Easyjet Scholarship for Women...
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To add my two cents, being in my 20s, it's point 3 i'm apprehensious of which typically is a natural progression in the 'too sensible' lifestyle mentioned in Littlest Hobo's post. I too have progressed to achieve a degree and I feel the next few years are crucial at gaining a shot at aviation. Beyond that, you can attain both through the forces- but that's another debate i'm not wanting here.
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Are you suggesting men have less common sense haha?
Flying is similar to engineering in my point of view. Females are lacking in engineering. Anything loud, noisy, made of metal, not particularly glamorous is not going to tug at the way they are wired.
Going back to what Chesty Morgan said, bit of a generalisation but most women would rather be mothers than pilots. If a career as a pilot could be balanced with family life in a similar way as a career in, for example, teaching or accountancy (or even engineering) then I'm sure more women would be stepping up to apply... if they didn't have to fork out £100k for the privilege, of course!
Gender Faculty Specialist
I agree LH but the trouble is that the nature of the job doesn't allow that...unless females get different treatment - and that is discrimination, which is what we're trying to avoid.
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Absolutely right, it's not practical to be more accommodating towards working mothers and so it's very doubtful that they will get the floods of female applicants they seem to be looking for right now.
But (cost of training issues aside for a moment) if they put more effort into educating youngsters, maybe in future they'd start getting more applications from female school leaver candidates. That might help balance things out somewhat, at least until maternity leave age!
But (cost of training issues aside for a moment) if they put more effort into educating youngsters, maybe in future they'd start getting more applications from female school leaver candidates. That might help balance things out somewhat, at least until maternity leave age!
Last edited by Littlest Hobo; 16th Feb 2016 at 13:00. Reason: To make sense
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I can remember when female applicants for F/O positions in one UK airline were asked at interview when they intended to leave and have a family in the event they were successful? I applaud Littlest Hobo for her honest observations with respect to the appeal of family life. Her comments about education are much the same as those recommended by a recent study in the EU conducted to determine how to attract more women to professional aviation, where it was suggested that flying is just not seen as attractive to most women and that early education is key.
Littlest Hobo makes a very good point where she states that in her case, university trumped flying school. In my experience, there are in fact a fair few females undertaking flying training at ATO's today and over the past several years, yet many lack aptitude and interest by comparison to their male colleagues. The majority I have encountered have not been to university whereas a higher proportion of the men have and I have often got the impression that the girls are not really sure what they are trying to achieve, which is a real pity for those very keen and capable individuals who lack equivalent funding opportunities.
Littlest Hobo makes a very good point where she states that in her case, university trumped flying school. In my experience, there are in fact a fair few females undertaking flying training at ATO's today and over the past several years, yet many lack aptitude and interest by comparison to their male colleagues. The majority I have encountered have not been to university whereas a higher proportion of the men have and I have often got the impression that the girls are not really sure what they are trying to achieve, which is a real pity for those very keen and capable individuals who lack equivalent funding opportunities.
Last edited by Reverserbucket; 16th Feb 2016 at 14:12.
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I fully agree that the recruitment process needs to be monitored to ensure that no candidates are discriminated against on the basis of protected characteristics.
I don't believe that the role should be marketed to people from a certain background, instead, I think that any marketing of the role should simply discuss what the training and the role are like on a day-to-day basis.
The male brain and female brain work differently, that's no doubt a key reason why we see loads of female primary school teachers, yet more male pilots and engineers. Some would say that society conditions people to think in certain ways (i.e. men as pilots and women as cabin crew) however, if people really want the job in question, I think they'll overcome this conditioning.
Surely if the airlines offered training programmes like typical apprenticeships where you pay nothing for your training and are paid a salary, the diversity of applicants will be massively increased. I went through the train driving mandatory assessment process (which I passed) and the diversity of applicants was huge, no doubt because they didn't have to worry about funding.
I don't believe that the role should be marketed to people from a certain background, instead, I think that any marketing of the role should simply discuss what the training and the role are like on a day-to-day basis.
The male brain and female brain work differently, that's no doubt a key reason why we see loads of female primary school teachers, yet more male pilots and engineers. Some would say that society conditions people to think in certain ways (i.e. men as pilots and women as cabin crew) however, if people really want the job in question, I think they'll overcome this conditioning.
Surely if the airlines offered training programmes like typical apprenticeships where you pay nothing for your training and are paid a salary, the diversity of applicants will be massively increased. I went through the train driving mandatory assessment process (which I passed) and the diversity of applicants was huge, no doubt because they didn't have to worry about funding.
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A little off topic... But Littlest Hobo, considering the situation you find yourself in at the moment, have you put much thought into the part-time modular route? 
Granted it does come with sacrifices but definitely a viable option.
Granted it does come with sacrifices but definitely a viable option.
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Not meaning to answer for Littlest Hobo (used to watch that as a kid btw), but to what end would embarking on a modular course help her enjoy a balanced family life? It's not just the training but the disrupted lifestyle that follows. I've met several female skippers in my career and without exception, they all fit a specific personality profile that would not compliment the balanced family life that Littlest Hobo implies.
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What Reverserbucket said. I love to learn so would definitely consider further qualifications as time, money and other life factors permit, but my motivation will be to become a better pilot, not a professional one.
