AreYouForReal

(MOD - Please leave this as a seperate thread so people can ask questions specifically on the training contracts and what it entitles you to and your rights, and dont merge it with the general Ryanair catagory)

OK guys,

Here is some light reading for you. This is the contract that you WILL be offerd on passing your selection for Ryanair. You will have the choice between this and a Broookfields.
I will post the Brookfields a little later on.
The points of interest are underlines, and then an explination of what your rights are will be at the bottom.

Print this off so you have a copy that you can look through and take to a lawer if you wish, (I have removed the name the contract was sent to, but this is a contract that was signed and sent this year)

Corporate Head Office Dublin Airport County Dublin Ireland Telephone: +353 18121212 GeneralFax: + 3531 8121213 Telex: 33588 FROP El Sita; DUBHGFR Reservations: +353 1 6097800 Website:www.Ryanair.com

Department Fax Numbers:
Finance: 01 8121330 Sales & Marketing: 01 8121331 Flight Operations: 01 8444404 Engineering: 01 8121338 Reservations: 01 6097901 Personnel 01 8121415

RYANAIR.COM
THE LOW FARES AIRLINE

RYANAIR BOEING 737-800 TRAINING COURSE

_______________
C/O Ryanair Flight Operations

Dear ________,

Congratulations on successfully completing the Initial Ground-school and Simulator elements of the Ryanair B737 -800 type-rating course with our approved Training Organisation. We are pleased to offer you this fixed-term training contract as Second Officer Boeing 737-800 in Ryanair Ltd. (hereafter referred to as Ryanair) which is subject to your signed acceptance of the specific terms and conditions outlined in this document.

1. Position

This is a 6 month fixed-term training contract with a commencement effective from the start date of Base Training.

(a) Work Permit
This contract and any subsequent permanent contract offer is subject to you having unrestricted right to work anywhere in the EU (if subsequently you are offered a permanent position).
(b) Term
It must be clearly understood that this is a fixed-term training contract only (6 months) and that should a permanent position be available within Ryanair at the end of this contract you will be considered for that position provided your performance and suitability during the term of this training contract has been satisfactory. In the event that you fail to successfully complete your training then your contract will be terminated.
(c) Accommodation / Expenses / Transport
You will be responsible for your own accommodation and transport for the duration of this training contract and no expenses will be payable by Ryanair.
(d) Training Pay .
The Training Pay under section 5 of this contract will be paid and effective from the start date of Base Training (in accordance with section 5 of this contract).
(e) Licence / Medical Costs
Any costs associated with the upkeep of your licence such as medical costs will be your own responsibility. Any contract with Ryanair will be terminated in the event that you do not obtain and maintain licence validation from the appropriate aviation authority.
(f) Licence
On commencing the type rating course you are required to hold a JAR FCL CPL Licence (with all ATPL exams passed) and a Class 1 JAA Medical. Within the fIrst six months of joining Ryanair you are required to transfer your JAR FCL Licence to the Irish Aviation Authority (IAA) and take out an IAA JAR FCL Licence.

Any contract with Ryanair will be terminated in the event that you do not maintain a JAR FCL Licence from the appropriate aviation authority. If you refuse to take out an IAA JAR FCL Licence your contract will be terminated.

2. Line Training

Your B737-800 Line Training will be carried out by Ryanair. This Line Training will be at a cost of STG£90 per sector to Ryanair. Should you fail to honour the full term of this contract or should you fail to accept any offer of a permanent position with Ryanair you will be liable to repay to Ryanair the cost of your line training to that point (the estimated cost of your line training will be STG£6,000).

3. Term

Your training contract will commence upon successful completion of your base check with our Approved Training School to a standard acceptable to the Irish Aviation Authority and Ryanair. This training agreement will terminate six months from that date.
The company reserves the right to extend this training contract or to offer you a permanent contract at the end of this period, however, under no circumstances, should this be considered a guarantee of future employment. If for whatever reason you fail to fulfil the terms and obligations of this Training Contract (for clarity this means you must be available for training for the full six months) you will liable to repay the Base Training costs of €5,072 (€845 per circuit) as well as any line training costs incurred as specifIed in Clause 2 above.

4. Training Hours & Base

Due to the nature of our training, irregular hours, including rostered day or night shifts, are a condition of your training contract. Your line training will take place at any of Ryanair's existing or new European Bases.

