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How did you fund your training?

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How did you fund your training?

Old 12th Feb 2018, 13:21
  #21 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: London
Posts: 84
Funded mine through BBVA, finished in 2007, integrated and luckily for me straight into an A320 with the type rating paid for, because thats just the way it was pre-financial crisis.

I realised at the time how lucky I'd been but in hindsight I realise I was ridiculously lucky.

Quite how people are meant to find the money now BBVA have exited the market for pilot loans is beyond me. Fair play to anyone out there who is working overtime to get the money together by any means possible.
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Old 12th Feb 2018, 14:20
  #22 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Cornwall
Age: 28
Posts: 203
Interesting read. The reason that prompted me asking the question was looking at the likes of L3 and on linkedin and seeing just how many people were having to pay out huge amounts of money - and the question to me was "how can these people afford it?".

Of course, there are lots of people from different financial backgrounds but the figures involved for integrated training and then a TR on top are mind boggling.

After coming very close, TWICE, for a fully-sponsored cadetship (10 points for anyone who can guess which one...) and ultimately being unsuccessful has led me down the route of saving to go modular, putting away 1000 a month from my wages. It'll take me a while saving, but a good route in nonetheless.
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Old 12th Feb 2018, 18:20
  #23 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 22
Held out for a long time and finally managed to get sponsorship with an international airline, they give a training allowance during the MPL course and I repay once flying for them. Really is the most fair method but unfortunately nothing of the sort around anymore!
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Old 13th Feb 2018, 13:09
  #24 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 200
I came close to getting a fully funded cadet programme myself, few and far between these days. Thankfully my current role has allowed me to save a bit and that's something I'd like to continue into the future.

I'm guessing that a couple of the recent posters' favourite colour is green...

If I could start again at 18, assuming no fully sponsored programmes were available I'd go straight for one of the better apprenticeships, though I imagine the military is also an option for some. Both are a good way of saving dosh and the latter is a bit longer-term with some serious life experience on offer.
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Old 13th Feb 2018, 13:52
  #25 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Aviation Street 72
Age: 38
Posts: 158
Went modular, self-funded (had 2-3 jobs to pay costs involved), hence, took me 5 years from 0 to hero.

The only money I borrowed (privately) was for FI course.

After instructing for 2 years, finally got an RHS airline job in a TP.

Content with the path I followed? Yes, definitely!

Last edited by maximus610; 13th Feb 2018 at 14:38. Reason: Spelling
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Old 14th Feb 2018, 10:55
  #26 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: 100m South of the 45th
Age: 53
Posts: 32
The Other Side of the Bank of Mum and Dad Story

I find reading some tales of funding (I just tripped over 120k, re-mortgaged the parent’s house, had it lying behind the sofa, just put my hand out and asked etc.) quite depressing reading and I bet is off putting to many of more mortal means.
Here is a tale of everyday folk and how as a family we funded a modular course.
We are a normal family, no big salary, no deep savings pot and little in the way of assets, Our house has a normal mortgage, very little equity and we can afford few luxuries. A bank would view us as a poor risk for a loan.

Our eldest son from 8 years old has wanted to be a pilot, dreamed of nothing else and studied everything aeronautical. At that age the only sort of flying possible was in the virtual world and so started years of flight simulation, including building cockpits from scratch using reclaimed materials. This even went up to a full size cabin of a 737, which was later sold on to fund part of the ATPL course fee.

Every penny of birthday and Christmas money from aged 12 (he requested strictly no presents, cash only) and odd job money was put away and by 16 he had 1200 euros saved.

All through the flight sim years he kept networking and went to the World Air Games here in Turin, even winning a medal in the Virtual World Air Games and was interviewed on TV.

Through continual networking and searching he found 6 scholarships offered for 12 hours of flying and PPL theory, the competition and selection was intense and quite stressful for a 15 year old (and not much different for the parents either!). On receiving the call that he had been selected he ran outside and yelled at the top of his voice, the next-door neighbour’s dog dropped dead on the spot of a heart attack!

At 16, started with PPL and continued over the next 2 years flying whenever he had money saved up and we could chip in with the odd hour here and there. The total PPL cost was 8800 Euros of which 2200 was the scholarship. So we had to find about 3k per year through economies, no family holiday abroad, shopping at discount stores and eating out limited to very special occasions only. Difficult but not impossible.

Hour building was a mixture. Some hours in Italy as and when we could scrape together enough for an hour here and there. About 1400 Euros whilst still in high school.

