Saturation in indian aviation?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: INDIA
Posts: 27
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Saturation in indian aviation?
Hello friends i have few question's for you ...
Have India achieved it's saturation in aviation?
Do the field require more pilots?
any solid proofs can be submitted?
plz bring the truth to the light...
Have India achieved it's saturation in aviation?
Do the field require more pilots?
any solid proofs can be submitted?
plz bring the truth to the light...
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Everywhere
Posts: 140
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I used to "love" indian students at my school in the states (they were majority), and there way of "thinking"
They were very UNSAFE as pilots, and they had no rescpect for their own lifes, what about others...
Falling asleep while flying cessna, saying that they dip the tanks (if it wasnt for their instructors double checking, many of them would probably crash), when they didnt even bother to. Trying to force on x-country when the weather at the destination is very bad, and telling the instructors that weather is fine (thinking they wouldnt double check on them?!?!) All this was was happening way to often!
All this becauce ALL they did care about is to get the PAPERS and anything else didnt matter to them.
This is why when they join indian companies as FOs on jet, they are not allowed to even think of touching anything for 1st couple of years, hehe
They were very UNSAFE as pilots, and they had no rescpect for their own lifes, what about others...
Falling asleep while flying cessna, saying that they dip the tanks (if it wasnt for their instructors double checking, many of them would probably crash), when they didnt even bother to. Trying to force on x-country when the weather at the destination is very bad, and telling the instructors that weather is fine (thinking they wouldnt double check on them?!?!) All this was was happening way to often!
All this becauce ALL they did care about is to get the PAPERS and anything else didnt matter to them.
This is why when they join indian companies as FOs on jet, they are not allowed to even think of touching anything for 1st couple of years, hehe
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: India
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
@GBB
Please do not generalize. I've got my CPL in the states and what a shocker: I'm alive to tell the tale !
I've flown with people who have worked very hard and have acted in a professional manner throughout their training. For you to say everyone who is in India and waiting for their first airline job is an accident waiting to happen is really silly.
@topic starter
Yes, the fact is that India has 2000-3000 CPL's currently with another 1000 or so to be added soon enough. The airlines are not hiring(unless you count AI's 21 seats) and some may start cutting back soon.
It does not look good.
Please do not generalize. I've got my CPL in the states and what a shocker: I'm alive to tell the tale !
I've flown with people who have worked very hard and have acted in a professional manner throughout their training. For you to say everyone who is in India and waiting for their first airline job is an accident waiting to happen is really silly.
@topic starter
Yes, the fact is that India has 2000-3000 CPL's currently with another 1000 or so to be added soon enough. The airlines are not hiring(unless you count AI's 21 seats) and some may start cutting back soon.
It does not look good.
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Everywhere
Posts: 140
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Did you see me saying ALL of them or anything like that?
No, coz they were few working hard. Majority tho just came there beacuse they decided to be airline pilots for "fame and money".
Dont tell me that being in aviation industry in India (crew) isnt something that give some sort of "higher status".
I worked with many crew from India and this is what they used to say, its probably 2nd best job to Celebes when you are in the aviation.
Trust me, there were few hard working folks from india there, with lots of passion for flying. I know that you will try to take their/your site, but trust me...
I've seen it all and if all of these kids make it into Indian aviation there will be at least 50-70 new FOs with no respect for any sort of rules or regulations and other people lifes (since they dont care much about their own).
No, coz they were few working hard. Majority tho just came there beacuse they decided to be airline pilots for "fame and money".
Dont tell me that being in aviation industry in India (crew) isnt something that give some sort of "higher status".
I worked with many crew from India and this is what they used to say, its probably 2nd best job to Celebes when you are in the aviation.
Trust me, there were few hard working folks from india there, with lots of passion for flying. I know that you will try to take their/your site, but trust me...
I've seen it all and if all of these kids make it into Indian aviation there will be at least 50-70 new FOs with no respect for any sort of rules or regulations and other people lifes (since they dont care much about their own).
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Ireland
Posts: 272
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
rsathish, you are seeing history repeat itself.
