British Airways Future Pilot Programme.
Join Date: Jan 2013
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To those surprised to be rejected when they have a degree
Remember how these selection processes work! Whatever the industry, your qualifications don't make any difference getting to an assessment stage, or how clever you are. It's all done on how good you are at BS on the multiple choice questions and the BA related bit, forget work history or any qualifications above min required, it doesn't matter.
I got rejected last year at 25 with PPL, 2 BSc degrees, 4 A levels...as well as a decent work history at major companies with both customer services as well as technical etc.
But if you don't get through this time it's easy, just ask a mate to do the questions for you next time. Even someone not interested in being a pilot with no knowledge. With the multiple choice it's easy to reason 1 or 2 answers can be right but you have get which one is the correct answer, usually the one which requires the least thinking, this is because companies want people that follow instructions. Same goes for the supporting questions on BA etc, ask someone to help with that too. Not everyone is good at putting stuff like that into writing, or having a corporate mindset to pick the generic answers on a multiple choice, it doesn't even give any real indication to whether someone can be a good pilot.
Basically apply again next year, keep the application the same for work, qualifications, why you want to be pilot etc. Just get someone else to do the multiple choice questions and you'll be surprised how they change their opinion
I got rejected last year at 25 with PPL, 2 BSc degrees, 4 A levels...as well as a decent work history at major companies with both customer services as well as technical etc.
But if you don't get through this time it's easy, just ask a mate to do the questions for you next time. Even someone not interested in being a pilot with no knowledge. With the multiple choice it's easy to reason 1 or 2 answers can be right but you have get which one is the correct answer, usually the one which requires the least thinking, this is because companies want people that follow instructions. Same goes for the supporting questions on BA etc, ask someone to help with that too. Not everyone is good at putting stuff like that into writing, or having a corporate mindset to pick the generic answers on a multiple choice, it doesn't even give any real indication to whether someone can be a good pilot.
Basically apply again next year, keep the application the same for work, qualifications, why you want to be pilot etc. Just get someone else to do the multiple choice questions and you'll be surprised how they change their opinion
Join Date: Feb 2006
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Just got the axe from CTC last night.
about me: approaching 37 (some grey hair), 15 hours flying including solos, a couple of years working airside - baggage, refuelling, ground handling. Good health, fitness + eyesight. Degree and A-levels. Business experience. Some good life experience.
Not bad on Flight sim too.
Well - it was a long shot. No hard feelings BA - at least you are doing more than the others!
about me: approaching 37 (some grey hair), 15 hours flying including solos, a couple of years working airside - baggage, refuelling, ground handling. Good health, fitness + eyesight. Degree and A-levels. Business experience. Some good life experience.
Not bad on Flight sim too.
Well - it was a long shot. No hard feelings BA - at least you are doing more than the others!
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Another with the disappointing email from CTC...
Background: Age 25-30, fairly high level at a major bank, good business experience elsewhere including worldwide travel.
Education: Good Degree, not the best A-Levels...lessons learnt when studying degree and I also meet GCSE requirements.
Pretty disappointed right now, though I am hopeful once I stop looking for flaws in me, I will appreciate BA's efforts as stated above.
Good luck to those that got through, I hope it works for you.
Background: Age 25-30, fairly high level at a major bank, good business experience elsewhere including worldwide travel.
Education: Good Degree, not the best A-Levels...lessons learnt when studying degree
and I also meet GCSE requirements.Pretty disappointed right now, though I am hopeful once I stop looking for flaws in me, I will appreciate BA's efforts as stated above.
Good luck to those that got through, I hope it works for you.
Last edited by 4KBeta; 5th Jan 2013 at 10:08.
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Got the 'No' myself, cant say im surprised its a lottery with these sort of schemes, but i thought there's no harm in applying. Obviously didn't cut it with the BS questions etc.
Background - Worked for 2 large companies with technical and customer service roles, PPL with around 100hrs, flying as often as I can while enjoying life and not putting my house on a job in this game.
Will stick with the modular route, looking at the bigger picture I couldn't really imagine putting myself in the position these schemes will leave you in anyway. Think I will just enjoy the license and get ready for the CPL, the dream is to fly for a living, but while I know the state the industry is in with recruitment (lets not get into this haha), ill always have the pleasure of jumping in a C172 or whatever im flying that day and just really enjoy the flying.
Background - Worked for 2 large companies with technical and customer service roles, PPL with around 100hrs, flying as often as I can while enjoying life and not putting my house on a job in this game.
Will stick with the modular route, looking at the bigger picture I couldn't really imagine putting myself in the position these schemes will leave you in anyway. Think I will just enjoy the license and get ready for the CPL, the dream is to fly for a living, but while I know the state the industry is in with recruitment (lets not get into this haha), ill always have the pleasure of jumping in a C172 or whatever im flying that day and just really enjoy the flying.
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@vybz - You seem to sound like you deserve an interview simply because you have 2 BSc Degrees, 4 A Levels and a PPL. Once you meet the minimum requirements everybody is then on a level playing field.