5. Training Pay

Your training pay will be at the equivalent rate of €15,000 (Fifteen thousand euro) gross per annum in accordance with section 1 (d) of this training contract. Training pay is paid monthly in arrears into your bank account. This payment will only become effective after commencement of Base training. No other payments will be made for the duration of this contract.



6. MEDICAL EXAMINATION

You must be prepared to be examined by the Company's Medical Officer or his nominee at any time during the course of your training contract at the request of the Chief Pilot or his nominated deputies.. Any medical report generated from that examination will be the property of Ryanair Limited.

7. APPLICABLE LAW

The contractual relationship between Ryanair and you shall at all times be governed by the laws in effect and as amended from time to time in the Republic of Ireland.

8. EXAMINATION FOR SUBSTANCE ABUSE

You must be prepared to be tested for illegal substance by the company's Medical Officer or his nominee at any time during the course of your training contract at the request of the Chief Pilot or his / her nominated deputies. Any medical report generated from that medical examination will be the property of Ryanair. Failure of a substance abuse test will be regarded as gross misconduct and may result in termination of this training contract.

9. TERMINATION OF TRAINING CONTRACT

Whilst Ryanair is committed to honouring the full term of this contract it must be clearly understood that in the event of unforeseen circumstances in the aviation industry eg: acts of terrorism etc., it may be necessary to terminate this contract prior to the full term being completed, in which case training payments will cease on date of termination.

Finally, congratulations on being offered a place on a Ryanair Boeing 737 -800 Training Course.

I, _______________, confirm that I have read, understand and accept the contents of this training contract.

Signed by: ________________ Date

Signed on behalf of Ryanair Limited:

Personnel Date

AreYouForReal

• Introduction
  • You will be sent this contract and be expected to have it signed and sent back before you even start the course with CAE or SAS.
  • Fixed term training contract means that for 6 months you are classed as 'training'.
  • The terms and conditions that are in this contract - No mention of the terms and conditions that are kept in an office that you agree to having never seen them, which states that they can allocate 12 of your annual leave days within your scheduled days off.....meaning instead of 28 days holiday, you infact only get 16!