Then in South Africa including a bush pilot course. Total 8k Euros funded by part time work and a small legacy from his grandfather.

2 years of ATPL in Luton cost 6k all in, living in a dirty room in a shared house and maximum economy with one trip back home in that time, at the end to save further money has was sleeping on floors at friend’s houses, budget was 35/week total. Transport was by foot and at the end a 35 bike.

In between all of this a GA spares website was set up and through a lot of hard work and networking things started to move. The last 30 hours were done in Romania at a cost of around 4k Euros including flights and living, funded from part time work and web site earnings.

The biggest lump was the NVFR, MEIR and CPL at Bartolini. Around 21.5k Euros for course, living and flights. That was by far the biggest chunk to find. The second car was sold (nothing extravagant a Ford Fiesta) and a relative passed us a crash damaged 8 year old Renault Megane for nothing. I managed to patch that up to keep going for three years. I sold a number of items that I had built over the years and my collection of model railway items went as well. This plus the funds from the car, part time work, website earnings and further economies we just scraped through.

Unable to fund a type rating our son (now 24) is working in ground operations for a freight operator, using his salary to gain a flight instructor rating and flying hours to keep current, looking and hoping for the next lucky break.

I know that some will read this and say lucky b*gg*r has the bank of mum and dad. It’s been a struggle for us all but with team work and determination anything is possible.

Last edited by ilvaporista; 14th Feb 2018 at 11:05.
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Old 14th Feb 2018, 12:29
  #27 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Cornwall
Age: 28
Posts: 203
Really enlightening to read - I wish your son all the best!
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Old 14th Feb 2018, 13:18
  #28 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: UK
Posts: 131
I don't think there is any such thing as luck. Your son was fortunate that you, his parents, loved and cared enough for him in that a very big sacrifice was made by you and to some part himself, to fund his dream. He's still got a long way to go and regardless of what people will tell you, airline pilot jobs are still very difficult to get for ab intio's. Direct entry is another matter but still not that easy. I wish you and your son all the very best in his endeavours
and not to give up on his dream. It will happen one day, he's still pretty young.
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Old 14th Feb 2018, 14:23
  #29 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Planet earth
Posts: 27
Really great to hear that you could do all this as a family "ilvaporista". I certainly wish my parents had gone "all in" like that too. I also started early. I must have logget thousands of hours in flight sims, spent hundreds of Euros on RC planes and even more as a gliderpilot. (also funded by myself from I was 15). Although I had no money handed to me directly from my parents, I had their full support and I remember my dad driving me 45km each way for years to and from the gliding club before I had my drivers license. I have also more than once had to ask for money for food back when I worked for the harpe many years ago in the beginning! I am truly grateful that they chose to kindle my interest of flying from day 1.

I think your son has the drive to become an excellent pilot from what you describe, and with that level of commitment I think he is pretty likely to succeed.

With regards to the lucky cadets who have had everything funded by mom and dad, I did notice quite a difference in the level of commitment back when I was working as a FI. The guys who had to go the extra mile themselves did tend to be more hard working, dedicated and succesfull - Even though the natural abilities was lower in some cases.
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Old 14th Feb 2018, 19:37
  #30 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: London
Posts: 84
I must say your son is MOST lucky to have parents who are so supportive and are willing to sacrifice so much to make his dream come true. I hope it does eventually.

All I would say is that it shouldn't be THAT hard. It speaks volumes about the state of the airline industry that families should have to sell cars and give up family holidays to allow their children to chase the dream. I'm assuming your son is an only child since I'm not sure I could justify robbing one child of their holiday to allow the other one to go flying! Quite a conundrum if you have more than one....

I hope he thinks the job is worth it when he finally gets there. Having been flying for 10 years now, for me it is definitely a JOB first - a means of paying the mortgage and feeding the kids. I suppose while I have huge admiration for your commitment there's something about your story which just rings a few alarm bells for me. I have a question mark over whether the reality of the job is really worth the level of sacrifice you describe. Particularly when you look at some of the increasingly depressing employment models and practices used by some airlines.

