The CTC Wings (Cadets) Thread - Part 2.
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There is no longer a surplus of people able (and wanting) to fund the training. It used to be the case that unsecured loans were available and employment prospects (with training bond being returned and a proper contract) were very good and hence competition very high. Nowadays neither of those points are true and thus there are less people walking through the door hoping to be 'selected' by CTC. Logically it follows that the standard required to get in has plummeted as CTC want to continue pumping out students to easyJet on their flexicrew contract in order to make money off of them.
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I don't know whether the 1,5% pass rate is still true or not, but I can assure you that it is still very difficult to be accepted. I had my selection day one month ago, and I saw brilliant people (engineers, people with PPLs, people with other degrees and a lot of experience...) going back home with a "thank you but you don't meet our standards".
This is, at least, for the Cadet Scheme. Of course some of them will be offered the ICP route, although that's a different thing
This is, at least, for the Cadet Scheme. Of course some of them will be offered the ICP route, although that's a different thing
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"This is, at least, for the Cadet Scheme. Of course some of them will be offered the ICP route, although that's a different thing 
"
ICP had just begun when I finished the course about 3 years ago.
I was never able to differentiate between the cadets and icp and the question was asked but never answered because there is no differentiation. We had guys on our course who were icp and they went through every stage in exactly the same way and ended up with easyJet. There is NO selection now, one way or another you will be offered a place. If you have the money you will get in.
Sad but true.
"ICP had just begun when I finished the course about 3 years ago.
I was never able to differentiate between the cadets and icp and the question was asked but never answered because there is no differentiation. We had guys on our course who were icp and they went through every stage in exactly the same way and ended up with easyJet. There is NO selection now, one way or another you will be offered a place. If you have the money you will get in.
Sad but true.
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As to the percentage of people that are selected I had my phase 2/3 combined assesment day a few months back.
The assessor said that large numbers of people send in the application form online but only around 20% of those that pass this first stage bother to then go on and pay the £190 and book an assessment day.
This is probably a large factor in the 2% pass rate figure people are suggesting, and its more likely that 2% (or more) of total online applicants go on to receive an offer for the "Wings" cadet course.
The assessor said that large numbers of people send in the application form online but only around 20% of those that pass this first stage bother to then go on and pay the £190 and book an assessment day.
This is probably a large factor in the 2% pass rate figure people are suggesting, and its more likely that 2% (or more) of total online applicants go on to receive an offer for the "Wings" cadet course.
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Hi can any previous wings cadets answer a few questions.
I believe that cadets and self sponsored iCP students study together on the same course. eg CP90 Is mixed.
What is the ratio between cadets and iCP? And how many cadets are there usually on a course?
Also anyone have any idea wether ctc will get any new contracts or renew with ej? Are they putting through more cadets that jobs at the end.
What's he out look for 2+ years?
Any more info would be beneficial.
Thanks
I believe that cadets and self sponsored iCP students study together on the same course. eg CP90 Is mixed.
What is the ratio between cadets and iCP? And how many cadets are there usually on a course?
Also anyone have any idea wether ctc will get any new contracts or renew with ej? Are they putting through more cadets that jobs at the end.
What's he out look for 2+ years?
Any more info would be beneficial.
Thanks
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Hello folks,
I've been reading around and I seem to be getting a general impression that most Wings cadets go into EJ. Would this be correct?
To further the previous question, am I correct in saying it is a three year contract with EJ, paid by the hour and then you are let go at the end?
I've been reading around and I seem to be getting a general impression that most Wings cadets go into EJ. Would this be correct?
To further the previous question, am I correct in saying it is a three year contract with EJ, paid by the hour and then you are let go at the end?
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No, you can be let go at any time, it is a zero hours contract, although as long as you mantain the standard you will get some hours.
However......
As many people have found ej have over recruited massive amounts of FO's over the last two years (something we were told they would not do) so the flexicrew guys who were getting 900 hours a year are now finding that these hours are dropping off considerably. Over the winter plenty of people were flying 10-20 hours a month. That works out to about £1000 gross with a standby thrown in. That's tough to live on. Yes, but you fly loads in the summer I hear you say, great, a possible 100 hours in the summer months works out at circa 4.5k gross a month for about 4 months. Enough to break even from the incremental debt you got into over the winter and then it's back into the lean winter season.
Basically throw in another 5k loan at least for additional living expenses in the first year of flying and forget about paying back any of the loan which will be rapidly growing through accumulated interest.
Although with expansion rapidly slowing down at ej I would have thought that the odds of getting into a job are increasingly slim.
I would wait to see what kind of deal the MPL guys get when they get on the line.
Seeing as how they can only work for ej I can't see them being on anything like the hourly rate currently 'enjoyed' by flexicrew pilots.
The risk/reward ratio skyrocketed towards risk over the last 2 years. Anyone who signs up for a course of flying training now without a very clear exit strategy if all goes belly up and who simply hopes that they will get a job is, in my humble opinion, crazy.
However......
As many people have found ej have over recruited massive amounts of FO's over the last two years (something we were told they would not do) so the flexicrew guys who were getting 900 hours a year are now finding that these hours are dropping off considerably. Over the winter plenty of people were flying 10-20 hours a month. That works out to about £1000 gross with a standby thrown in. That's tough to live on. Yes, but you fly loads in the summer I hear you say, great, a possible 100 hours in the summer months works out at circa 4.5k gross a month for about 4 months. Enough to break even from the incremental debt you got into over the winter and then it's back into the lean winter season.
