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Police, the Law, Crime & Everything (merging)

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Police, the Law, Crime & Everything (merging)

Old 9th Jan 2006, 20:38
  #61 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: London
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Re: Police apparent non-compliance with traffic laws

If there's a legal answer, I don't know it.
I've often wondered the same thing myself, particularly when I see police vehicles parked outside shops and police officer(s) inside shopping.
The same thing happens outside many courts. Other users have to find a car-park or parking space. Police in official vehicles simply park outside.
Maybe there's some police rule (as opposed to a law)? Or maybe it's simply that neither other police officers nor traffic wardens give them a ticket.
I feel even more irritated when I see traffic warden or clamping/towaway vehicles parked for the same purpose.
Flying Lawyer is offline  
Old 9th Jan 2006, 20:48
  #62 (permalink)  
 
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Re: Caught Speeding, See here...

Its all a scam on the part of the police and the government,neither of which have a clue what goes on the modern world,hence the shocking amount of unsolved crime,and the general lack of common sense used by bliar and his merry band of n*bheads.

Money making is the name of the game hence why we have these outdated laws/highway code,look at the braking distances they give for gawds sake,based on a ford anglia or some similar prehistoric relic,modern cars especially high performance ones will stop from 60 in less distance than one of those would from 30.

Look at germany-some of the safest roads around even the unlimited bits of autobahn,all due to good driver training and modern rules.
If the muppets in charge want to keep these cameras etc then instead of paying for bliars pointless schemes and the police christmas party they should invest it in other ways,e.g better training for new drivers etc,subsidised by the revenue generated.

Its about time the motorway speed limit was finally raised to 90,would not cause any increase in accidents since everybody goes that speed now,and it is a limit that could be policed in a zero tolerance manner since you will be in 3 figures if you are exceeding it. Much as I like the speed limit to be an average rather than a limit this would solve a lot of arguing and for the government at least-get the persecuted motorists off their back for a while.

Rant over
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 21:13
  #63 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Bri
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Re: Police apparent non-compliance with traffic laws

Here we go again....
HappyHampster,
you are entittled to your opinion but, your words are a bit strong mate.
At the end of it all, if you cut me I will bleed as I am a real person, before you abuse critisise and accuse walk a mile in my shoes.
Elvis Presley said that one!
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 21:14
  #64 (permalink)  
 
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Re: Police apparent non-compliance with traffic laws

The Police, Military and the other Emergency Services must comply with all traffic laws in exactly the same way as Joe Public and their drivers risk prosecution in exactly the same way!

The only legitimate argument that can be used in their defence, AFAIK, is when they are responding to an emergency call on "Blues and Twos" - and even then they are required to act prudently with the safety of pedestrians and other road users of paramount importance!!!

If policemen act dangerously (I nearly had a head on collision with one p**** a couple of years ago) it is your duty to report it!!! I didn't insist on prosecution (although the visiting Inspector said if I wished, the driver would be charged) - I was quite happy for the Inspector to give the pc driver a good old bollocking!!! The driver later visited my house, with the passenger pc, and apologised over a cup of tea.

Beware, though, of getting out of their way when they are on "Blues and Twos" - if you enter a Bus Lane to get out of their way, you still get the £80 fine!!! I was told quite clearly by Croydon Town Council that I had to pay the fine, despite getting out of the way for an Ambulance and a Police Car on a 999 call!!!
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 21:25
  #65 (permalink)  
 
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Re: Caught Speeding, See here...

Of course, I admit to nothing, but a tin of Blackfriars Black Enamel paint can coat the lenses of about 6 speed cameras!!! A pint of meths and a roll of lint can roast a camera nicely and provide enough torchlight to read by for about three minutes!!! An angle-grinder in the right hands can sever the post holding a speed camera in about two minutes!!!