In any event I wish your son the very best for the future.
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Old 15th Feb 2018, 07:20
  #31 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: 100m South of the 45th
Age: 53
Posts: 32
Before I get reported to the European Court of Human rights for child depravation I should add that our three boys are treated equally. They had equal shares from their late grandfather, number one added it to his wages from part time work and went to South Africa for hour building, number two is using it to have fun, part fund his degree and has bought a small car. Number three has it saved and will decide when he leaves High School.
Our major holidays for five years were only within car driving range and ultra cheap B&B/camping, as opposed to before when we took flights abroad, hired a car and stayed in hotels. Luckily living in Italy we have plenty of choices of nearby destinations.
My wife probably suffered the most giving up her starts first time, almost new car for a multi coloured, not so reliable aged piece of junk. I never managed to get round to re-spraying the bonnet so it remained a different colour, though was easy to spot in the car park!
It was a bit of a wrench to part with my live steam models which I had built since a teenager but as I built them before I can do so again, something for my retirement years.
I do agree that outsourcing training costs on to the student is morally questionable but as we all clamour for cheaper flights a way has to be found to pay for that. So it is passed on to the one that can protest all they like but has no real impact on the airlines, no licence, no job. Supply and demand in a booming (training) market leads to that. The blunt fact is that until now people have been prepared to pay these high sums.
I merely presented this an alternative to those who maybe have the chance to do what we did. I accept that not everyone has that possibility and aviation is incredibly cruel, basically if you have no money or resources your chances in civil aviation are very slim.
In summary it was our determination to do as much as we could and not to fund bank's profit margins by using loans. Mission accomplished. Since April last year we have a qualified, debt-free son, earning his own way, saving monthly, flying for fun and building for his future with FI rating. The next steps are up to him.
PS Last summer holiday we lived it up, flew to Sweden, toured all round and stayed in decent hotels.

Last edited by ilvaporista; 15th Feb 2018 at 08:08.
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Old 15th Feb 2018, 07:50
  #32 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Cornwall
Age: 28
Posts: 203
Thank you for sharing! My family are in a similar position. I was the youngest of 4; and although knowing from a very young age what I wanted to do, my parents still weren't in any sort of position to help me much. From the age of 16 i paid for my own food + school uniform etc form part-time work. Loans for us were also out of the question, parents got a mortgage late and they did so through co-ownership. Even though at the age of 16/17 it had never crossed my mind that they could help financially, as I suppose I always knew they couldn't! Now my parents are in their mid-60's and my mums still putting in the hours at Tesco because she has no other choice. She always maintains that if she ever came into money that my flying would be the first thing on her list, so they'd help out if they could.

Knowing i've always wanted to fly though, and always knowing I couldn't access the funds has actually worked out well in a roundabout sort of way. Forced me to work harder and i've ended up with a BEng degree, MSc Degree from one of the best UK universities for Engineering. I've worked in some cool places, seen some amazing things, travelled the world, made some great friends and lived all over the UK. I earn good money, I've a good career, I'm able to save... and i'm able to help my parents out. Its actually worked out a-okay and i'm still working towards my flying - although i'll probably be in my 30s as opposed to my 20s when it happens!
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Old 15th Feb 2018, 10:42
  #33 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: UK
Posts: 131
Very commendable and I'm glad to see you got a degree(s). Whatever anyone tells you education is the best investment in life you can make.
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Old 17th Feb 2018, 19:23
  #34 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: London, UK
Posts: 6
Modular student here. Started last year, almost got my PPL and will continue on.
Funding by gradually putting away money each month and spending it on flight training. As far as I've calculated, it will probably take me 3-4 years to finish everything - at least I won't have any loans to pay after. Of course I might get a loan when paying the TR - depends how fast I'll get a job offer but that is faaaar into the future thinking.

Have a good one and good luck !
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Old 18th Feb 2018, 16:20
  #35 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: six micro tesla zone
Age: 27
Posts: 342
My lady grew up a literal shack in SE Asia, her family struggled to put food on the table on some occasions and she swam in the gutter with her siblings for fun. She and the siblings are now University educated, with well paid jobs in various 1st world countries due to the hard work and and unbelievable sacrifice of their parents despite how little they had.

ilvaporista and his son are an example of what real life is like for the majority of the worlds population. However, we in this country are spoilt and expect everything to be handed over to us with minimal effort. The middle class parents in UK, who themselves are fortunate to own houses that are warm and dry with clean running water, are just as deluded as their pilot wannabe children when they remortgage their house for 120k and hand it over to L3 et al.

Moan and groan about greedy airlines all you like that are not willing to foot training costs or the greedy FTOs. There will always be fat cats at the top no matter what we try to do to eliminate them. However, despite the sharks, you really can achieve anything you want in life with real hard work, intuition and dedication.
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