• Poisition
  • 6 months from the day you are signed off on your circuits, you start on this contract.
• Term
  • Should a permanent position come available - This means that they can decide whether they are going to have a position open, you will be considered if your performance and suitablility has been satisfactory - meaning that however they feel, regardless of if you have finished everything in minimum sectors and been amazing, they can decide that you did not perform well enough.
• Licence
  • It states that you must gain an IAA licence within 6 months of joining ryanair, but infact this contract is not an employment contract, it is a training contract, so when they tell you at east mids you have to get an IAA licence, this is not the case. You are supposed to get one within 6 months of being offered a full time contract.
  • If you refuse to take an IAA licence within the first 6 months of employment, (bare in mind that even if this clause did apply to the training contract, this contract is only valid for 6 months), they can terminate your employment.
  • (According to Various lawers and solicitors i have spoken to, if they terminate your contract, you are not liable to pay a penny back to Ryanair (rules of a fixed term contract) - and this is even if the clause that is stated is leagal, as on the job training, which Line training is, is at the cost of the employer NOT the employee, and you should not be liable to repay this regardless. A type rating however is different, and as you have paid for this yourself, Ryanair can not as far as i am aware, make you pay this line training base training costs back).
• Line training
  • as stated above, it is at the cost of £90 per sector, (Brookfield is Euro 150 per sector)
  • Should you fail to accept and permanent position with Ryanair - For clarity and this is a very big one This means RYANAIR, NOT BROOKFIELDS! - They CAN NOT MAKE you taske a brookfields contract. They are and agency. This contract states it MUST be a Ryanair position. So many people have been caught out by this. Dont let the companies bully-boy tactics force you into something you dont want just because they have told you that "you are on a list of pilots going to dublin on a Brookfields contract". You are under no obligation to go.
• Term
  • It now says that the base check is completed with the aproved training provider, meaning that the cost of base check is included in your Type rating costs, so whey are you liable to pay ryanair for this. (I have not worked this one out yet, and neither has anyone i have spoken to, but when I know more about this clause i will get back to you)
  • This contract will terminate 6 months from base check. That means at 6 months 1 day you are no longer under this contract, and if at that point they offer you a contract, you are not required to take it, nor pay the costs.
  • They can extend it or offer you a permanent contract - This means that they can keep you on £850 per month indefinately - however, the rules regarding fixed term contracts state that this must be signed and agrees by both parties should it be extended. If you dont want to be on it longer then 6 months, you dont have to. And if they dont offer you a full contract at that point, you are off the hook.
  • This contract does not in any way guarantee you of a job - says exactly what it means.
  • Fail to fulfill terms of contract - As they spell out for you that you must be able to train for the full six months, thats what it means. HOWEVER, once your line training is complete, you are no longer training, therefore you can tell them that you are not going to fly - this is now a massive grey area, as you are no longer in the 'training' part of the contract, but you are still in the fixed term part, BUT because they specifically spell out that you must be available for training, and flying the line with a captain is most certainly not 'training', there is slight anbaguity. (if that is how it is spelt)
• Training hours and Base
  • It clearly states that your line training will take place anywhere, and you are liable to go anywhere during your line training. Once again, once line training is complete and you are signed off, you CAN stand up for yourself and not go anywhere because it clearly states LINE TRAINING!
• Training pay
  • You will be given £850 per month, or E1250 per month, depending on if you are in the Euro zone or the UK. Most of the training is done in Stansted.
    • At this point i want to tell you what is infact happening. When you turn up at interview, they will tell you that there are positions for FO across the network, and will take your choices for training and line bases. You will almost certainly NOT get either of these.
    • You will go where you are told on the training contract, (and unfortunately you have to go), but once you have finished, they WILL NOT offer you a full time contract. They will however tell you that you are going to dublin on an agency contract, and stay there for a few months, and then come back to your final chosen base. How they like to put it "you do this for us, we'll do that for you". The trueth is that they are sending people to dublin, leaving them there, and not taking them back onto Ryanair contracts, and refusing to let them change base on a brookfield contract.
    • As a Brookfield pilot you are paid into a Euro bank regardless of if you are british and based in the UK, you are paid a set hourly wage, (meaning the 0:45 and 0:30 before and after blocks on/off duty time, you are not paid), and you are classed as self employed, meaning you have to sort all your own accounts and expenses, and all your own tax out. For some this is good, but just be aware.
    • If you choose to not take the Brookfields contract, which you are entitled to do, they will try and bully you into taking it. Dont be affraid to stand up for yourself.
  • And now the actual pay. This is what most cadet pilots are doing and earning -
    • 30 day duty time = 130 - 145 hours
    • 30 day pay = £850(taxable) = £750 Take home
    • 30 Flying hours Average = 90 - 110
    • Actual hourly pay = £5.80 - £6.50
    • Actual hourly Take home = £ 5.20 - £5.70
  • Just to let you know, the average price of a room in a shared house around stansted is £20 - £25 per night or £300 - £400 for the month.
  • Parking is £16 per month for your car, and an ID pass will cost you another £50 odd. This is what Procius and Disclosure are for BAA airports, (which you have to pay for, and if they go out of date, you have to pay again for). Dont forget though that if you dont need to park your car, you dont need a stansted pass, and you can infact use your east mids pass at ANY ryanair airport as long as you have you licence and passport, almost meaning that Procius is an extra cost that is not required.
  • No other payments will be made durring this time - £750 take home is it guys, for 100 flying and 130 hours duty per month.
• Termination of contract
  • If the contract is terminated by Ryanair before the full 6 months is up, this is supposed to be agreed and signed by both parties. This is a rule of a fixed term contract. Should THEY terminate the contract early, once again, you should not be liable for the training repayment costs, (If indeed this clause is leagal).
• "Finally, congratulations on being offered a place on a Ryanair Boeing 737 -800 Training Course" - Reiterating the fact that you are training, not employed.

Guys and girls, I hope that you can take something away from this. Read this and print it off. Hopefully it wont get merged into the big Hate fest that is the main Ryanair thread because this is specifically a thread for cadets on contracts. Please only post questions, and opinions and factual information regarding this contract, and the Brookfields contract, (to come), in this thread.

Thanks for looking, and make an infomed decision as to if you really want Ryanair to continue bullying and taking what they want from cadets and not giving anything back. If you do choose to join Ryanair, make sure you have done the maths, looked at the EXACT wording of the contract, and join with your eyes open. Realise that for 6 months, you will be their play thing, and you will be bullied because they think you have no idea.