Motorists Against Detection - WE CAN FIGHT BACK!!!
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 21:25
  #66 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Re: Police apparent non-compliance with traffic laws

I am refering to an individual - If he was in the right, it would have been " hands up guv, you got me ! " - I was right, he was mistaken and he knew that. He has abused his position of trust with deliberation. I stand by what I have said and I know ther are good coppers out there and I know the ludicrous restrictions they face and their hands are often tied. OK - I've dumped the bit about signing up, but he was a little sh1t !!

HH
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 21:26
  #67 (permalink)  

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Re: Police apparent non-compliance with traffic laws

In New York City there are the regular police and then there are “Traffic Wardens”. These Traffic Wardens will have anybody’s vehicle ticketed and towed. I have seen New York City police cars towed with red faced cops yelling and screaming at the wardens. Great fun to watch that was.

Back in my old Marshal days a friend of mine had a United States Marshal Service car towed when he double parked it out side a Federal Building in New York City. The car had US Government Tags and an “Official US Government Business” card in the windshield. It was towed anyway and he had to pay the ticket and towing charges out of his pocket.

They would tow a fire truck.
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 21:34
  #68 (permalink)  
 
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Re: Police apparent non-compliance with traffic laws

TLT,

I understand from another thread that you are a serving police officer. Do you have an answer to the original question?

Aiglon
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 21:36
  #69 (permalink)  
 
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Re: Caught Speeding, See here...

Motorists Against Detection - DRIVE SLOWER YOU PR!CKS!!!
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 21:39
  #70 (permalink)  
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Re: Police apparent non-compliance with traffic laws

hh, I am sure that the situation is as outlined by chiglet (as you were probably aware at the time).

Unless, of course, it turns out to be summat else NL have tampered with!
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 21:46
  #71 (permalink)  
 
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Re: Police apparent non-compliance with traffic laws

Con- Pilot,

That is the situation here aswell...

Not so much in london but,

forces have/are doing away with traffic wardens employed as agents of the police and local councils are employing outside contractors to enforce parking, certainly in my force unless its an obstruction police do not bother with parking offences... We used to have an unwritten 12 minute rule meaning, as long as there was no obstruction a driver is given the opportunity to return to his vehicle penalty free...

These new outside wardens hide in shop doorways knowing that an offence will be committed then, when the driver is out of sight, bang... have that.

and the worst of all....

Private wheel clampers.

On a saturday night in Bristol night clubs employ these cowboys to clamp clubbers who park in their carpark.. I have know these lot charge £250.00 to release the clamp.

They are bang out of order but, its legal.....
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 21:52
  #72 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Re: Police apparent non-compliance with traffic laws

Aigon...

In law a police vehicle does have an exemption but, most forces have a policy that if you are not on official police business then you will face the same penalty as any member of the public.

I do know police officers that have been prosecuted and accepted the penalty but on the flip side, I know of police officers that have challenged a prosecution and won because of the exemption.

To be fair most police officers do take the piss a little but, lets be honest who in that postition would'nt.

I can agree that police officers should set an example.
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 22:08
  #73 (permalink)  
 
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Re: Caught Speeding, See here...

I've heard of M.A.D. but not D.S.Y.P.
Is that a new organisation?
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 22:11
  #74 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
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Re: Caught Speeding, See here...

Can anyone confirm what the codes endorsed on the Driving Licence mean?

EG SP30, SP40, TS10, etc.
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 22:17
  #75 (permalink)  
 
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Re: Caught Speeding, See here...

Here's a link to the list.

Endorsement Offence Codes

It also give the penalty points - or range of penalty points - which will (save in exceptional circumstances) be imposed.