How would you suggest these application processes change to suit you needs? The BS multiple choice questions you refer to are to gain a slight insight into one's personality, I wouldn't call it a pass/fail test but a suitability test. The supporting questions gains an insight into the motivation and qualities of a person. These are the same sort of questions you may be asked in an interview, if you can't answer those questions sufficiently at the application stage then you can't answer those questions in the interview stage. The requirements to be a "good pilot" is not necessarily all about how well you can fly a plane, there are certain qualities (i.e. professionalism, leadership and personality)that a person needs to possess in order to even get a shot at an interview, to even suggest asking a friend to do some of the questions shows you have no integrity. So ask yourself one question, in those 800 words in the supporting questions, how well did you manage to sell yourself to a potential employer?
I have lots of friends that have/are applying to this scheme either this time round or last year, all the ones that didn't make it past the initial application stage all blame the system and the selection process. Not one of them thought about how they could improve to stand a better chance next time.
Rant over.
How would you suggest these application processes change to suit you needs? The BS multiple choice questions you refer to are to gain a slight insight into one's personality, I wouldn't call it a pass/fail test but a suitability test. The supporting questions gains an insight into the motivation and qualities of a person. These are the same sort of questions you may be asked in an interview, if you can't answer those questions sufficiently at the application stage then you can't answer those questions in the interview stage. The requirements to be a "good pilot" is not necessarily all about how well you can fly a plane, there are certain qualities (i.e. professionalism, leadership and personality)that a person needs to possess in order to even get a shot at an interview, to even suggest asking a friend to do some of the questions shows you have no integrity. So ask yourself one question, in those 800 words in the supporting questions, how well did you manage to sell yourself to a potential employer?
I have lots of friends that have/are applying to this scheme either this time round or last year, all the ones that didn't make it past the initial application stage all blame the system and the selection process. Not one of them thought about how they could improve to stand a better chance next time.
Rant over.
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Hey guys, I've got my CTC assessment on the 9th Jan, pretty nervous right now. I'm unsure of what to expect on the day, I've been notified about the PILAPT test but could anyone possibly shed some light on what to expect.
Thanks in advance
Thanks in advance
FTE
Join Date: Apr 2011
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Hello all,
Just a quick message.......
Have a stage 2 at Dibden, Southhampton (CTC) on 15.01.2013 (9am)
Driving down from Newcastle on the 14th so if anyone in North East is in same boat then I'd be happy to car share?
Just a quick message.......
Have a stage 2 at Dibden, Southhampton (CTC) on 15.01.2013 (9am)
Driving down from Newcastle on the 14th so if anyone in North East is in same boat then I'd be happy to car share?
Join Date: May 2001
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Only that if none of your relatives has the capital to secure the loan BA will secure it.
Also as well they go into full time employment it seems without the limited contracts through agencys that some of the others do.
Also as well they go into full time employment it seems without the limited contracts through agencys that some of the others do.
Join Date: Sep 2011
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For those of you who applied to FTE and not heard back yet, their offices are still closed. Closed until the 8th. This would probably explain the lack of responses apart from a few that have been sent prior to the holidays.
Don't loose hope! All the best to all of you.
Don't loose hope! All the best to all of you.
Join Date: Jan 2013
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OK. The interviews are about to start for some so I think it’s only fair that the playing field be levelled a little for those who didn’t have the advantage of attending one last year.
The group exercise involved 5 minutes of silent scenario reading followed by 45 minutes using clue cards to figure out where the group had been dropped on a map, where they were now, where and when the pickup would be, how to get there and what equipment to take. The instructors observe in silence and provided no feedback.
The group discussions were on topics like, “Discuss how technology is improving flight safety”; “Discuss MPL”; “What are the new opportunities in the aviation market?”; “Discuss whether Britain is a benefits culture.” The instructors decide when each discussion ends, and again there’s no feedback.
The individual interviews started with, “Tell us about yourself and why you want to be a BA pilot.” Candidates had to identify a model aircraft before answering some flight principals and technical questions. Other questions covered knowledge of the flight school’s course, aviation interests and experience, general interests and personal background. Expect multiple questions about BA and its business, competition, investments etc. Above all though, expect multiple, “Give us an example of a time when” questions on planning, taking control, changing minds etc for which the example on the application form will be out of bounds - and expect the answers to be challenged, “Why did you do that? Didn’t you consider alternatives?” etc.
Afterwards PPRuNe will be a good indication of whether you’re through to the BA interview as all the invites arrive at the same time.
I hope this is fair and useful help. It divulges high level details without giving away either the answers or what the schools are looking for. Obviously the exercise and group questions will have changed and most of the potential questions you’ll be asked aren’t listed, but good luck and I hope to see some of you on the other side.
The group exercise involved 5 minutes of silent scenario reading followed by 45 minutes using clue cards to figure out where the group had been dropped on a map, where they were now, where and when the pickup would be, how to get there and what equipment to take. The instructors observe in silence and provided no feedback.
