Is it worth renewing?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: England
Posts: 33
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Is it worth renewing?
Sorry if this is in the wrong forum, however it relates to potential employment so this seem a fitting place. Basically my ME-IR expires at the end of May, along with my Class one medical. I've got another year on my SEP rating and I'm currently doing GA VFR stuff to build hours etc. Given the state of the job market, is it worth renewing the IR and medical, or waiting until it's worth doing? I realise I'd be unable to renew in the sim. I'm sure other people have this though, paying £500-£700 to renew everything but not really taking advantage of it. Am I right in saying that if your IR has not been renewed it is still classed as being valid, although not current, for up to about 5 years I think?
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Europe
Age: 40
Posts: 106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The thing you're saying about IR & 5 years sounds familiar...
If you can manage to build up your hours by renewing, it is def worth it. I've been in your situation!
Good luck.
If you can manage to build up your hours by renewing, it is def worth it. I've been in your situation!
Good luck.
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: I wish I knew
Posts: 624
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Renewal of an Instrument Rating (Aeroplane), within a period of not exceeding 5 years from the expiry date of the rating then a proficiency check is required to renew. If 5 years has been exceeded, then an Initial Instrument Rating Skill Test with a CAA Staff Flight Examiner is required.
Probably not worth renewing unless you want to do a Type Rating, if you are currently hours building you can remain IFR brained in VFR conditions anyway.
Probably not worth renewing unless you want to do a Type Rating, if you are currently hours building you can remain IFR brained in VFR conditions anyway.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: England
Posts: 33
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
But would an airline require you to actually have a current IR, or can you still apply and if you were going to do a type rating just revalidate it before then? Basically would it be viewed badly by an potential employer or would it not matter if they can see you're flying fairly often? I've got so many friends who've paid to renew it all etc, yet not done a moments IFR flying or a sniff of an interview. Just seems like a waste of money in that case.
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: France
Posts: 749
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Most airlines like to see a current IR, because they already have 1 billion resume with all the requirements they ask, in addition to all the licence/rating/medical up to date and valid.
Just imagine one second you are a chief pilot, what would you choose when you have choice?
Just imagine one second you are a chief pilot, what would you choose when you have choice?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: England
Posts: 33
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I see your point, however on balance given that a lot of people don't do any flying at all and just apply with current licences, (as do most of my friends) surely the fact they you fly regularly and are at least involved with something aviation related is worth more? I'm just playing devils advocate here btw.
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Ireland
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I was in your postion last September but eventually decided to renew, now almost 6 months later, am still working on a till. Was it worth it, clearly not but still gave me the opportunity to apply to airlines plus i can do a type rating too. It just depends on your circumstances.
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Neither here nor there
Age: 41
Posts: 214
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You have to have a valid IR to start a typerating course.
But you can still apply to airlines without it (maybe just state that you have it), if you get invited for an interview then just do it quickly It's just a prof check. Most airlines give u a notice time of atleast one month for interview, so u got plenty of time....If you even will get an interview
But you can still apply to airlines without it (maybe just state that you have it), if you get invited for an interview then just do it quickly It's just a prof check. Most airlines give u a notice time of atleast one month for interview, so u got plenty of time....If you even will get an interview
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: France
Posts: 749
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I see your point, however on balance given that a lot of people don't do any flying at all and just apply with current licences, (as do most of my friends) surely the fact they you fly regularly and are at least involved with something aviation related is worth more? I'm just playing devils advocate here btw.
If you ask: at that worth it concerning my bank account, will I ever find an airline job? That's a whole different story.
There is some hiring right now, I don't think it will last for ever. That's all I can understand.
You could also try to focus on your current job and make a career in the GA.
If your immediate goal is the airline, I would definitely reniew my IR right now (finance permitting...).
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: somewhere on this planet
Posts: 369
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I know plenty of guys who wait to renew it.
they say if an airline is really interested by them, the company will renew their TR, which in fact take 2-3 sim sessions.
you will anyway go back to the sim before line training. Eaverybody will go line training too.
if an airline want all license current and vlid, it means they don't care about you. They just want cheap pilots or guys who pay to fly, and if this is the case, your job will be hell, because you are going to fly for a very cheap company.
they say if an airline is really interested by them, the company will renew their TR, which in fact take 2-3 sim sessions.
you will anyway go back to the sim before line training. Eaverybody will go line training too.
if an airline want all license current and vlid, it means they don't care about you. They just want cheap pilots or guys who pay to fly, and if this is the case, your job will be hell, because you are going to fly for a very cheap company.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: England
Posts: 33
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Tbh I'm actually enjoying doing GA flying. Whilst financially I need to break into airline work, I'm starting to value gaining experience through GA. Yes it might not be flying at FL100 atm, but it's a totally different ball game doing GA outside of the clutches of your FTO. It's my licence now so I've got to protect it, myself and my passengers (not in that order mind you!). I'm meeting interesting people and perhaps one day I'll meet someone who might give me an opportunity, be it taking an A/C to Exeter or a desk job in an airline. Other than the likes of Ryanair and Easy, I can't see many airlines opening their doors to 200 hours cadets unless you know the right person which is sadly still how it seems to work. I guess it boils down to money at the end of the day, will have to look at things in a month and then decide. On a seperate note, VFR flying is as challenging as IFR, or so I've rediscovered!