The main one, if you do join Ryanair, Join REPA straight away. It is anonymous, and a union and unity is the only way that things will change. Stand up for your rights!

jasperyellow

Thanks for posting this. I've looked on PPJN about the brookfields contract and it states that all Brookfield employees are based out of Dublin and are bonded for 5 years. How can they bond you when you pay for your own type rating?

High Wing Drifter

AreYouForReal,

Thank you very much for this. Very interesting, but not as scary as I imagined. All the stuff about rights to terminate and wot not is pretty standard stuff in most, albeit non-aviation, employment contracts I have seen.

However, the one area that worries me is how long between TR and base check and base check and line training. I assume base check will be withing a couple weeks after TR and that line training takes about 3 months, so effectively one would need to figure in about a three month gap (worst case)?

I agree with Jasper, the Brookfield thing is bloody confusing.

However one feels about Ryanair, at least it isn't as vague as the Bond or bonkers as the MyTravel line and TR training packages.

AreYouForReal

At the moment, there is around a 1-2 week gap between LST in the sim, and then coming to UK to do the Base check.
time between base and line training is as long as it takes you to get the rating onto your licence. So if you base check weds, get the rating thurs, and let Tom Keil know, then friday you will get a roster to start on the following monday.
It seems to be around 2 weeks between base check and line training.

Line training itself is taking about 2-3 months to complete. Upto 150 hours and 70 odd sectors seems to be the norm from what i hear.

AreYouForReal

Brookfields do not bond you. What you sign is a 5 year employment contract with them, with 3 months notice to leave. All the confusing bonds are if you leave to go to Ryanair, or if you get a command, or if you leave within your 3 months notice.
I will sort out a copy of the Brookfieilds contract to put on here.

Just one more thing that i need to update you guys on. At the moment Ryanair are telling line training complete cadets that there is no flying other then Dublin on Brookfields - I therefore am slightly confused why they are doing at least 300 type ratings through CAE alone this year. If there is no room for them, why are they recruiting.

They have been told that they either accept Dublin, or that was it, but will not commit to either terminating the training contract, or giving people a full time contract. All cadets who have gone through in the last few months who are not allowing Ryanair to bully them into taking an agency contract are in limbo as to what will happen.

Just be aware that you are parting with well earned £20K with no job, and a B737 rating that is not as employable as A320 rating which is the same price give or take.

kuchemann carrots

Sorry if this is a stupid question.
What happens after you have been checked to line after the approx 3 months, but you still have some time left on your training contract? And when do the sector payments start eg. the half sector pay etc?
Thanks KK

boogie-nicey

JUst a quick one ... Are you for Real you mentioned that a b737 TR isn't as employable as a A320 rating, how do you figure that?

AreYouForReal

Ok,
boogie-nicey - it is alot harder to get a job with a 737 rating in the UK if you have low hours. The reason being is because there are alot of Ryanair guys trying to get to those B73 jobs with more hours then you, should you leave after line training or infact Ryanair terminate your contract. That is what i ment by you are more employable with Airbus as a low hours guy, however B757 ratings are pretty hot property at the moment should you want Boeing.

kuchemann carrots - Not a stupid question at all. This is the limbo position that everyone is in as a post line trainned cadet. Your not entitled to any sector pay as stated in the contract. There is a romour floating about however that you do get 1/2 sector pay after line check pass.
With regards to the time left on contract after line check pass......who knows. They are saying Brookfields or nothing, but yet wont terminate the contract if you dont take Brookfields, (so far). Things could change.

Myster Mask

A question about start date:
Correct me if I'm wrong: the base training starts by a simulator where you learn to perform circuits around a runway, and the base check is 4 circuits on real aircraft. True?
And now my question:
in the contract, §1 "This is a 6 month fixed-term training contract with a commencement effective from the start date of Base Training.", meaning the contract starts the day of the simulator.
in the contract, §3 "Your training contract will commence upon successful completion of your base check", meaning the contract starts the day of the circuits on real aircraft.
=> finally, when does it start?
(excuse my poor english).
MM

skyflyer737

The contract starts from the day you successfully complete 6 circuits in the real aircraft. The sim session is just preparation for base training and not actually base training itself.

The sim session will take place at wherever you do your type rating, and the actual base training about 2 weeks after that, probably at East Midlands.

Enjoy the view

AreYouForReal

Thanks for all details. That is valuable information for all RYR cadets and/or wannabees!

It is hard from the other Ryanair threads to clear out the important stuff. It takes hours and hours to go through the 30+ pages on one of them.... without saying that a lot of it is outdated (threads merged) or totally confusing (moaning).

