What do you mean skeletor?

Simply that by replacing flight training with simulator training you are missing out on some of the best and most enjoyable flying you may ever experience.

Hacking around the circuit or heading off around the countryside with all your mates in the same bit of airspace......then exchanging tales in the bar afterwards cannot be replaced with....."you won't believe what happened to me in simulator today.....yawn!"

A valid way into a difficult industry, and good luck to all, but IMHO slightly dull.

Simulation is never as much fun as the real thing now is it?

Skeletor

Have to agree with you, I am Fairly newly qualified as an ATPL and flying heavy aircraft in European airspace, Sims are great, but they are sims !! wonderfull for instrument flying practise and system/emergency training, but the real experience comes with the weather, other traffic etc etc etc, that you dont get in a sim.

Still we shall see

Except that I'll think you will find that the MPL course agreed between FTE and Flybe will include a lot more actual air time than the theoretical MPL minimum.

.......anyone know what the hours breakdown will be? (roughly)

SimonBlame

I received an e-mail last Thursday stating I had made it to the next stage:)
They may still be waiting for confirmation on who will be attending before re-allocating any spaces.

Anyone else booked in for next Friday?

I received an email also.

Sent an email back asking what is involed and it's full self funded and they want £92,000 pounds......

Of which Flybe pay £20k

The Flybe MPL/FTE Scheme is £76,000, and as F/O UFO says, Flybe pay £20k, which they reclaim from you wages over the first 5 years of employment.
More details can be found HERE

Hi Guys,

Few questions. Stage 3 involves the usual PILAPT tests + the stuff FTE have sent to us eg the Maths/Physics/Verbal revision sheets. All pretty nice of them to send!

In terms of the interview, will it be with a Flybe Pilot and someone from FTE?

Any ideas on the sort of questions they may be asking bar the obvious?

Is there going to be one of those group exercise things? eg. build this mecano set...:(

Don't know if anyone has any ideas at all.

Thanks for any replies

M.M

Any news??
 

Has anyone heard anything since attending phase 3 the other week yet??

Ha, you beat me to it. I was just about to ask the same thing. I am also yet to hear anything, but hey, no news is good news.

Anyone else had the phone call?? :}

hi, are you saying you've been successful and got a place? if so congratulations

Hi Mickey, what day was your interview?

For those of you that don't get into FTE give the above a chance...

Oxford Aviation Training

Good luck :ok:

So What percentage of the course is simulation?? I do agree that simulators are very good these days, you can do all your emergenies drills, Navigation IF extra practice. But, I think nothing can replace real time flying learning environment.

I'm quite surprised actually that Flybe have schemes still going!, since they are going to put quite a few Dash 8's and E195 away for the latter part of this year into the winter next year. I know a guy who just graduated from FTE, he has been told to expect a 9-18 month wait until he gets to do his type rating! Just hope the economic situation improves:ugh:

Anyway Good Luck to all, Safe Flying!

Checklist,

The reason being, I would imagine, is that nobody can accurately predict when the current downturn will eventually end, and how quickly things will recover.

I recall post 9/11 the last BA fully sponsored graduates being told that they could expect a 2 year wait before BA would be in a position to offer them a TR course. As it turned out, they waited only 6 months.

Aviation is a funny old game, and Flybe one of the smarter operators.

Checklist

The same question was posed in 2007 (if my mind serves me correctly) - basically asking why is there a Flybe/Cabair Flybe/FTE ATPL 'sponsorship' scheme when even in 2007 there were still many cadets out there who would have even been willing to pay for a TR - even though Flybe bond you.

Of course you had the usual replies..you are a known cadet from the outset, you learn their way, your reports are constantly seen, you were hand picked at the selection interview by Flybe themselves at Stage 4 etc.

But it still did not answer the question WHY! If Flybe are paying £20'000 sponsorship for EACH 'perfect' candidate, then surely they could come up with a selection/recruitment process for all those hundreds of 250 hr cadets out there for a fraction of the cost in order to find 'the perfect pilot'.

This was finally answered by quite a smart-ass person here on pprune in a very good reply (and quite logical to me) that Flybe actually MAKE money, even in the event that the cadets never gets a job with them (remember you may not get a job straight away and are actually contracted to swim in the pool for circa 2 years).

I can't remember the exact reasons - I'm trying to find the post. But it basically stated that if there is position for the sponsored cadet then obviously that is great - they have got their' perfect pilot' who is not a risk and will have his/her salary deducted over X years. So no cost to the company there.

If they do not have a position for the sponsored cadet after training or within the X'years they are contracted to swim in the pool which may very well happen during these times, then allegedly :confused: Flybe still don't actually 'lose' the £20K.

