what do you expect from p2f?
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so guys. What do you expect from p2f. a paid job or pay again for another turn.
how much money you are ready to invest in these crazy trainings just to finish unemployed.... 200000, 300000 euro....
This is ridiculous.... hey where are the happy customers? seem they don't have the courage to complain here..... fear to lose face maybe?
;-)
how much money you are ready to invest in these crazy trainings just to finish unemployed.... 200000, 300000 euro....
This is ridiculous.... hey where are the happy customers? seem they don't have the courage to complain here..... fear to lose face maybe?
;-)
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Poor Screwit.
I know his frustration well. Maybe he shouldn't have been banned? The wannabe forums don't really serve a purpose. Perhaps letting wannabe victims blow off some steam would be a useful new function?
Once upon a time, all training was paid for. You'd of needed your head read to buy 200 hrs of training for IR. But some of those not good enough to get jobs at the end of that training, bought their way in. And then you'd have had to be insane to buy a rating on a turboprop or something to get experience so someone would rate you on a jet. But those not good enough got daddy to buy them in. And then TR on jets became the norm and those not good enough bought line training courtesy of daddy to get them in. Next those who don't get in with 500 hrs will get daddy to buy 1500 hrs to unfreeze their license and all airlines will ask for that as a minimum. Maybe after that they will demand two ratings so you are flexible. Without legislation it will only get worse because the rich sometimes have dumb kids and they will buy them good jobs. And that's just the way its always been. And whether your daddy is wedged or not, you have to keep up.
I got my license as just after the economy crashed in 2008 and RyanScare and EZ made were the only people recruiting. I didn't risk a TR. Not without a guaranteed job to go to. For a long time I was very depressed. All that money, all that time. Hey it was my 'dream' as much as anyone else's. But I've had more time to 'get over it' and I'm not unhappy I'm not a pilot. I don't want to spend my life worrying that I'll lose my job as fresh money-in-hand wannabes look to buy my seat from under me. I don't want to have my company treat me like dirt because 10,000 other people would start my job tomorrow, I don't want to watch my wages tumble and my T&Cs be a source of personal embarrassment. I don't want a decade of debt.
I just want a dignified, well paid job with some security. I'll fly on the weekend.
I'd have probably made a good pilot. I can make a sound and rational decision in a highly stressful and emotionally charged situation. I'm not sure those who re-mortgage their parents houses as a shot to nothing can.
I know his frustration well. Maybe he shouldn't have been banned? The wannabe forums don't really serve a purpose. Perhaps letting wannabe victims blow off some steam would be a useful new function?
Once upon a time, all training was paid for. You'd of needed your head read to buy 200 hrs of training for IR. But some of those not good enough to get jobs at the end of that training, bought their way in. And then you'd have had to be insane to buy a rating on a turboprop or something to get experience so someone would rate you on a jet. But those not good enough got daddy to buy them in. And then TR on jets became the norm and those not good enough bought line training courtesy of daddy to get them in. Next those who don't get in with 500 hrs will get daddy to buy 1500 hrs to unfreeze their license and all airlines will ask for that as a minimum. Maybe after that they will demand two ratings so you are flexible. Without legislation it will only get worse because the rich sometimes have dumb kids and they will buy them good jobs. And that's just the way its always been. And whether your daddy is wedged or not, you have to keep up.
I got my license as just after the economy crashed in 2008 and RyanScare and EZ made were the only people recruiting. I didn't risk a TR. Not without a guaranteed job to go to. For a long time I was very depressed. All that money, all that time. Hey it was my 'dream' as much as anyone else's. But I've had more time to 'get over it' and I'm not unhappy I'm not a pilot. I don't want to spend my life worrying that I'll lose my job as fresh money-in-hand wannabes look to buy my seat from under me. I don't want to have my company treat me like dirt because 10,000 other people would start my job tomorrow, I don't want to watch my wages tumble and my T&Cs be a source of personal embarrassment. I don't want a decade of debt.
I just want a dignified, well paid job with some security. I'll fly on the weekend.
I'd have probably made a good pilot. I can make a sound and rational decision in a highly stressful and emotionally charged situation. I'm not sure those who re-mortgage their parents houses as a shot to nothing can.
Last edited by ppraticallybroke; 15th Sep 2012 at 17:17.
Lion Air isn't the answer
A guy I know who was living in the Middle East (Indian passport holder) finished up at Lion Air a couple of months ago(Eagle Jet scheme). With his line training and one year employment he has clocked up around 1800 hours.
About two months before his contract expired he started sending out CV's and contacting agencies.
KAL-No hope as he doesn't have a 2 year college degree or better.
Hong Kong Airlines-No response
Air Hong Kong-3000 TT required (Not hiring now anyway)
SIA Cargo-No response
Qatar-Not hiring
Gulf Air-Not hiring
Safi Airways-Not enough experience (only response given)
Fly Dubai-2500 hours TT required
Yangtze River Airlines-3000 TT required
You get the idea.
He was told by one agency that most of the clients wouldn't interview someone from Lion Air. Even if they were locals and didn't pay for a job. The standard is just too low and the pilot would have to have considerable remedial training to get to a standard required by most more reputable airlines.