It is refreshing to read a thread that is giving facts about the airline and how/where/when the training scheme is happening, without hearing the usual "blame" story.

For most of the self funding cadets, what really matters is what happens AFTER the line training. 30K is a lot of money and one needs to know how the "Return on investment" will take place.

The training pay does not count really as this is good enough to pay the living expenses (not even). But in many other professions training is not paid either. This is bearable for a few months only.

So what counts is what's happening beyond the line check. Feedback anyone?

From what I understand, all cadets are now offered a Brookfield contract and not a Ryanair contract, which seems to make everyone rather unhappy.

But what's really wrong with the Brookfield contract? Apart from the fact that you're a contractor (self employed), is there something more that one needs to know?

Are you getting less money at the end of the day? Or is it because you're not "guaranteed" any flying hours?

Are all Brookfield contractors based in Dublin? It seems that another "version" of the Brookfield contract exists with no assigned base that keeps the pilot "floating around" between all bases?

If this is the case, what's the difference in terms of salary and roster?

Can some one compare with numbers what it really means in terms on "take home" salary between a Ryanair FO's permanent contract (if offered beyond the training contract) and a Brookfield contract?

Also a lot of Ryanair cadets come from Continental Europe, and the UK/Irish tax system is unclear. What really is the tax situation of, let's say an Italian pilot based in Dublin with a Brookfield contract, but with a permanent residency in Italy (going home off duty)? Does he have to pay taxes in Ireland or in Italy?

In short: any tax benefits of it?

Being self employed usually means that the salary is higher, but you need to pay your own pension, social security, etc... the differences can be huge from one country to another...

Can someone explain the advantages/disadvantages?

Any experience in that matter?

Thank you!

Fancy Navigator

Enjoy the View, you think that paying almost 30k for a Type Rating+associated expenses, then be paid £600 a month (with no sector pay) for at least two months during Line Training (look at PPJN) is acceptable?
If so, it is very sad....
Other companies pay you from day 1 full salary (or almost) and give you a good contract and stable roster/t&c's/way of life....

Why should you accept less?

Enjoy the view

Fancy Navigator
I would think it is acceptable if you get decent pay beyond line check. That is why I'm inquiring about the Brookfield contract.

Line training is.....training. Why not consider type rating, base training and line training as part of the studies, until you become fully qualified as a FO?

I'm sure the grass is greener with other companies, but do they offer you the opportunity to join them as a low hour cadet? Do you have any example?

A lot of low hour pilots (freshly qualified up to MCC level) invest almost the same amount in a type rating + base training, just to get 'typed' but without the job offer lined up at the end of it. Sometimes line training is extra but still without a job offer. Once the time is up (100+ hours or so); the training contract is over and it's time then to start applying again. (Look at bond solutions, twinnair, hubair, sfa, and others....)

I don't know what's better....at least RYR offers 'something' beyond line training.

Again, can someone explain the T&C's of the Brookfield contract?

BTW: I'm not debating the Ryanair system here, the hiring market makes the rules by itself. Take it or leave it really is up to anyone's decision.

alex111

hey guys any possibility of getting a copy of the brookfield contract on here? or even just the main points?
would be much appreciated...

cheers, alex.

FMSData

Here is a FAQ that I was sent whilst enquiring with Ryanair. Hope it helps.




Ryanair Cadets taking a Brookfield contract

The following should help to answer most of the questions you might ask about working on contract through our company at Ryanair.

Payments

From when will I start being paid?

You will receive payment for your services with effect from the start date which is agreed with Ryanair. This date will be communicated to you via crew.doc.

Who pays for my recurrent training?

The pilot has 4.5 euros per schedule block hour deducted from his salary payment as a contribution towards his bi-annual simulator training.

Does Brookfield deduct my tax?

Your contract clearly states “The pilot confirms his status as self employed/sole trader or engaged to the contractor through a limited company.”As with every self employed person you are obliged by law to submit a tax return and pay the relevant liability to the appropriate authority.




We strongly advise the pilot to use the services of a tax consultant in relation to the manner in which you meet your taxation liabilities. Whilst we are not in a position to recommend any particular company we are aware that a number of Brookfield pilots have successfully used the services of Bob Scanlon and Associates in Ireland. If you wish to use their services they can be contacted on [email protected].
For the avoidance of doubt Scanlon & Associates has no association with either Brookfield or Ryanair.