The first burst of Indian private Aviation carriers started in the early 90s. Within a few years, there was a bloodbath, and 2 of the carriers survived - Jet and Sahara. About 5 years ago, the second burst of private Indian airlines started, owned mainly by entrepeneurs who had no background in aviation, and run mainly by Indians who either had no aviation background or who had only operated in India. No-one was ever going to take a train again, everyone could fly for a few Rupees to anywhere they wanted in India. You got 5 aircraft to gain your scheduled carrier licence from the DGCA, and after that you ordered whatever mad number of aircraft came into your head with Airbus or Boeing. Your stock kept going up, and you could sell in a couple of years to someone else and retire with a fortune. Anyone could become a pilot (a JET pilot, that is, none of that turboprop stuff), earn hundreds of Lakhs, wear shades, have someone carry your bag and call you Captain, and have hosties lining up to hump your leg.
No-one foresaw the current recession which hasn't helped, but it didn't need a doctorate to see from outside what was going on in India would end in tears at some stage, and that there would have to be a Mark II major sorting-out. You can't keep running airlines at a loss, and have "Low-Cost" airlines in a high cost environmment - the Indian states can't keep charging stupid amounts of tax on ATF, have an inadequate aviation infrastructure, and think it will go on forever. It has now got to the stage where Indian airlines are cutting orders, leasing their existing aircraft out of the country, and experienced Indian pilots are leaving for expat contracts elsewhere. It will stabilise, but it has some way to go yet, some more tears will be shed, and the ones who came in on the tail end of the wave will suffer most.
Lest anyone think this is anti-Indian (I'll leave that to morons like GBB), unfortunately stupidity is a universal trait - look at all the Americans and Europeans who thought that their house price would never fall, and banks who lent to people who would never pay them back. Aviation in India has a long way to go yet, but dealing with reality and retrenching first is essential.
The first burst of Indian private Aviation carriers started in the early 90s. Within a few years, there was a bloodbath, and 2 of the carriers survived - Jet and Sahara. About 5 years ago, the second burst of private Indian airlines started, owned mainly by entrepeneurs who had no background in aviation, and run mainly by Indians who either had no aviation background or who had only operated in India. No-one was ever going to take a train again, everyone could fly for a few Rupees to anywhere they wanted in India. You got 5 aircraft to gain your scheduled carrier licence from the DGCA, and after that you ordered whatever mad number of aircraft came into your head with Airbus or Boeing. Your stock kept going up, and you could sell in a couple of years to someone else and retire with a fortune. Anyone could become a pilot (a JET pilot, that is, none of that turboprop stuff), earn hundreds of Lakhs, wear shades, have someone carry your bag and call you Captain, and have hosties lining up to hump your leg.
No-one foresaw the current recession which hasn't helped, but it didn't need a doctorate to see from outside what was going on in India would end in tears at some stage, and that there would have to be a Mark II major sorting-out. You can't keep running airlines at a loss, and have "Low-Cost" airlines in a high cost environmment - the Indian states can't keep charging stupid amounts of tax on ATF, have an inadequate aviation infrastructure, and think it will go on forever. It has now got to the stage where Indian airlines are cutting orders, leasing their existing aircraft out of the country, and experienced Indian pilots are leaving for expat contracts elsewhere. It will stabilise, but it has some way to go yet, some more tears will be shed, and the ones who came in on the tail end of the wave will suffer most.
Lest anyone think this is anti-Indian (I'll leave that to morons like GBB), unfortunately stupidity is a universal trait - look at all the Americans and Europeans who thought that their house price would never fall, and banks who lent to people who would never pay them back. Aviation in India has a long way to go yet, but dealing with reality and retrenching first is essential.
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Everywhere
Posts: 140
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
bear,
Did I call you or anybody else a moron?
I just commented on WHAT I've SEEN, which part you didnt understand?!
I can like or disslike whatever I want (at least I'm not rude and dont call people names), all I said was pure FACTS.
Did I call you or anybody else a moron?
I just commented on WHAT I've SEEN, which part you didnt understand?!
I can like or disslike whatever I want (at least I'm not rude and dont call people names), all I said was pure FACTS.
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Europe
Posts: 651
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
They were very UNSAFE as pilots, and they had no rescpect for their own lifes, what about others...
Falling asleep while flying cessna, saying that they dip the tanks (if it wasnt for their instructors double checking, many of them would probably crash), when they didnt even bother to. Trying to force on x-country when the weather at the destination is very bad, and telling the instructors that weather is fine (thinking they wouldnt double check on them?!?!) All this was was happening way to often!