My friend is now worried that his 50K USD will have been wasted. The fact that he has an Indonesian licence and an Indian passport doesn't help (DGCA does not recognise Indonesian quals and hours). He fears it will take months to get the DGCA to issue him with an Indian licence and transfer his 737 type rating (Type rating done in the US but not sure if its DGCA compliant). His Australian licence isn't current and would require him to fly to Australia and spend around 3K AUD to get that current and then he could transfer his type to that licence which wouldn't be too difficult. It would take a while though with lots of paperwork. After all this is sorted out he will be out of the 90 day to six month window for currency that most companies ask for.
In true style he stated that "I probably should have done P2F on an A320, I would have had many more companies to choose from!". I fear that even if this was the case the response would be the same.
So for all you guys and girls out there that have a friend who knows someone who heard about a guy who did P2F and is now working for (insert airline name here) be very wary. Most of the stories are myths made up by people trying to justify to their mates about the decision they made to do a P2F scheme. These threads are littered with ex P2F people who still haven't found employment. A guy on the Bizjet forum a few months ago wrote that he had just finished at Lion Air was now willing to pay for another type rating to get into a biz jet!
About two months before his contract expired he started sending out CV's and contacting agencies.
KAL-No hope as he doesn't have a 2 year college degree or better.
Hong Kong Airlines-No response
Air Hong Kong-3000 TT required (Not hiring now anyway)
SIA Cargo-No response
Qatar-Not hiring
Gulf Air-Not hiring
Safi Airways-Not enough experience (only response given)
Fly Dubai-2500 hours TT required
Yangtze River Airlines-3000 TT required
You get the idea.
He was told by one agency that most of the clients wouldn't interview someone from Lion Air. Even if they were locals and didn't pay for a job. The standard is just too low and the pilot would have to have considerable remedial training to get to a standard required by most more reputable airlines.
My friend is now worried that his 50K USD will have been wasted. The fact that he has an Indonesian licence and an Indian passport doesn't help (DGCA does not recognise Indonesian quals and hours). He fears it will take months to get the DGCA to issue him with an Indian licence and transfer his 737 type rating (Type rating done in the US but not sure if its DGCA compliant). His Australian licence isn't current and would require him to fly to Australia and spend around 3K AUD to get that current and then he could transfer his type to that licence which wouldn't be too difficult. It would take a while though with lots of paperwork. After all this is sorted out he will be out of the 90 day to six month window for currency that most companies ask for.
In true style he stated that "I probably should have done P2F on an A320, I would have had many more companies to choose from!". I fear that even if this was the case the response would be the same.
So for all you guys and girls out there that have a friend who knows someone who heard about a guy who did P2F and is now working for (insert airline name here) be very wary. Most of the stories are myths made up by people trying to justify to their mates about the decision they made to do a P2F scheme. These threads are littered with ex P2F people who still haven't found employment. A guy on the Bizjet forum a few months ago wrote that he had just finished at Lion Air was now willing to pay for another type rating to get into a biz jet!
Last edited by pilotchute; 16th Sep 2012 at 04:04.
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Pilot chute
It sounds like pilot who used to work or is working in Lion Air cannot get a job from recruitment agency because of their poor reputation... 
really feel sorry for those guys...
really feel sorry for those guys...
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I know two guys who gut hired after p2f.
One of the guy did his line training 200 hrs with pegasus air, on the 737NG
4 years ago. And is now hired with Oman air.
The other guy did his line training 150 hrs with bmi on the 320,and are now hired with Novair in sweden.
Both are Jaa holders, and are swedish citizens, maybe they have a better chanse, idont know..
4 years ago. And is now hired with Oman air.
The other guy did his line training 150 hrs with bmi on the 320,and are now hired with Novair in sweden.
Both are Jaa holders, and are swedish citizens, maybe they have a better chanse, idont know..
Rumours again
Aerokin seems to be privy to the whereabouts of 9 ex Lion Air pilots who all left in the last 3 months. Unless Aerokin knows these people personally I would say he is getting his info second hand.
The fact that Qatar haven't started anyone for ages and Scoot haven't advertised at all for pilots I find it hard to believe. If someone can correct me on this please do. If Scoot had advertised Im sure it would be for 777 rated guys anyway.
Korean have been desperate for drivers for a while. This is probably due to the fact that they require degree's of two year Diploma's for FO's. I can only gauge Korean Air by what I read on here and it doesn't sound nice.
So far we have 2 guys at Jet2 and a couple of guys who got hired 4 years ago. My that is glowing review for P2F!
As a foot note on another thread a fellow mentioned that in a recent interview he went to in the UK he was the only person who hadn't done P2F. He probably would have had a chance at getting hired if he wasn't competing against guys who had paid for something that should be paid for by the airline. I know that TR's are now the norm to be paid for but paying for the first 500 hours in the airplane is just wrong.
The fact that Qatar haven't started anyone for ages and Scoot haven't advertised at all for pilots I find it hard to believe. If someone can correct me on this please do. If Scoot had advertised Im sure it would be for 777 rated guys anyway.