How much will I be paid?

Based

Captain – Euro 138.50 per schedule block hour

Cadets taking initial Brookfield contract
-Less than 500 JAR 25 hours – 60 Euro’s per scheduled block hour
-Greater than 500 but less than 1500 hours JAR25 – 80 Euro’s per scheduled block hour
-Greater than 1500 JAR25 hours – 75 Euro’s per scheduled block hour

Away from base allowance - 20 euros per scheduled block hour – only when flying out of base.

Non-based

Non based Captains 138.50 + 20 Euros per scheduled block hour

Non based First Officers / Cadets 60/80/85 (as applicable) +20Euros per scheduled block hour.

Instructors pay increments

If a pilot has an LTC or TRE qualification and is designated an LTC or TRE by the training department then the following rates shall apply per scheduled block hour for the duration of their appointment irrespective of if they are training or not:

RLTC - 4 euros per scheduled block hour
LTC - 12 euros per scheduled block hour
TRI - 6 euros per scheduled block hour
TRE - 12 euros per scheduled block hour


Simulator / Base training - 800 euros per training day

SFI First Officer - 450 euros per Sim session)


On what date will I receive my payment?

Payments are made to contract pilots between the 10th and 12th of every month, for duties performed in the preceding calendar month.




OPERATING FOR RYANAIR

When will I know when and where I will be based?

Your base will be allocated by Ryanair at the time of your official start date for your Brookfield contract. This will be according to where the current demand for pilots will be, however, your own preferences will be taken into consideration and ultimately most pilots get to operate from the base of their choice. You can submit a base transfer request via crew.doc.


What is the working pattern?

The standard working pattern for based contract pilots is 5 days on followed by 4 days off when operating from an assigned base. If you non-based, the pattern is generally, 5 on and 5 off. These patterns are not contractually guaranteed, but as a general rule this is the way the schedule works.


I understand that I receive an extra 20 euros per scheduled block hour for when I am working away from my base. How often is that likely to be?

This will vary depending on the time of the year and the general movement of pilots, acquisition of new aircraft and addition of new bases. However, about 80% on base / 20% away from base would be considered normal.


Is there a minimum guarantee of hours that I will be flying?

There is no minimum guarantee; however, generally speaking you can expect to fly up to 850 hours and to a maximum 900 hours per annum.

How many stand-by days do I need to be available for?

There should be no more than 4 stand-bys within a 28 day period.




Do I get staff travel?

You are able to travel on Ryanair free of charge for positioning or Ryanair business only, providing you are in uniform. It is not available for any other family members or for your own social purposes.


Command Upgrade

As a First Officer how many flying hours do I need in order to be considered for an upgrade to Captain?

You will need a minimum of 3000 hours total fixed-wing, a minimum of 1,500 hours B737 and also you will need to have been operating for Ryanair during one complete winter season.

Do I need to take Ryanair permanent employment in order to up-grade to Captain?

A Brookfield First Officer can take up a command position within Ryanair whilst remaining on a Brookfield contract; however he will be required to sign a command up-grade training bond (£5,000 sterling payable only if he departs within 2 years).

General

Do I have to pay a transfer fee if I change from Brookfield to Ryanair?

Pilots transferring to Ryanair permanent employment are required to pay a transfer fee to Brookfield Aviation of 2,500 euros, if Brookfield were involved in sourcing them initially.

How long is the notice period of the contract?

3 months either way.

How do I apply for leave?

Effective from that the 1st April 2008 onwards, you will only be required for eleven full calendar months by Ryanair. You will be able to submit a first, second and third choice for your full calendar month off, and a further 10 days can be requested on an individual basis through the Crewdoc system. I would like to clarify that this new system, whereby you nominate (subject to certain conditions) the full calendar month when you will be unavailable for work, will have no impact on your earning potential.





What about sick pay?

Sick pay is not applicable; however, there is a ‘compassionate payment scheme’ which allows for pilots to receive special payments in the event of personal trauma, bereavement, serious illness or injury. It must be clearly understood that this is not a sickness benefit scheme i.e. it does not apply to normal sickness such as flu, chest infections, ear infections etc.

Am I supplied with a uniform?

The pilot will only be permitted to fly if he/she is wearing a Ryanair uniform. It is the responsibility of the pilot to purchase and keep the uniform clean and in good condition.


How do I get my security clearances?

