Ryanair interviews and sim assessments - 2
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Pilots are their own worst enemy in all reality. Theres been a steady decline now for years well before covid. However where does it end? There’s a huge difference in pay and terms between Europe and the US. That’s because they don’t allow this sort of nonsense to begin in the first place.
Ryanair at one point reduced their TR to 5k and bonded cadets, now it’s 30k and a roll of a dice.
The anger and frustration towards those is quite understandable given Ryanair crew are sat at home on furlough and their hours being taken by the next highest bidder. I mean it’s a pretty sly move. Will be interesting to see how Ryanair handles this situation when furlough ends. History has a funny way of repeating itself.
Ryanair at one point reduced their TR to 5k and bonded cadets, now it’s 30k and a roll of a dice.
The anger and frustration towards those is quite understandable given Ryanair crew are sat at home on furlough and their hours being taken by the next highest bidder. I mean it’s a pretty sly move. Will be interesting to see how Ryanair handles this situation when furlough ends. History has a funny way of repeating itself.
Join Date: Feb 2019
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You’re missing my point, I don’t know how to make it more clear.
Those pilots were feeding this system and keeping it going until now. This is what so many people on here are arguing against, is that the current cadets are just fuelling this horrendous scheme. It is no different to how it used to be, they are just as bad, no?
So you’d be happy once the industry has fully recovered for all airlines to have a similar scheme, because you know you’ll be earning plenty of money in a couple of years time and things will be good in the end?
Forget the risks that the cadets themselves are taking, explain to me how someone 10 years ago paying 30k, accepting a 6 month training contract on circa £12k per annum (that’s how much it used to be back then) with no guarantee of a job at the end of line training is different to how it is now? Why was that more acceptable back then?
Those pilots were feeding this system and keeping it going until now. This is what so many people on here are arguing against, is that the current cadets are just fuelling this horrendous scheme. It is no different to how it used to be, they are just as bad, no?
So you’d be happy once the industry has fully recovered for all airlines to have a similar scheme, because you know you’ll be earning plenty of money in a couple of years time and things will be good in the end?
Forget the risks that the cadets themselves are taking, explain to me how someone 10 years ago paying 30k, accepting a 6 month training contract on circa £12k per annum (that’s how much it used to be back then) with no guarantee of a job at the end of line training is different to how it is now? Why was that more acceptable back then?
Last edited by Dashcam; 30th Jul 2021 at 10:46.
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10 years ago we werent in the middle of a global pandemic.
10 years ago ryanair pilots were all flying.
10 Years ago there wasnt mass redundancies of experienced pilots.
10 years ago Ryanair needed you.
Theres a few differences?
10 years ago ryanair pilots were all flying.
10 Years ago there wasnt mass redundancies of experienced pilots.
10 years ago Ryanair needed you.
Theres a few differences?
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So another Ryanair webinar took place today, almost identical to the one a couple of months before. Some things just didn't sound right. For example, they said that air traffic will be 100% pre-covid level in winter 21-22. How can they make such assumptions when the majority of European countries threaten with new (useless) lockdowns?
I don't know how many people attended the webinar (I suppose some hundreds) but how come only 5 questions were published? There has not been any reference to the job guarantee thing taking as certain that all cadets will be flying next summer. I don't know how things will turn out and I do hope that none of the cadets will be left with an empty type rating but until covid is under control I won't apply and no-one should. Stop applying, you are making it worse for us all.
I don't know how many people attended the webinar (I suppose some hundreds) but how come only 5 questions were published? There has not been any reference to the job guarantee thing taking as certain that all cadets will be flying next summer. I don't know how things will turn out and I do hope that none of the cadets will be left with an empty type rating but until covid is under control I won't apply and no-one should. Stop applying, you are making it worse for us all.
Join Date: Feb 2019
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Contact Approach
So what you’re saying is in normal times this cadet scheme is perfectly acceptable, and you wouldn’t blame the cadets at all for joining. You’d be happy for other airlines to run similar schemes in the future when things are back to normal?
So what you’re saying is in normal times this cadet scheme is perfectly acceptable, and you wouldn’t blame the cadets at all for joining. You’d be happy for other airlines to run similar schemes in the future when things are back to normal?
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Dashcam
In normal times of growth and career progression the overall result of this scheme is generally positive. This is in times when there is an outflow of pilots to other operators. This outflow has seized now, the company is over staffed but the new cadets are still encouraged to join. Those new cadets will fly a lot during their 6 months of training, hours that current crew were expecting to fly after nearly 18 months of furlough. So what is wrong and different this time is that new cadets are added without that there is a need for them.
In normal times of growth and career progression the overall result of this scheme is generally positive. This is in times when there is an outflow of pilots to other operators. This outflow has seized now, the company is over staffed but the new cadets are still encouraged to join. Those new cadets will fly a lot during their 6 months of training, hours that current crew were expecting to fly after nearly 18 months of furlough. So what is wrong and different this time is that new cadets are added without that there is a need for them.