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: France
Posts: 749
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I guess here is your answer:
You asked also if it was worth it to renew your medical. I don't get it, you sure need it when you fly VFR.
I admit I don't fully understand what you want.
To be clear: if you send your resume (in order to be hired) to the airlines yes you need your IR to be current most of the time.
If you don't know how to choose between the airlines and GA, and asking here for some advice about it, I would answer you don't have the choice apparently right now anyway.
Finally, yes a career in GA is very interesting and could even be challenging. Concerning the flying I think that's more interesting than the airlines, I have experienced both.
Tbh I'm actually enjoying doing GA flying.
I admit I don't fully understand what you want.
To be clear: if you send your resume (in order to be hired) to the airlines yes you need your IR to be current most of the time.
If you don't know how to choose between the airlines and GA, and asking here for some advice about it, I would answer you don't have the choice apparently right now anyway.
Finally, yes a career in GA is very interesting and could even be challenging. Concerning the flying I think that's more interesting than the airlines, I have experienced both.
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Polymer Records
Posts: 597
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Renew it.
If you don't renew your professional qualifications now, you'll look back and see this as the pivotal point of when you gave up. And what will be the trigger that makes you eventually renew? Seeing other people in your shoes getting jobs? Jobs you could have had?
When the job opportunity comes, you'll need your ME-IR and will curse yourself for not renewing.
Good luck with the job hunting, and hang in there.
If you don't renew your professional qualifications now, you'll look back and see this as the pivotal point of when you gave up. And what will be the trigger that makes you eventually renew? Seeing other people in your shoes getting jobs? Jobs you could have had?
When the job opportunity comes, you'll need your ME-IR and will curse yourself for not renewing.
Good luck with the job hunting, and hang in there.
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Wor Yerm
Age: 68
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
By all means, keep the medical current. But as ever, I'll take a different view regarding the IR. The airlines I have worked for understand that it is extremely expensive for an individual to keep an IR valid. They do want you to be able to fly on instruments and have a valid rating at the the appropriate time, but to always keep it valid when your money could be better spent elsewhere suggests that your priorities may not be sensible. You should be able to sell this at an interview.
As regards VFR flying, hats off to every proponent of that art. That's the most difficult flying I've ever done.
As regards VFR flying, hats off to every proponent of that art. That's the most difficult flying I've ever done.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: England
Posts: 33
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just to clarify, I wasn't asking about choice in careers between GA and Airline. I was asking whether it was worth paying to renew licences when airlines are seldom hiring and I don't need them for GA. Obviously if the industry picked up I would renew it straight away. I just feel like in the mean time, the cost of doing right not is the cost for me of 4-5 hours of flying. As for the medical, I've got another year of class 2 privileges.
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: somewhere on this planet
Posts: 369
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
better not to renew it , and say to the airline you give them the cash if you got the job.
if you have saved 10'000 euro, I am sure an airline would be interested to hire you over a guy with a current t/r or instrument and no money.
I have seen airlines charging money for the company course, and the line training up to 100h.So you definitively need money. Airlines have their own TREs(type rating examiners) who will renew your T/R.
think about it!
if you have saved 10'000 euro, I am sure an airline would be interested to hire you over a guy with a current t/r or instrument and no money.
I have seen airlines charging money for the company course, and the line training up to 100h.So you definitively need money. Airlines have their own TREs(type rating examiners) who will renew your T/R.
think about it!
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: liverpool
Posts: 94
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
i/r renewal or not?
Hi,
My advice is don't renew it unless you have a response from an employer,with a potential interview on the horizon.I skipped the first year after my initial i/r.I Renewed the 3rd year as the jobs market seemed to be improving.A further 4 renewals after that with no job!
You can usually do the revalidation at fairly short notice with the major flying schools.You would be very unlucky to have such short notice from an Airline that you wouldn't have the time to book in and renew somewhere!
I would recommend you do this in the simulator to save money.It is just a tick in the box and the Airlines don't really care so long as it is current!
In my experience they don't even ask either!No medals are given for shelling out more money just to do it in the Aircraft either!Personally I think,considering the cost, I bet most people have no intention of flying a light piston twin again after passing the initial I/R?!
