As long as you don't screw up to much, they will upgrade anyone, that's how desperate the company are, regardless of good or bad CRM / DM.

I can not agree with you.Internal upgrade standarts are in a very high level and no matter how desperate they are for cpt's no one will get upgrade without sufficient knowledge including crm and dm.

Hi

I've been reading approx. half of this thread, and it looks like it's mainly about direct entry F/O
I would be interested in the cadet programme, fast track 1 option :
Integrated ATPL

Would you have an idea of the contract's conditions ?
What will the salary/roster be ? How many sectors/hours per month can we expect ?
How long before one can expect command upgrade ?
Is it possible to commute home for our days off ?

90k€ seems like a large amount to pay back on the kind of salaries that I saw on this topic (between 1600 and 2500€ at most)

Thank you

Slight correction Syntax Error

Wizz Air CTC options

Integrated ATPL = €128,800

Option 1 = €89,800

Option 2 = €79,800

Sorry but I have to say something here. I have been following this thread for a while and every time sb asks something here this Syntax Error replies within moments in a very negative and aggressive way. Man, that's scary. I would suggest for Syntax' wellbeing to go and find professional help and stop visiting pprune because so much frustration is bad for your health, seriously. Wish you all the best and hope that you find some joy in your life soon again.

So you see yourself as their Saviour, how nice of you, nothing said, please go on writing the same stuff every time somebody asks a question then 👍

Syntax : i am currently an engineer, working many more hours than 100 (i know pilots work time is also much higher than flying time but i still believe i work more hours as an engineer), earning approx' 2000€ before tax (maybe not the same before tax than eastern europe though), that is 1800€ after tax, with no possibility of evolution within my company, and just to poorly satisfy my desire for flying I spend 800€ per month.

I think i would prefer to have a job as a pilot paying 1600 in the winter and 2500 in the summer, with huge possibilities for raising my salary (going to easyjet with an unfrozen salary : twice or even thrice as more)

I asked the questions I asked because many people seemed to disagree with some piece of information that are crucial. I think i'm gonna ask CTC for their advice, see if they can constitute another source of information.

Plus, the topic you linked is titled MPL whereas i would enrol for an ATPL, which is not exactly the same.

To do 100 hours flying, you work around 150 - 200 hours FDP. You are not paid by the hour. You ALWAYS work when everybody else has holidays, because that is peak season for the airlines. You do not get extra pay to work these "special periods"
My job as an engineer is around that, but you can top it off with some hours spent in traffic !
Working when nobody does is actually a huge advantage if you don't have a wife/kids (which is my case and that could last). On december 24th (2015) i was visiting an air traffic control center and saying "merry christmas" to airplanes along with the few messages that the ATC allowed me to pass on frequency.

I've decided to stop waiting for a providential cadet programme and go on with my theoretical ATPL. In the worst case i'll get a cheap practical training from an eastern flight school and wash it (typical french saying) with an MCC/JOC from CTC.
This would also leave me the possibility of joining the fast track option 2, for a total of 90k

I know how to calculate a loan repayment, I coded my own loan calculator. I am an engineer, I know Excel :lol: .
Only data missing is : what are typical interest rates for aviation training loans ?

The salary after 10 years at Wizz will have increased to much more than 2500€... You're not arguing in good faith on that point.

The crucial information is the salary, its evolution over the years, and the amount left (after tax, or not if you dodged them..) at the end of each month to pay for living expenses + loan.

This is also a perfect opportunity to ask you that question :
Should i go with Wizzair or pay approx half as much and go for the cheapest modular training available ? (I heard it's around 20k for CPL IR ME)

Syntax, seriously, i just read your post about 8-10 years 2500 euro. Stop making drama! In only two years on the bus you have plenty of hours to go anywhere if you like. You are aggressive, negative and talking rubbish. Only reason you make more in eJ is because it's in western Europe and be honest, it's not the dream deal at all. I know because I worked there when you were probably licking wizzair interview team's asses to get a job as a zero flight time, no rating wannabe. And where are you now? Not because of Wizzair? Please stay objective and don't talk rubbish.

This kind of thinking drives down the terms and conditions. In those two years the terms and conditions for the airlines you want to go to are mostly likely to go down as well because they have to stay competitive with the low cost carriers.