I can't remember the exact reasons and don't particularly want to write my 'logical' reasons in case as usual I'm ridiculed by some snotty wannabe who thinks they know it all.

Needless to say I agree with the original post I am pertaining to. Simpy because I know that nothing is for free.

Anyway hopefully that answers your question Checklist

of course they make money from wanabe. Why do you think they take guys with 0 hours, when this market is filled with pilots ready to fly.
schools pay airline "undertable" each time an airline send a student to an TRTO.this is how this market work, if a school want a contract with an airline, a school has to give some undeclared money to the pocket of the managment.
Still I don't know how much the receive, probably a lot.
that 's another way for a company to make money, some charge pilots for time building.

thank you Batman :ugh:

Now what was I saying about know-it-alls?

Apart from any financial advantage they may gain, taking a MPL student means the type and company conversion should be cheaper and with less chance of failure.

I am aware that during the course, if anything goes pear shaped then cadets are put onto the fATPL. That is good thinking.

However be aware of the very possible risk that if you do not get a job with Flybe, even after swimming, then you have a license that is worthless unless you have funds to convert it back to a fATPL.

Also be aware that until you get 1500 hrs, I suggest you pray to whoever it is you pray to that Flybe do not go under during the couple or so years it takes to get un-frozen. You will find it very difficult to get another job with an MPL under 1500 hours, let alone in this climate.

If I was a wannabe again, I would find the decision to do the Flybe MPL (providing I was successful during selection) very very difficult.

On one hand, you could do an fATPL with no guarantee of an airline job - yet have the license that allows you to apply for different pilot jobs.

Or do you go for the sponsorship where a job is "guaranteed" up to a point? Knowing that if Flybe have no place for you within 2? years, or you get made redundant before 1500 hrs, you have a worthless license?

I'm glad I don't have this decision to make.

with the oaa scheme they will pay the cost of the conversion if flybe tells you to bugger off ;)

Personally, if I were going for this scheme, I would want that signed, sealed, written in blood with a personally signed bankers draft from the head OAA honcho in the envelope included before believing it.

This licence will benefit someone, sadly I think it will only benefit the airline operator at the moment as the finer details continue to be hammered out.

Oddly enough there seems to be little interest from the big national carriers who still require a full ATPL prior to getting into the recruiting page on their websites.

If that is true quant, not saying you are lying, the I agree with wobble. I'll also get a solicitor to read over it.

to Quant
 

just a question,a bit off topic but; Quant,weren't you flying the A340-600,aged 21,like you posted on another forum?found a post you made regarding flight schools in April 09,where you say you want to start training in May 09?

i think he/she was joking on that thread. if you look at past posts he/she works for virgin in admin

betpumps what would i gain from lying? straight from the OAA site:

Oxford Aviation Training

wrong my pprune says it all...

Don't believe everything you read on pprune! :=

:D

fair enough,only a question!
now, on topic,I wouln't commit to this MPL license,specially with a £70k price tag with no "real" guarantees!fair enough if everything goes bananas they'll put you through fATPL course,but,who guarante that flybe will be "safe" untill you reach the 1500 h?not for me thank you

The following guarantees are in place:

MPL to CPL/IR Guarantee: MPL is a brand new and highly innovative programme. Whilst we are fully confident that it represents the future route to commercial pilot training, we also wish to protect participants from any unforeseen risk in undertaking this first ever UK based scheme. In the very unlikely event that any problem does occur, OAA will guarantee to provide, at no cost to the selected students, any additional flight training required to convert to a standard CPL/IR licence. This will ensure that graduates will be eligible to join any airline with the same professional licensing qualification as available to our APPFO students.

Airline Employment Guarantee: Any sponsored or mentored training programme involves a risk – albeit a very small one – that the participating airline might be unable, for reasons outside its control, to offer employment after graduation. For MPL graduates, there is an added potential complication because their licence is directly linked to employment by the airline involved. Under current regulations, it cannot readily be transferred to another airline. To guard against this slight risk, OAA will again guarantee to provide, at no cost to the selected student, any additional flight training required to convert to a standard CPL/IR licence. This will ensure that, in the event of such an occurrence, MPL graduates will be able to join any airline with the same professional licensing qualification as available to our APPFO students.


Of course you need to study the actual contract, but with up to 20k assistance towards the training and a sponsor airline I can't see any shortage of applicants.

bgreenboxb: Yep I got a place :)

F/O UFO: Last Wednesday


...Time to approach the bank, eek!

So, is this a good idea? I'm sceptical about it.

I'd given up on ideas of integrated training and thought modular would be a better approach. But I must say that this does seem tempting, until you put a lot of thought into what could go wrong!

I suppose there's no harm in filling in an application...