Excel Airways (Oxford Aviation Training) Programme - 2006
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Originally Posted by Flies-like-a-chicken
Presumably it costs around £200 for the second stage of assessment like the Oxford Thomas Cook scheme...
Spoke to a few Thomas Cook Captains when their scheme was advertised and they didn't even know such thing existed, which shows you how important it is. I'll speak to Excel pilots too, and I'm sure I'll get the same answers (even worse , as most of them are Canadians based here just for the summer).
I wonder how long will those "sponsorships" (with 100% financial burden on the cadets and zero guarantees from the Airlines) go on before someone points them out to the Trading Standards !
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I love it how OAT again demand a maths A-level for one of their "sponsorship" schemes yet further down the page state:
"A recent survey into airline recruitment concluded that one of the most important attributes required of an airline pilot is team-working skills"
and not a maths a-level! so when will OAT stop barring perfectly good and possibly better candidates from applying simply because they don't have one
exam 
"A recent survey into airline recruitment concluded that one of the most important attributes required of an airline pilot is team-working skills"
and not a maths a-level! so when will OAT stop barring perfectly good and possibly better candidates from applying simply because they don't have one
exam
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flyingmutant - Unfortunately, due to the massive numbers of applications that would undoubtedly be received if such a requirement were to be dispersed with, I believe it serves a filtering purpose as opposed to it being in place for 'security' reasons, especially seeing as the student bears the brunt of the cost, not the airline.
I am in agreement, however - I have an 'acquaintance' who is necked up to the eyeballs with qualifications... trust him with many simple, practical tasks, however, and he is useless and lacks a standard of common sense that would be normally expected of any individual, let alone a prospective airline pilot.
Most annoying, but something I am sure we are going to have to live with, at least for the foreseeable future I'm afraid.
Cheers, Jack.
I am in agreement, however - I have an 'acquaintance' who is necked up to the eyeballs with qualifications... trust him with many simple, practical tasks, however, and he is useless and lacks a standard of common sense that would be normally expected of any individual, let alone a prospective airline pilot.
Most annoying, but something I am sure we are going to have to live with, at least for the foreseeable future I'm afraid.
Cheers, Jack.
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Originally Posted by femaleWannabe
Starting salary of £18k... tell me they're joking?! Ok so they pay you the training costs, but these have already been more than deducted from your wages at that rate!
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Glad to see more and more people now realising what integrated courses really are - major $pondulikas for the FTO's and nothing more. The airlines gain because they have debt ridden young employees who would think twice about leaving. If more of us went down the modular way, aiming to do everything as cheap as possible or to the degree that suited us best, we would be doing ourselves a favour and bettering our own job prospects.
I received this unsolicited email too. And you know what the ironic thing is, I'm probably not even eligible because I applied last year.
I received this unsolicited email too. And you know what the ironic thing is, I'm probably not even eligible because I applied last year.
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18k a year is sh te no matter how you dress it up, i earn not far off double that wiring councill houses in wigan and putting in alarms for little old ladies but i'm still going for it.
Why i hear you ask?? cos its possibly the best chance of getting a job we'll come across ,barr ctc , and in years to come we'll laugh about worrying bout the money cos we'll all be soo rich.
Will i regret it even if i'm 60k out of pocket????
Not if in 5 years time i'm cruising over the med in a white shirt instead of being covered in plaster and flea bites from a crack den in the slums of lancashire ,ripping up floorboards!
Those who want this job bad enough will bite the bullet and admit were being shafted but you've gotta live the dream
te no matter how you dress it up, i earn not far off double that wiring councill houses in wigan and putting in alarms for little old ladies but i'm still going for it.Why i hear you ask?? cos its possibly the best chance of getting a job we'll come across ,barr ctc , and in years to come we'll laugh about worrying bout the money cos we'll all be soo rich.
Will i regret it even if i'm 60k out of pocket????
Not if in 5 years time i'm cruising over the med in a white shirt instead of being covered in plaster and flea bites from a crack den in the slums of lancashire ,ripping up floorboards!
Those who want this job bad enough will bite the bullet and admit were being shafted but you've gotta live the dream
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Pprune has always been full of bull**it, but this thread really does go that bit further..
What, exactly, does that show? I'm sure if you asked those same captians the number of people they recruited, and from where, last year, or this year to date, they probably wouldn't have an answer either.
Have you ever considered the fact that it is actually the airlines themselves that set the requirement for these schemes! As with most sponsorship schemes, the requirements are bound to be more restrictive.
No, they aren't joking. Through this scheme, you will also be paying off a £60k loan (interest rate 6.5%), tax-free, in 5 years. Do the Maths!
Spoke to a few Thomas Cook Captains when their scheme was advertised and they didn't even know such thing existed, which shows you how important it is.
I love it how OAT again demand a maths A-level for one of their "sponsorship" schemes
Starting salary of £18k... tell me they're joking?!
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superpilot: Bitterness seems to be the order of the day from you, who applied and clearly didnt make it. Where are you now? hmm... probably not in a 737/757 It would seem.
The market has changed, grow up and face it. One has to indeed bite the bullet, as the 'good old fashioned way' no longer cuts it for the majority anymore. I know of airlines who no longer consider fATPLs from modular training. Fact. I also publicly heard Willie Walsh explain that integrated students are preferred. In a market where employers can afford to be so picky, its an understandable point.
Financially, it is stated that starting salary is 18k with the same again tax free... My maths isnt the best, but that is 36k a year. Not unreasonable for any low hrs FO. BA give 28k.... but then they do pay the TR. Oh wait, so do Excel on this scheme! Coupled with the fact that 18k is tax free... that is surely one of the highest take home pays going, the tax saving alone must be pushing 35k over 5 years (lets not forget the 18k or so for the TR which is provided). This could mean a saving over time of over 50k. Surely this is a much better position than the modular guy whos spent 30k and is still struggling to seek employment. Also bear in mind that the loan is still over 11 years (excel have just set payments so they can be covered in 5), so after a few years, having paid the loan minimum (probably around 600 a month) - if you would be better off joining Cathay or one of the other 'big boys', go for it.