(I don't agree with the Penalty Point system because I consider it unfair, but that's another issue. )

Last edited by Flying Lawyer; 9th Jan 2006 at 22:30.
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 22:21
  #76 (permalink)  
 
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Re: Police apparent non-compliance with traffic laws

happyhamster
A Royal Parks policeman, said I drove on a Zebra crossing when there was someone on it - yeah there was, on the opposing crossing on the other side of the central traffic island
taken from THE ZEBRA, PELICAN AND PUFFIN PEDESTRIAN CROSSINGS REGULATIONS 1997
Precedence of pedestrians over vehicles at Zebra crossings
25. - (1) Every pedestrian, if he is on the carriageway within the limits of a Zebra crossing, which is not for the time being controlled by a constable in uniform or traffic warden, before any part of a vehicle has entered those limits, shall have precedence within those limits over that vehicle and the driver of the vehicle shall accord such precedence to any such pedestrian.
(2) Where there is a refuge for pedestrians or central reservation on a Zebra crossing, the parts of the crossing situated on each side of the refuge for pedestrians or central reservation shall, for the purposes of this regulation, be treated as separate crossings.
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 22:27
  #77 (permalink)  
 
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Re: Police apparent non-compliance with traffic laws

TLT

Thanks for the (very frank and balanced) answer.

FWIW, I see no reason for the exemption for official business unless it's an emergency.
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 22:30
  #78 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Kent, UK
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Re: Police apparent non-compliance with traffic laws

To be honest, how many police "emergency" calls are really necesary?
Maybe a bank raid in progress? I don't know, I honestly can't think of many situations where their presence warrants getting there at all possible speed. Most calls are to ane event that has allready happened so why put the publics life at risk by speeding? it certainly won't help if a police car arrives at a road traffic accident a minute before than if it were obeying the speed limit would it? When they do arrive, when did you last see an officer directing traffic around the accident? lately never, too intersted in taking details in case they can get a prosecution.
Don't get me wrong I am not anti police, I think the good ones do a great job and manage to get through their careers without a blemish (I know a few) but there is a certain new element think as previously stated that the laws of the the road do not apply to them.
I must confess that if anything comes up behind me on blues and twos I will do whatever I can to give them a clear path, up the curb, in the bushes whatever but if it's a police car, sod em they can wait till it's convenient for me. As far as I'm concernerned the fire and the ambulance services are the only two real "[B]Emergency" services.
You all may think I've had many run ins with the police to appear so bitter but not so, I was done (quite rightly) for drink driving and again for speeding back in the 70's and don't hold a grudge but I honestly think the standards of driving and attitudes of the police force has seriously degeneratedover the last few years.
Rant over (for now!!!)
Jepps
p.s. can any police officer out there tell me how the local force vehicles are selected? I live in a south london suberb with no local motorway / dual carriageway but we regularly have a BMW 5 series pattroling the streets however my parents live in croydon, not well knon for its forests ans wide open spaces but the locals there have a land cruiser!
Go figure
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 22:31
  #79 (permalink)  

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Re: Caught Speeding, See here...

I admit to having recently driven at what I now know to have been excessive speed, just over a week ago. I was on a stretch of road with a 60 mph limit.

I was doing approximately 20 mph at the time when I briefly lost control of my car and clipped a nearside kerb quite hard.... I had taken what I thought were reasonable steps to drive safely by greatly reducing my speed in (very) poor weather conditions but I still got it wrong...

I have learned my lesson of course, next time in those circumstances I must go even more slowly. Falling snow on undetected black ice on an ungritted road on a shallow but tightening right hand corner with adverse camber. My fault entirely, lesson learned but no speeding ticket given, of course.

After the terrible road accident this weekend in Wales, killing a number of cyclists, I was rather surprised to hear the TV interview given by a senior policeman on scene. He said there was no evidence to suggest that excessive speed was a factor, because the car appeared to have been doing just 50 mph at the time, in a 60mph limit - on an icy road.

Is THIS now a function of the "speed camera mentality"? As long as you drive within the limit, you OUGHT to be perfectly safe and if you are NOT, it's officially a tragic accident and no-one's fault?
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Old 9th Jan 2006, 22:31
  #80 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
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Re: Police apparent non-compliance with traffic laws

Back in the days pre-privatised traffic wardens, I was informed that you may park in a restricted space such as a double yellow line if so directed by a police officer. The same police officer said that he could direct himself to park on restricted space. I know that there have been several road traffic acts since then.
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