Falling asleep while flying cessna, saying that they dip the tanks (if it wasnt for their instructors double checking, many of them would probably crash), when they didnt even bother to. Trying to force on x-country when the weather at the destination is very bad, and telling the instructors that weather is fine (thinking they wouldnt double check on them?!?!) All this was was happening way to often!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: INDIA
Posts: 27
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
@GBB
you have pointed out some unwanted stuff here, which dose not fit to this topic. anyway let's forget about it..
@others
i agree to the stuff's like we lack in infrastructure and other things
what about things like deadline for foreign pilots july 2010?
nearly 1000's are moving out vacancies are created ...
and few 100's of boeing and airbus are waiting for delivery
what's your thought about that?
you have pointed out some unwanted stuff here, which dose not fit to this topic. anyway let's forget about it..
@others
i agree to the stuff's like we lack in infrastructure and other things
what about things like deadline for foreign pilots july 2010?
nearly 1000's are moving out vacancies are created ...
and few 100's of boeing and airbus are waiting for delivery
what's your thought about that?
Guest
Posts: n/a
rsathish.
domain-b.com : Indian aviation faces likely downgrade over flouting of safety norms
If India are downgraded you'll see a worse situation. As for saying GBB's comments are irrelevant I'm afraid you're wrong. You don't have to be a genius to see what is going to happen in a market saturated with aircraft and pilots.
domain-b.com : Indian aviation faces likely downgrade over flouting of safety norms
If India are downgraded you'll see a worse situation. As for saying GBB's comments are irrelevant I'm afraid you're wrong. You don't have to be a genius to see what is going to happen in a market saturated with aircraft and pilots.
I Have Control
Join Date: May 2004
Location: North-West England
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Try operating into New Delhi, Bombay, or Calcutta. Aviation in India is saturated all right. And whilst I cannot (and would not wish to) judge Indian pro pilot standards, ATC is variable, and the ignorami who govern the airports structure are numbskulls or corrupt. Possibly both. The major airports are appalling in terms of runways, taxiways, lighting, approach aids serviceability, terminals, immigration, usw. Charter colleagues report the same for places like Goa. All operators and ATC are forced to contend with high traffic loads, bad weather, and primitive facilities. Its not Bollywood.
No room for growth. Saturated.
No room for growth. Saturated.
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: lakshdweep
Age: 36
Posts: 127
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
there r regional airlines which r hiring new 250hr champs and captains u all can try in them like paramount,star aviation in chennai and zav air going to start in kolkata.it might be the national carrier airlines r in losses but regional airlines r in profit because they r operating aircraft less than 40k kg and are exempted from many taxes.
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: FL390
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
@ GBB which utopian paradise of a country do you come from ? By judging a few Indian students , you think you can make a call on every single Indian ??? How many active serving Indian pilots in the airlines/airforce (nevermind the 250 hr wannabes) do you actually know ?
wtf are you going to do when you work with different nationalities on the flight deck like in KWI (assuming you work there) . Are you going to say you dont work with xxx nationality because you "dont like them"? Trust me you would be thrown out for the racist idiot you are.
If all you are interested is in spreading stereotypes and racism , if I were you I would consider visiting a neonazi or skinhead forum .
wtf are you going to do when you work with different nationalities on the flight deck like in KWI (assuming you work there) . Are you going to say you dont work with xxx nationality because you "dont like them"? Trust me you would be thrown out for the racist idiot you are.
If all you are interested is in spreading stereotypes and racism , if I were you I would consider visiting a neonazi or skinhead forum .
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 126
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I can 2nd that observation about one or two I've met, but same goes for Polaks, etc...
@ INNFlight , ze fuhrer not giving you ze blowjob hard enough ? Maybe less nazi talk and more flying ?
Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Orlando, Florida
Age: 68
Posts: 2,586
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hey!
Comments, facts and opinions, delivered politely - NOT name calling.
I'll leave all above alone - but no more names, no more "txt spk" - you have a full keyboard, use it.
Start again - play nice, or don't play at all.
Comments, facts and opinions, delivered politely - NOT name calling.
I'll leave all above alone - but no more names, no more "txt spk" - you have a full keyboard, use it.
Start again - play nice, or don't play at all.