If the pilots would stick together and refuse this ****ty T&C, eventually the carriers across the industry would have no choice but to improve them. The demand for pilots would still be there.

weeeeelll...... :}

in my opinion Syntax does sound a bit angry ;-) well you could also ask yourself why after such a long time somebody still feels so strong and negative about his ex employer... i don't want to speculate, but i do know quite a few people who share the same feeling, for different reasons perhaps but still.

on a more serious note, i agree, without being personal, that it is plain stupid to justify the downright illegal practices of many airlines with the opportunity of a possible career lift that such an airline might give to somebody otherwise either not suitable or not experienced enough for the job

we really need, and i am now not talking about Wizz Air, a wake up call and a change in our sheepish mentality, and we must stop feeling like we must be grateful to have the opportunity to fly an airplane.

i am sorry, but this is not a professional mindset

its a hard job and it takes a lot of you and your life to do it right and it should be properly compensated for

like the Ryanair boss said, once a pilot asked him why he treats pilots so bad. the answer was: "BECAUSE THEY LET ME"

all those hot-shots starting low-cost carriers and disrupting the market are actually getting excited with how much they can get away with both in terms of cutting costs and bending the rules

i would be laughing too when i try and offer some ridiculously low price that i would never imagine being accepted for something that i want and getting the thing without bargaining. that's a thrill!

so yes, Wizz air is what it is, but the problem is US, the pilots

Sometimes I miss the "Like" button.

Yes I fully agree, where they use us, we should use them but I must say conditions are getting better every day. Every pilot should use his brain, if they wish not to do that, that's their choice and you can't shoot airlines for (ab)using that. That's capitalism and a whole discussion on it's own..

And to respond to the gentlemen talking about we should not accept these conditions. This is only if everybody would be on the same level. I met people stuck in a certain airline on a certain scale just because they didn't make the grade, just like in any other profession. If you are that sharp pilot with incredible standards, the world is your oyster. If not, well sfo in a low cost based at home is not that bad, is it? And also like all professions, you have to start somewhere.,

If you have read some of the posts, you will know that they "trick" you, to believe the Swiss tax is sufficient, but they are not fully open that the double tax treaty means you will be paying full tax in your country of residence.

This is not true. They make it clear that it depends on your country of residence whether if you have to pay additional income tax there.
Also it is not true that double tax treaty means you will be paying full tax at home. It can mean that, but most of the time you do not have to pay tax at home. It depends on what is the content of the double treaty agreement between your home country and Switzerland. And it is not always the same.

Quite interestingly: just doing customer satisfaction training with my present airline... (what? certainly an off topic in Wizz Air thread)

And in fact, all it says about retaining customers, applies to retaining employees:

It is 5 x 6 times cheaper to retain a customer than to gain a new one; loosing a customer costs much more than just the revenue lost: dissatisfied customers will take any opportunity to make negative propaganda for the company, either talking to friends, or publicly on the internet... ;-)

And, finally, if the company doesn't listen to the customer, the customer will find somebody who will listen outside of the company.

Wizz Air - time to learn! :D

Can someone explain to me how the roster is out of some of the smaller bases? For instance how easy is it to get a FO or Capt position in Belgrade (assuming I have the right to live and work there?). For a small base like this with only a few routes is that all one can expect to fly or they manage to make 4 sector days through the rest of the network or with overnights? Does it get boring at the small base if you just fly the same routes again and again. If any one is willing to talk to me (even by PM) I will greatly appreciate. I would certainly be interested in what kind of roster and routes I can expect. (I know it will be maximum hours per year or as close as they can manage and I also know I will go where they need me but im just asking the option of Belgrade as I have family there and I know since its not EU many people would not automatically have the right to live there.

Thanks in advance for the help.

If you plan on getting BEG as a base then forget it, its full and with no future aircrafts on the way.

It will be boring to fly the same routes from smaller bases in the end, except if you are cadet and want the hours and experience.

That is why I was asking how Wizz roster the flights out of a base with only a few routes. I am not a cadet and of course would like exposure to the entire route network. I have family in Belgrade so its the best base for me right now.

You have 4-5 days in a row with 2-4 sectors, some days to the same destination. Check the network map and then you can see the flights from each base. Some months will be varied, some will boring, and some will be with Luton overnights, if you are so lucky ;)

Lucky to have a Luton overnight? Bloody hell, we really are scraping the bottom here aren't we...