The group discussions were on topics like, “Discuss how technology is improving flight safety”; “Discuss MPL”; “What are the new opportunities in the aviation market?”; “Discuss whether Britain is a benefits culture.” The instructors decide when each discussion ends, and again there’s no feedback.
The individual interviews started with, “Tell us about yourself and why you want to be a BA pilot.” Candidates had to identify a model aircraft before answering some flight principals and technical questions. Other questions covered knowledge of the flight school’s course, aviation interests and experience, general interests and personal background. Expect multiple questions about BA and its business, competition, investments etc. Above all though, expect multiple, “Give us an example of a time when” questions on planning, taking control, changing minds etc for which the example on the application form will be out of bounds - and expect the answers to be challenged, “Why did you do that? Didn’t you consider alternatives?” etc.
Afterwards PPRuNe will be a good indication of whether you’re through to the BA interview as all the invites arrive at the same time.
I hope this is fair and useful help. It divulges high level details without giving away either the answers or what the schools are looking for. Obviously the exercise and group questions will have changed and most of the potential questions you’ll be asked aren’t listed, but good luck and I hope to see some of you on the other side.
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Just received the rejection email from FTE, I don't make it to the second phase.
I thought it was going to end well, good A-Levels, expecting 1st Class in my BA next year, spotted several "hidden intentions" in the personality test, did fine in the written part.
The worst thing that could happen to me if I was rejected was no changes in my current life. A very good chance of changing my life lost, sadly.
I thought it was going to end well, good A-Levels, expecting 1st Class in my BA next year, spotted several "hidden intentions" in the personality test, did fine in the written part.
The worst thing that could happen to me if I was rejected was no changes in my current life. A very good chance of changing my life lost, sadly.
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spotted several "hidden intentions" in the personality test
Just do these tests as you actually feel, unless you are a Phd that designs these things you won't be able to spot the interlinking. And even then you don't know what they are actually looking for so you may set yourself up to look like what you think is a perfect pilot which may be different to what the company wants.
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Interesting happenings in the industry with this BAFPP. On the whole, you have to take your hat off to BA for initialising it compared to the practises of the low costs and the P2F format.
Good luck to those advancing and commiserations to the others.
Some interesting points being made on this forum, thought I'd put my two pence worth as I have a day off and at a loose end.
There is always going to be some random outcomes with type of system. Great potential will not always be spotted and picked up.
I remember applying for BA back in the 97 and asking the local BA captain on our street what I should put for the questions (paper format in those days - one's hand writing and lack of spell checker became more of an issue) and his reply was "I just don't know what they are looking for these days, with all these HR types"
Anyway, two of my good friends also applied. Me and another(b) never got an interview and the third(c) got one and got no further.
Fast forward to today>>>>>
Me - King Air Pilot
B - Private pilot and senior materials scientist at Airbus
C (the one who got the BA interview but no further) - The RAF could see what BA HR couldn't and gave him a break and was Tristar(wide-body 100+Ton long haul aircraft)Captain after 1300hours - flying a way more taxing aircraft and routes. He has always been classified as "above average flying skills" on Squadron and is a very rounded character too with a good understanding of the world and business.
Moral of the story - I don't really know.. but I'm sure BA HR department make lots of under-optimised decisions as well as optimised ones. For example: they employed a future wife killer BBC News - British Airways pilot cleared of murdering wife Joanna Brown in Ascot
Good luck to you all (including the BA HR team)
Good luck to those advancing and commiserations to the others.
Some interesting points being made on this forum, thought I'd put my two pence worth as I have a day off and at a loose end.
There is always going to be some random outcomes with type of system. Great potential will not always be spotted and picked up.
I remember applying for BA back in the 97 and asking the local BA captain on our street what I should put for the questions (paper format in those days - one's hand writing and lack of spell checker became more of an issue) and his reply was "I just don't know what they are looking for these days, with all these HR types"
Anyway, two of my good friends also applied. Me and another(b) never got an interview and the third(c) got one and got no further.
Fast forward to today>>>>>
Me - King Air Pilot
B - Private pilot and senior materials scientist at Airbus
C (the one who got the BA interview but no further) - The RAF could see what BA HR couldn't and gave him a break and was Tristar(wide-body 100+Ton long haul aircraft)Captain after 1300hours - flying a way more taxing aircraft and routes. He has always been classified as "above average flying skills" on Squadron and is a very rounded character too with a good understanding of the world and business.
Moral of the story - I don't really know.. but I'm sure BA HR department make lots of under-optimised decisions as well as optimised ones. For example: they employed a future wife killer BBC News - British Airways pilot cleared of murdering wife Joanna Brown in Ascot
Good luck to you all (including the BA HR team)
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Don't worry I haven't heard back from OAA yet either. When we went for the Stage 1, they said that they would not be letting people know until at least January 4th. They also said it could well be some time after this that we hear anything. They are unable to establish a pass mark until enough people have completed the stage 1 assessment days, and this is only the first working day since the 4th so I'm just sitting tight for a bit
Good luck everyone!
Good luck everyone!