Nobodys making you take a 60k loan, if this is too much of a risk in your eyes, then dont do it. Go in knowing what level of debt you'll be getting yourself into, if you don't like the sound of it, then dont take it. Equally, if successful, you'll understand that you're probably in the best position in the business to deal with such a loan.
I met someone off a previous OAT/Excel scheme which was nigh on identical to this who is now in his RHS, and from what I can gather (and indeed what he said) he is leaps and bounds better off than his 'ordinary' FO colleagues.
Of course like the TCX scheme and indeed the Tfly one at FTE, there is no absolute guarantee that there is a job at the end, after all it is a cylcical and volatile industry we are part of (or want to be part of in this case). However, should no vacancies be available post-training, then rest assured those would-be excel pilots are about as high calibre as any other low hours jobseekers out there, and would no doubt have little difficulty getting into some other company's RHS thereafter. I would also assume that OAT would recognise this also, when forwarding names to airlines.
If you want it, this is as good a chance as you can get, and in my opinion (bearing in mind the calibre of those it involves) equally as good as CTC.
The market has changed, grow up and face it. One has to indeed bite the bullet, as the 'good old fashioned way' no longer cuts it for the majority anymore. I know of airlines who no longer consider fATPLs from modular training. Fact. I also publicly heard Willie Walsh explain that integrated students are preferred. In a market where employers can afford to be so picky, its an understandable point.
Financially, it is stated that starting salary is 18k with the same again tax free... My maths isnt the best, but that is 36k a year. Not unreasonable for any low hrs FO. BA give 28k.... but then they do pay the TR. Oh wait, so do Excel on this scheme! Coupled with the fact that 18k is tax free... that is surely one of the highest take home pays going, the tax saving alone must be pushing 35k over 5 years (lets not forget the 18k or so for the TR which is provided). This could mean a saving over time of over 50k. Surely this is a much better position than the modular guy whos spent 30k and is still struggling to seek employment. Also bear in mind that the loan is still over 11 years (excel have just set payments so they can be covered in 5), so after a few years, having paid the loan minimum (probably around 600 a month) - if you would be better off joining Cathay or one of the other 'big boys', go for it.
Nobodys making you take a 60k loan, if this is too much of a risk in your eyes, then dont do it. Go in knowing what level of debt you'll be getting yourself into, if you don't like the sound of it, then dont take it. Equally, if successful, you'll understand that you're probably in the best position in the business to deal with such a loan.
I met someone off a previous OAT/Excel scheme which was nigh on identical to this who is now in his RHS, and from what I can gather (and indeed what he said) he is leaps and bounds better off than his 'ordinary' FO colleagues.
Of course like the TCX scheme and indeed the Tfly one at FTE, there is no absolute guarantee that there is a job at the end, after all it is a cylcical and volatile industry we are part of (or want to be part of in this case). However, should no vacancies be available post-training, then rest assured those would-be excel pilots are about as high calibre as any other low hours jobseekers out there, and would no doubt have little difficulty getting into some other company's RHS thereafter. I would also assume that OAT would recognise this also, when forwarding names to airlines.
If you want it, this is as good a chance as you can get, and in my opinion (bearing in mind the calibre of those it involves) equally as good as CTC.
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Originally Posted by harrier007
sicky,
i to am getting an error page, have you had any luck?
i to am getting an error page, have you had any luck?
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Hey guys, does anyone know whether I can apply for the OAT integrated Atpl course without doing bloody maths at A Level or Uni!? Of course I passed at GCSE, but as they are not taking calls or even emails (which is very annoying) I was wondering if anyone is in the same predicament as me?
Although it says you need it in the 'requirements' section, I've had testing days with similar things in the past that said the same thing but still allowed me to give it a go non-the-less. - Anyone with any info? or are they that strict on that one? Cheers!
Although it says you need it in the 'requirements' section, I've had testing days with similar things in the past that said the same thing but still allowed me to give it a go non-the-less. - Anyone with any info? or are they that strict on that one? Cheers!
Originally Posted by raviolis
I wonder how long will those "sponsorships" (with 100% financial burden on the cadets and zero guarantees from the Airlines) go on before someone points them out to the Trading Standards !
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Quote sagaris: I met someone off a previous OAT/Excel scheme which was nigh on identical to this who is now in his RHS, and from what I can gather (and indeed what he said) he is leaps and bounds better off than his 'ordinary' FO colleagues.
Complete twaddle. You think he's better off (financially I presume) because he says so.
Quote: One has to indeed bite the bullet
Why? There are other ways to get to the RHS. Ts & Cs will continually become more eroded, especially for new recruits, if people indeed bite the bullet.
Quote: I know of airlines who no longer consider fATPLs from modular training
Yes, British Airways don't take low-hour pilots who have modular training.
CTC is still less expensive than OAT, and has better graduate placement.
Complete twaddle. You think he's better off (financially I presume) because he says so.
Quote: One has to indeed bite the bullet
Why? There are other ways to get to the RHS. Ts & Cs will continually become more eroded, especially for new recruits, if people indeed bite the bullet.
Quote: I know of airlines who no longer consider fATPLs from modular training
Yes, British Airways don't take low-hour pilots who have modular training.
CTC is still less expensive than OAT, and has better graduate placement.
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Originally Posted by captwannabe
Quote: I know of airlines who no longer consider fATPLs from modular training
Yes, British Airways don't take low-hour pilots who have modular training.
Scroggs