Basically throw in another 5k loan at least for additional living expenses in the first year of flying and forget about paying back any of the loan which will be rapidly growing through accumulated interest.
Although with expansion rapidly slowing down at ej I would have thought that the odds of getting into a job are increasingly slim.
I would wait to see what kind of deal the MPL guys get when they get on the line.
Seeing as how they can only work for ej I can't see them being on anything like the hourly rate currently 'enjoyed' by flexicrew pilots.
The risk/reward ratio skyrocketed towards risk over the last 2 years. Anyone who signs up for a course of flying training now without a very clear exit strategy if all goes belly up and who simply hopes that they will get a job is, in my humble opinion, crazy.
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Accommodation
Hi, I'm due to start my course in October and was wondering if anyone could shed any light on the CTC accommodation in Southampton. They are very happy to show Clearways looking wonderful in NZ on the website but don't really mention what 'shared accommodation' will actually look like. Can anyone clarify for me or even post a pic?
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The shared accommodation is comprised of houses rented on the commercial market. The ones I have seen are typical four and five bedroom modern homes on estates in nearby towns. You will need your own transport to commute a few miles into Nursling. Often people will share lifts with someone who has their own transport.
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Razor27, thanks for the info. I agree with you, it would be hard to get a Job and I also think it would be difficult to financially survive even if you did!
Would anyone know if EJ still offer permanent contracts when you get enough experience? Whether it is for a base abroad or in the UK doesn't really matter to me.
Would anyone know if EJ still offer permanent contracts when you get enough experience? Whether it is for a base abroad or in the UK doesn't really matter to me.
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Myles,
Yes, people are constantly heading off to Milan and Paris at the moment, not so much the other European bases. However, this is because so many new captains are coming from these bases and heading to LGW. Again, the number of command courses will rapidly slow down in the next couple of years which will slow down the recruitment and therefore movement to European bases.
If you are lucky enough to get into easy after finishing your training then plan on being on flexicrew for at least 2 years on much lower terms than currently exist. I'm pretty sure by then the management will have come up with ingenious ways of lowering terms in the European bases too so moving to them on a permanent contract will become less attractive.
My last point is that since starting flying training the terms and conditions have dropped at a jaw dropping rate. I am constantly amazed at how low the conditions have become.
Believe me, it becomes very tiresome losing 15% of your monthly pay when a nice long 4 sector day gets replaced with an AMS. It is impossible to plan because your monthly pay will vary so much even after your roster is published because of all the changes.
Sounds negative? Yep, this is the reality....
Yes, people are constantly heading off to Milan and Paris at the moment, not so much the other European bases. However, this is because so many new captains are coming from these bases and heading to LGW. Again, the number of command courses will rapidly slow down in the next couple of years which will slow down the recruitment and therefore movement to European bases.
If you are lucky enough to get into easy after finishing your training then plan on being on flexicrew for at least 2 years on much lower terms than currently exist. I'm pretty sure by then the management will have come up with ingenious ways of lowering terms in the European bases too so moving to them on a permanent contract will become less attractive.
My last point is that since starting flying training the terms and conditions have dropped at a jaw dropping rate. I am constantly amazed at how low the conditions have become.
Believe me, it becomes very tiresome losing 15% of your monthly pay when a nice long 4 sector day gets replaced with an AMS. It is impossible to plan because your monthly pay will vary so much even after your roster is published because of all the changes.
Sounds negative? Yep, this is the reality....
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razor27
Thanks for the info! Is any of the roster fixed for instance the the first week? At what point are you offered a perm contract on the continent i.e is it straight after line training? Also what are the hoops to jump through to get one?
Sorry for all the questions, just trying to research as much as I can
Cheers!
Sorry for all the questions, just trying to research as much as I can
Cheers!
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At what point? There is no point. You have to APPLY - go through a whole NEW interview process and group exercises even if you have flown for eJ for 3 or more years. These aren't hoops either. People fail at this stage and remain a flexicrew pilot. None of the roster is fixed.
Please also be aware that the future is not permanent contracts at easyJet. eJ don't want it, CTC/OAA don't want it because they get a cut from your flexicrew salary. eJ is becoming Ryanair - expect to pay for everything and get nothing. Expect in 3 years to have contract Captains, no permanent FO's and further degradations to working conditions.
Please also be aware that the future is not permanent contracts at easyJet. eJ don't want it, CTC/OAA don't want it because they get a cut from your flexicrew salary. eJ is becoming Ryanair - expect to pay for everything and get nothing. Expect in 3 years to have contract Captains, no permanent FO's and further degradations to working conditions.
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average punter
HPBleed is spot on.
There really is no future for permanent positions at easyJet.
The callousness of the communications we get from management are truly amazing.
It is very clear to anyone with an ounce of foresight that the future at easy is contract Captains. Frankly the only thing holding the t's & c's of pilots in Europe together are the European unions. Balpa have openly admitted that they are not interested in pursuing the rights of flexicrew pilots so the rot has set and will only get worse.
HPBleed is spot on.
There really is no future for permanent positions at easyJet.
The callousness of the communications we get from management are truly amazing.
It is very clear to anyone with an ounce of foresight that the future at easy is contract Captains. Frankly the only thing holding the t's & c's of pilots in Europe together are the European unions. Balpa have openly admitted that they are not interested in pursuing the rights of flexicrew pilots so the rot has set and will only get worse.