously utter something about being able to do business with Gorbachev?

“The most puzzling development in politics during the last decade is the apparent determination of Western European leaders to re-create the Soviet Union in Western Europe.”

Mikhail Gorbachev.
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Old 22nd Mar 2018, 07:56
  #13910 (permalink)  
Thought police antagonist
 
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As is now well established here on JB, the police forces across the UK rank alongside the BBC when it comes to outrage and condemnation ...you know the sort of thing....wasting time and resources by prosecuting innocent motorists for doing 70mph in a 30mph zone and setting up speed cameras to trap those for whom any speed limit is an inconvenient breach of their rights to drive as they wish irrespective of other road users.

One force however did get a special mention for providing an inter-County taxi service no less. The police being noted for providing this service to all and sundry as we know and, as both my BiL's are former career officers, in different forces, and agreed they had taken people home locally, and to a place of safety from road incidents / accidents, they were intrigued to learn they should also have been providing this service across the UK during their respective 30 year careers.

Which leads to a conundrum for many on here.

How to reconcile funding cuts regarding police resources and time whilst blaming Labour for their implementation ....


https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...dget-cuts-bite

Last edited by Krystal n chips; 22nd Mar 2018 at 08:13.
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Old 22nd Mar 2018, 12:15
  #13911 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: UK
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Hilarious!!
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a8267761.html


Britain's post-Brexit blue passport, intended as an icon of the UK's regained independence from Europe, is set to be manufactured by a Franco-Dutch firm, according to reports.

The contract to produce the documents is reportedly close to being awarded to Gemalto after the company undercut rival bids by around £50m.

The development is expected to enrage Leavers already uneasy about the protracted nature of negotiations between London and Brussels over the UK's withdrawal from the European Union (EU).

Tory MP Sir Bill Cash, chairman of the Commons European Scrutiny Committee, branded such a move “completely wrong and unnecessary”.
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Old 22nd Mar 2018, 12:35
  #13912 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Clarty Waters, UK
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Presumably, since we are still in the EU, these sort of contracts have to go out to public tender? And any EU company can then bid?

It may seem ironic, but I’m not sure there’s a whole lot we can do about it.
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Old 22nd Mar 2018, 18:23
  #13913 (permalink)  
 
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Anybody still under the delusion that Labour is not a festering gang of Jew haters?

https://www.thejc.com/news/uk-news/l...posts-1.461237

Suspended? What do they have to do before they are booted straight out?
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Old 22nd Mar 2018, 18:35
  #13914 (permalink)  
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
 
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I see Jeremy has had to resign from a second of his favourite Facebook groups. Wonder which one be next.

As Jeremy said about Facebook only this afternoon.

Jeremy Corbyn has said he will not be closing down his Facebook page after revelations about the site allowing the massive misuse of user data by a consultancy firm. Launching Labour’s local election campaign in Greater Manchester, Corbyn, who has almost 1.4 million followers on Facebook, said social media was important for him to broadcast his message without “moderation” from the media.....

https://order-order.com/2018/03/22/c...acebook-group/
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Old 22nd Mar 2018, 23:20
  #13915 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: UK
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Anybody still under the delusion that Labour is not a festering gang of Jew haters?

No more or less than any other main stream political party.
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Old 24th Mar 2018, 08:48
  #13916 (permalink)  
Thought police antagonist
 
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Not the most astute piece of leadership really...

Labour MPs attack sacking of Owen Smith over Brexit - BBC News

However, it does show, that, unlike the in name only leader opposite, he does have control over his party.

Some of you may experience palpitations at this point...
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Old 24th Mar 2018, 09:21
  #13917 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
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Originally Posted by TURIN View Post
No more or less than any other main stream political party.
Corbyn's anti-Semitic past keeps rearing its ugly head.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...isemitic-mural

The chant, "Oh, Jeremy Corbyn" becomes, "Oh dear, Jeremy Corbyn".
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Old 24th Mar 2018, 09:39
  #13918 (permalink)  
 
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This is partly the reason for my being against Corbyn as party leader. He was an excellent backbencher, equally happy to hold the feet of MPs from either party to the fire. Given the acrimony during Smith's challenge for the leadership in 2015, I was surprised that Smith had been appointed for a second time to the front bench.
The point of his having control over his party is perfectly valid though. Although he could be creating further problems for himself when, after sacking more of his front bench, he finds the pool of available talented MPs for the front bench is getting smaller.
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Old 24th Mar 2018, 13:07
  #13919 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Southwold
Age: 68
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I see this becoming an increasing problem in both main political parties. The Labour shadow cabinet is riddled with lightweights, meanwhile the government have Boris and Gavin Wiiliamson clearly promoted to positions way above their capability.

Corbyn is IMHO a complete loon. His instinct is indeed anti Semitic but he and McDonell have successfully inplemented a policy of capture within the party, moving their people into all the positions of power.
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Old 24th Mar 2018, 13:29
  #13920 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
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Originally Posted by KelvinD View Post
The point of his having control over his party is perfectly valid though. Although he could be creating further problems for himself when, after sacking more of his front bench, he finds the pool of available talented MPs for the front bench is getting smaller.
He is certainly running out of viable MPś willing to serve under him - he gets through more staff than Donald Trump.
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