I would recommend Multi Flight at Leeds (and now Blackpool).I have revalidated my I/R 5 times there now.Very friendly,helpfull etc; And a very fair examiner too!
One day you and most Pilots who go to the Airlines will come to realise that there is very little relevance between flying a light piston twin and a 65 ton Jet.I am sure someone will disagree but they will probably be a proud multi I/R Istructor or from a G/A background and who havn't been exposed to the Airline Jet world!
The initial I/R is a huge achievment but for most it's just a major step towards something more difficult....flying a BIG passenger carrying Aircraft!
No disrespect to those who won't agree,but it just is a million miles away from Airline flying!(Just my own opinion based on my own experiences).Sometimes for many,ignorance is bliss!
After a couple of revalidations you will see what I mean about the 'tick in the box' and come to wonder why you found the I/R so difficult in the first place!
Anyway,good luck with the job hunting!!
My advice is don't renew it unless you have a response from an employer,with a potential interview on the horizon.I skipped the first year after my initial i/r.I Renewed the 3rd year as the jobs market seemed to be improving.A further 4 renewals after that with no job!
You can usually do the revalidation at fairly short notice with the major flying schools.You would be very unlucky to have such short notice from an Airline that you wouldn't have the time to book in and renew somewhere!
I would recommend you do this in the simulator to save money.It is just a tick in the box and the Airlines don't really care so long as it is current!
In my experience they don't even ask either!No medals are given for shelling out more money just to do it in the Aircraft either!Personally I think,considering the cost, I bet most people have no intention of flying a light piston twin again after passing the initial I/R?!
I would recommend Multi Flight at Leeds (and now Blackpool).I have revalidated my I/R 5 times there now.Very friendly,helpfull etc; And a very fair examiner too!
One day you and most Pilots who go to the Airlines will come to realise that there is very little relevance between flying a light piston twin and a 65 ton Jet.I am sure someone will disagree but they will probably be a proud multi I/R Istructor or from a G/A background and who havn't been exposed to the Airline Jet world!
The initial I/R is a huge achievment but for most it's just a major step towards something more difficult....flying a BIG passenger carrying Aircraft!
No disrespect to those who won't agree,but it just is a million miles away from Airline flying!(Just my own opinion based on my own experiences).Sometimes for many,ignorance is bliss!
After a couple of revalidations you will see what I mean about the 'tick in the box' and come to wonder why you found the I/R so difficult in the first place!
Anyway,good luck with the job hunting!!
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 2,312
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I appreciate that is very difficult to keep these things current when you are having to pay for it yourself with limited funds. However I would advise anybody who can, to keep everything (medical and IR) valid and current.
The temptation is always to cutback wherever possible. The problem is that it doesn't get any easier the longer the period of lapse.
It is all well and good to say "renew when there is a possibility of an interview," the trouble with that is, that the application will almost always want to know the date of your last test.
Companies are not struggling to find applicants. They are looking at whittling down very large piles of applications to arrive at the limited selection of people to offer interviews to. With this in mind, nobody would be doing themselves any favours by not being current in all respects at the point of application.
The temptation is always to cutback wherever possible. The problem is that it doesn't get any easier the longer the period of lapse.
It is all well and good to say "renew when there is a possibility of an interview," the trouble with that is, that the application will almost always want to know the date of your last test.
Companies are not struggling to find applicants. They are looking at whittling down very large piles of applications to arrive at the limited selection of people to offer interviews to. With this in mind, nobody would be doing themselves any favours by not being current in all respects at the point of application.
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: UK
Age: 35
Posts: 359
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In regards to the IR renewal I'd perhaps be a little wary that not renewing might make the next time you do a lot harder than it needs to be. I'm guessing it'll just be a sim renewal you have to do?
Also the medical might not be worth renewing to be honest, you can still fly on the class 2 privileges whilst doing hour building and when you do get any interview offers then renew at that point. I managed to get my class 1 renewed for £30 so there was on reason for me not to.
Also the medical might not be worth renewing to be honest, you can still fly on the class 2 privileges whilst doing hour building and when you do get any interview offers then renew at that point. I managed to get my class 1 renewed for £30 so there was on reason for me not to.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: England
Posts: 33
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That's all good advice thank you. For anyone who has renewed the IR in the sim of late, how did it compare with the initial? I passed my IR in a DA42 so was hoping to find another DA42 sim if I do the renewal, however the only places I can find are Shoreham and Cabair, and Cabair are nearly £300 more expensive for the same thing, and I live up North so Shoreham is a long way to go. I'd be happy to do it in a different sim, however I don't know if that will add to the job in hand.