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A bunch of colleagues have been sent the pre-assessment mail just 5 days after sending their curriculum.
Looks like interviews are gonna be crowded soon, hope to finally read something here!
Looks like interviews are gonna be crowded soon, hope to finally read something here!
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What's wrong is wrong. It is wrong to pay for a type rating. What you'll find is most people were less vocal in their opposition in the past because the 'investment' actually had a return and you were not directly screwing colleagues (and your future self) over. Right now it does not have a return. An individual subscribing to this scheme is the reason the pilots who joined before them (even cadets who paid the 30k) are going to be sitting at home idle, because line training of the next batch will be prioritised. You are basically paying into a system that works against all of your colleagues and in 6 months time will be working against you too. If you don't believe this then speak to pilots in RYR, they'll tell you the roster reality of how this is working.
This was not the case in the past and again, you cannot compare the two. This is why you're finding much more vocal opposition on here and on Linkedin than 10 yrs ago.
16,800 basic without the right to work, not even worthy of being a company employee. McDonalds are literally paying more. It is scandalous how anyone thinks this is a salary befitting of qualified pilots, let alone pilots themselves lowering themselves to it. All pilots everywhere should be furious, especially those just out of school.
They are essentially saying to you that after everything you have invested in this career you're only worth 16,800 to us. That is an insult of gigantic proportions.
dashcam on this forum there was actually opposition to the RYR scheme and the 'flexicrew' scheme offered by EZY at the time around 10 yrs ago, this isn't new, however right now things are pretty aggravated for reasons I needn't mention
This was not the case in the past and again, you cannot compare the two. This is why you're finding much more vocal opposition on here and on Linkedin than 10 yrs ago.
16,800 basic without the right to work, not even worthy of being a company employee. McDonalds are literally paying more. It is scandalous how anyone thinks this is a salary befitting of qualified pilots, let alone pilots themselves lowering themselves to it. All pilots everywhere should be furious, especially those just out of school.
They are essentially saying to you that after everything you have invested in this career you're only worth 16,800 to us. That is an insult of gigantic proportions.
dashcam on this forum there was actually opposition to the RYR scheme and the 'flexicrew' scheme offered by EZY at the time around 10 yrs ago, this isn't new, however right now things are pretty aggravated for reasons I needn't mention
Join Date: Feb 2019
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So you’re saying the scheme was wrong before.
So what you’re saying is those previous cadets are to blame for what’s happening now, because if they hadn’t signed up to it, it would have eventually died out, and Ryanair would not be doing what they are doing now.
In a way you could say they are themselves to blame for them being sat at home whilst the current cadets get line trained because they were keeping the system running for so many years previously.
So what you’re saying is those previous cadets are to blame for what’s happening now, because if they hadn’t signed up to it, it would have eventually died out, and Ryanair would not be doing what they are doing now.
In a way you could say they are themselves to blame for them being sat at home whilst the current cadets get line trained because they were keeping the system running for so many years previously.
Last edited by Dashcam; 31st Jul 2021 at 11:42.
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Every company does things in whatever way reflects their business interests. The past months have been a proof that the boot can go on the other foot quite quickly. A competitor of RYR transitioned from being heavily overstaffed to being understaffed within weeks. Understandably, RYR want to avoid getting into the same position next year (and also, that training department would rather be making money than idling). And they do this by offering self-funded training and zero-hour contracts to a number of people which corresponds to their business demands in the most optimistic scenario. If that scenario does not come into fruition, everyone's hours and earnings will be scaled-down accordingly. It's that simple. You be the judge if you want and/or can afford to take part. If you're a commercial pilot, this implies that you're a literate adult capable of considering your circumstances and making the decision for yourself.
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Just as a side note, all my ex colleagues who moved to ryanair a few years ago are all back flying with fairly normal rosters, the ones who aren’t flying yet are waiting to have their RST’s which has either been rostered, or in the queue to be rostered so they can then be given flights.
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I never joined Ryr many moons ago because of this scheme, so no I don’t think it’s great. Instead I was taken on by another airline who paid me to relocate, TR, medical and a comfortable salary.
Paying any company to work is an own goal if you’d ask me. If there are no opportunities then there are no opportunities. Wait for one.
Paying any company to work is an own goal if you’d ask me. If there are no opportunities then there are no opportunities. Wait for one.
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Dashcam
Yeah, the 3 summer months, ask them again in october, especially the 100s on zero hours on the buzz contract and the rest of the contractors, not entitled to furlough payments
Yeah, the 3 summer months, ask them again in october, especially the 100s on zero hours on the buzz contract and the rest of the contractors, not entitled to furlough payments
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The fact is that If no one applied to Ryanair under these conditions it would be on our benefit because they would have to offer a better contract. In some way they do need us. All these webinars and emails begging us to apply makes it quite obvious. So it would be on our hand to get better prospects. But the majority doesn't give a penny about that. They just want to live the dream no matter what. For some instagram photos they are destroying our (and their) future.