You will be responsible for providing references for obtaining your security/ID passes. You will have completed a five year reference check with a Reference Checking Agency during your type-rating course. Depending on which base you are allocated to you may be required to complete an additional five years check (for example Dublin). In this case you would need to contact the agency to extend your original reference checking.


What is the relationship between Brookfield Aviation and Ryanair?

Brookfield have been supplying contract pilots to Ryanair since 1994, and currently operates a large pilot pool. The pilot will be contracted to Brookfield; however, he will be entirely under the operational control of Ryanair. All issues relating to operational activities, basing, rosters, etc are between the pilot and Ryanair and issues of a commercial nature that affect the pilot are the responsibility of Brookfield Aviation.


How do I communicate with Ryanair with regard to receiving my schedule and relevant information?

All relevant information for Ryanair pilots is published on Crewdoc (www.crewdoc.com). You will have been given access to crew dock during your initial training and will have all the required documentation and information required to operate within the Ryanair network. Rosters are published every Friday and all communication between pilot and flight operations/flight crew scheduling is done via the Crewdoc system.

How do I communicate with Brookfield?

You can use the Crewdoc system to communicate with us. If you have a problem, log a query to Brookfield via Crewdoc.


Am I eligible for social benefits such as Health, Education and Welfare payments?

We at Brookfield engage your services on the understanding that all of the above are considered to be your responsibility and you make your own arrangements and pay for these services accordingly. We understand that many pilots wish to be accompanied by their spouse and family, however we engage only the pilot and take no responsibility for his/her dependants We do not support any applications for children’s schooling, treatment on the National Health Service (Medical or Dental) for the pilot or family.

wee one

What a f2ckin shambles.
i dont care how much you want to fly a jet this is bolox

flyboy1818

You would have to be guilty of clause 8 to sign that "contract"!

The Loan Arranger

"Are You For Real's" post is very informative and anyone considering applying for a type rating with this organisation should give the matter serious thought before applying.

Having been an experienced turboprop captain for several years with a UK domestic airline I foolishly left to follow a desire to fly a nice new shiny jet for a little more money.

The type rating went well, the base training went well and the line training went well. I met some really nice line training Captains who were helpful and excellent trainers.

I was unfortunately "chopped" on a base check by a rather unsavoury "trapper" who was known to be that way inclined. I never saw it coming and had no leg to stand on the way the contract was written.

Now I might be completely barking up the wrong tree and just unlucky on the day but the thought crossed my mind that during the very same month the position of a senior first officer for new entrants (to which I had been appointed) was abolished. Cadets are much much cheaper!

From experience on the type rating course I saw a number of people struggling and having to do extra training - at a cost of around £1500 per hour in the sim ( and we're not talking just the odd hour or so).

There were a noticeable number of names (crew Codes) that I knew on the training courses that I never saw make it on to any of the base rosters.

I do have reservations regaring the type rating courses being offered - I think that money is being made out of genuine wannabees.

Once on line I can honestly say flying the 737 was great fun - although the more hands on and short sector days on the turboprop were even better. You have to do it know!

Ryanair was an unhappy and oppresive place to work - nobody seemed happy there. There was a general feeling of big brother watching you and you had better not step out of line.

You felt very undervalued as an employee - I simply could not believe that they don't even give you a free cup of cofee or tea when flying a long 4 sector day - all you get is a plastic cup filled with hot water! You have to bring with you your own tea bags or coffee supplies!! ( you might get a sachet of milk if lucky).

I'am now back flying a regional turboprop again. I'am glad I did what I did - I worked the jet syndrome out of the system and can see now that the grass is definately not greener on the other side.

I am not having a gripe about Ryanair - I went into it eyes wide open and am a better pilot having experienced what I did.

I hope my words are of use to some of you contemplating applying for a type rating course.

I'am not saying don't do it - just be very careful what you are getting into and if there are other alternatives don't dismiss them in favour of the perceived dream job on a 737 -800!

as17

I have recently started training with FR, and this is what they have told us so far that may be of interest;

During your line training you start getting paid on the Brookfield contract, if you decide to take it, once you stop having a saftey pilot. This usualy is after about 10 sectors of line training. You start on 60euros / scheduled hour.

If, once you have completed your type rating, but not your base training, and you require additional training ryanair will cover the costs.

Also, the Brookfield contract works out at about £35k before tax for the first year or so, provided you do about 850 hrs per year.