Who knows, when I'm 50 maybe I'll have a sudden urge to pursue a flying career?! But that discussion belongs in the "My dream" and "Too Old?" threads and has nothing to do with diversity issues.
Who knows, when I'm 50 maybe I'll have a sudden urge to pursue a flying career?! But that discussion belongs in the "My dream" and "Too Old?" threads and has nothing to do with diversity issues.
PPRuNe Handmaiden
If I may, discrimination occurs where there's an unfair advantage or disadvantage directed at the candidate. If easyJet (or any other airline) changed their selection criteria to accommodate a particular group, then that is discrimination.
All easyJet are doing is under writing a loan.
The number of candidates are 6.
Re women in aviation? I'm one.
The reason why more women don't take up flying as a career (as opposed to being a flight attendant) is varied and complex. It begins at school. No guidance about it being a viable career option and the lack of STEM subjects. Also, the perception that you need to be a maths and physics geek, trust me, you don't. If you do long haul or work for extended periods away from home, the career is quite family unfriendly - especially as it's the woman who has to take time off for her pregnancy.
This can have negative affects on command prospects and so forth. Given it doesn't take long to lose currency etc.
Yes, men are affected with being away from home however, men do not have to take the time off with a pregnancy.
All easyJet are doing is under writing a loan.
The number of candidates are 6.
Re women in aviation? I'm one.
The reason why more women don't take up flying as a career (as opposed to being a flight attendant) is varied and complex. It begins at school. No guidance about it being a viable career option and the lack of STEM subjects. Also, the perception that you need to be a maths and physics geek, trust me, you don't.
If you do long haul or work for extended periods away from home, the career is quite family unfriendly - especially as it's the woman who has to take time off for her pregnancy. This can have negative affects on command prospects and so forth. Given it doesn't take long to lose currency etc.
Yes, men are affected with being away from home however, men do not have to take the time off with a pregnancy.
Gender Faculty Specialist
All easyjet are doing is underwriting a loan specifically targeted at women in partnership with the British Women Pilots Association.
Are men allowed to apply under this particular initiative? No. Discrimination, sadly.
Also enhanced mentoring for women and additional support! Come on, it's sexist and you know it.
Rubbish and the perception that you have to be a maths and physics geek equally applies to men.
Are men allowed to apply under this particular initiative? No. Discrimination, sadly.
Also enhanced mentoring for women and additional support! Come on, it's sexist and you know it.
The reason why more women don't take up flying as a career (as opposed to being a flight attendant) is varied and complex. It begins at school. No guidance about it being a viable career option...
Yes but "maths and physics" as you say is generally what is required for any sort of STEM job, and that field is predominantly male, with male role models, and therein lies the problem.
Gender Faculty Specialist
Does not compute. The ratio of male to female pilots doesn't not equate to the ratio of male to female physics, or maths, students. Why not?
By the way, maths is dominated by female teachers these days. I believe of the science and maths subjects it is only physics which is dominated by male teachers.
By the way, maths is dominated by female teachers these days. I believe of the science and maths subjects it is only physics which is dominated by male teachers.
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I've never understood why careers need these "role models" of sorts. If I was interested in doing something career-wise, I'd base my decision on what the job actually entailed, not on whether the people in the role were male or female.
de minimus non curat lex
What would be interesting to know is the percentage of women pilots, including prospective ones, who have family members involved in aviation.
I would suggest that the seed is sown at a fairly early age.
Those who have never thought about it until post secondary education will be a comparatively small percentage of their total.
Unless someone knows differently.............
I would suggest that the seed is sown at a fairly early age.
Those who have never thought about it until post secondary education will be a comparatively small percentage of their total.
Unless someone knows differently.............
PPRuNe Handmaiden
My grandfather worked for Qantas as an engineer. Seeds were sown when I was 7 or 8 when I was shown around the hangars and sim centre. 
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I've never understood why careers need these "role models" of sorts. If I was interested in doing something career-wise, I'd base my decision on what the job actually entailed, not on whether the people in the role were male or female.
What would be interesting to know is the percentage of women pilots, including prospective ones, who have family members involved in aviation.
I would suggest that the seed is sown at a fairly early age.
Those who have never thought about it until post secondary education will be a comparatively small percentage of their total.
Unless someone knows differently.............
I would suggest that the seed is sown at a fairly early age.
Those who have never thought about it until post secondary education will be a comparatively small percentage of their total.
Unless someone knows differently.............
I cannot think of any female pilots I know who didn't have a family link to the industry.
I can think of a great many male pilots who didn't. Which again demonstrates the real problem, that women do not think it is a possible or viable career option (unless they have someone telling them otherwise, which if they don't have family members in the industry, they won't)
No, I'm suggesting that they aren't always encouraged to consider everything.
I was never given any careers advice regarding being a pilot. The girls certainly weren't, they were almost steered away from things like STEM, particularly engineering, unless it was teaching those subjects.
It's something that they just don't consider a lot of the time though, though nurture and culture more than anything else I think.
I was never given any careers advice regarding being a pilot. The girls certainly weren't, they were almost steered away from things like STEM, particularly engineering, unless it was teaching those subjects.
It's something that they just don't consider a lot of the time though, though nurture and culture more than anything else I think.