Korean have been desperate for drivers for a while. This is probably due to the fact that they require degree's of two year Diploma's for FO's. I can only gauge Korean Air by what I read on here and it doesn't sound nice.
So far we have 2 guys at Jet2 and a couple of guys who got hired 4 years ago. My that is glowing review for P2F!
As a foot note on another thread a fellow mentioned that in a recent interview he went to in the UK he was the only person who hadn't done P2F. He probably would have had a chance at getting hired if he wasn't competing against guys who had paid for something that should be paid for by the airline. I know that TR's are now the norm to be paid for but paying for the first 500 hours in the airplane is just wrong.
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he was the only person who hadn't done P2F. He probably would have had a chance at getting hired if he wasn't competing against guys who had paid for something that should be paid for by the airline.
I had to laugh at this comment because its ludicrous! If this guy who went to the interview had zero hours then the comment above would be correct, but seeing as he got an interview with these P2f guys must mean he had the hours required also!
The fact he didn't get the job is more than likely because he didn't fit the criteria the company wanted, NOT because the other guy paid for his hours.
The fact it was in the UK just proves my point, because if it was true, then no way would the p2f pilots be flying for free with a UK outfit, I think HMR&C and the employees would be saying something.
I cant name one UK outfit that actually does 500 hours -12months employment flying for free...the questionable outfits, do pay but at an extremely low wage..but if your getting paid then it cant be classed as P2f.
I had to laugh at this comment because its ludicrous! If this guy who went to the interview had zero hours then the comment above would be correct, but seeing as he got an interview with these P2f guys must mean he had the hours required also!
The fact he didn't get the job is more than likely because he didn't fit the criteria the company wanted, NOT because the other guy paid for his hours.
The fact it was in the UK just proves my point, because if it was true, then no way would the p2f pilots be flying for free with a UK outfit, I think HMR&C and the employees would be saying something.
I cant name one UK outfit that actually does 500 hours -12months employment flying for free...the questionable outfits, do pay but at an extremely low wage..but if your getting paid then it cant be classed as P2f.
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P2F is not a big deal since actually it's something unreal...
I mean, people think they will get a job, but it's completely out of the industries, it's something from business and private TRTO.
I have been hired with only 700h (single piston engine) on A320, TR paid by y airlines (+ hotel and food), at Airbus TRTO.
Airlines take pilots based on contact and attitude not on hours etc...
For sure, if you go into this business from private TRTO, you have good chance to not find job... Poeple think we get a job thanks to that, but in reality that's not the normal way. The normal way is nicer and honest.
So for exemple, nobody from private TRTO, who bought a Type rating has stolen my job
I got it and no need to pay anything.
Don't read forums etc, many informations are fake... get out, find a job, make contacts and don't stay in front of computers.
I mean, people think they will get a job, but it's completely out of the industries, it's something from business and private TRTO.
I have been hired with only 700h (single piston engine) on A320, TR paid by y airlines (+ hotel and food), at Airbus TRTO.
Airlines take pilots based on contact and attitude not on hours etc...
For sure, if you go into this business from private TRTO, you have good chance to not find job... Poeple think we get a job thanks to that, but in reality that's not the normal way. The normal way is nicer and honest.
So for exemple, nobody from private TRTO, who bought a Type rating has stolen my job
I got it and no need to pay anything. Don't read forums etc, many informations are fake... get out, find a job, make contacts and don't stay in front of computers.
what do you expect from p2f?
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There are 3 ex lion pilots at jet2 and another
one at NAS.
one at NAS.
Just asking !!
Last 3 month alone, lion air
lost 2 pilots to flyscoot and 5 went into qatar airways all of them on 777 now,
2 went to korean on the 737NG
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Correct, they fly CL, do you know if they are still hiring ? i tried but i didn't get any answer in 2 weeks .... , do you have to pay for the difference course only or you have to pay the line training again ??
Tanks
Tanks
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Jet2 have 4 NG's you can find this information online!!
As far as I know jet2 cover all the training costs unless your a cadet where you have to cover the TR.
737RIDE, your location is Jakarta, if your Indonesian you will require an EU license and visa to work. Reading the Jet2 thread they will get back to you at some point Inshallah!!
As far as I know jet2 cover all the training costs unless your a cadet where you have to cover the TR.
737RIDE, your location is Jakarta, if your Indonesian you will require an EU license and visa to work. Reading the Jet2 thread they will get back to you at some point Inshallah!!
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Oh .. that's great tanks , no, i'm European with UK ATPL , Trying to get back in Europe from some time now but i would like to stay on the NG, basicaly worried about my future, but at this point i don't care i'll take anithing becouse most probably they will not renew my contract next year... and i still don't have any other shot even here in Asia... hope they will reply me soon ..
i already checked the website and many other info.. let's hope for the best, would be sutch a releife for me ... They have almost 40 planes, it's good in long term as well... maybe the end of the Tunnel ??
i already checked the website and many other info.. let's hope for the best, would be sutch a releife for me ... They have almost 40 planes, it's good in long term as well... maybe the end of the Tunnel ??
Last edited by 737RIDE; 28th Oct 2012 at 09:29.
