For anyone applying: be careful what you wish for!

Morale is at an all time low and there are almost no benefits to a 747 type rating. Lots of people weighing options in the Middle East, so perhaps better avoid the unfolding nightmare in LUX altogether, and apply straight away with the ME3! The ME3 will kill CLX any way, so why waste time on a useless type rating, doing duties that will ruin your health?

A little bird told me that at the moment there is a lot of infighting going on within our beloved training department, as there is a scramble to stab each other in the back in order to jump the seniority list for captain positions.

Advice for anyone ignoring the warnings here: be very wary of anyone in the training department. Almost 90% of the people there are only working there in order to stab everybody else in the back; comfortable schedules (custom made by their little friend KL in crew planning), very little jetlag, a cozzzzzy 9-17 office job to recover from all the "hard" work, and the usual brownnosing with management. Training department = company spies, selling their souls for a few goodies. The rest of us can do the real work with endless roster disruptions and roster changes, fly round the world trips, ruin our health and social lives, and enjoy LUX layovers in the NH. :mad:

The big irony however is that this mentality is coming back to all the backstabbers in the training department like a boomerang, as not all wishes for quick upgrades can be granted as this would collapse the entire training department. Hence all the backstabbing among each other. :p

Last one out, please turn off the lights!

Hi little Maurice,

Are you really working for CLX? Where is this opinion based on? I am working in the training department for Cargolux and I can tell you that most of us, First Officers, working in the training department we don't want to jump the seniority list for a quick upgrade, no backstabbing here. Also as maybe you know, the months from October until X-Mas are the busiest months in our business, so least training as possible done during that time and most trainers fly the same as a regular pilot.

Besides all this we do a lot of extra work in our free time, like preparing courses etc... why? Because we love to train people. I love my work as TKI! It's a lot of work but I enjoy it!

Greetings,

A very happy Cargolux pilot.

Echie & Ray Cosmic Little Maurice is spot on and you are the backstabbers he is talking about :ugh::mad:

Although I have to agree not everything is bright those days in our lovely
little outfit and there is room for improvement in nearly every department,
presenting accusations like these if you are really a part of cv is bloody stupid since there is no known case of anybody jumping the seniority list for at least
16 years. BTW that's what a seniority list is for in the first place. So should you have proof of what you're stating, please take action and don't whine around on a public forum like an 10 year old! Or join your beloved ME3 airlines, where everything is working out so brilliantly when it comes to crews.
And I'm not and never was in the training department!

What I am curious about, and would like to ask ECHIE now I read his comment. If CLX is so in need of FO's, and I talked to a few captains from CLX and shared this same story.

So multiple FO's and CPT told me CLX is in dire need of experienced rated and ntr FO's (this is last summer). So I applied to CLX. Within 3 days I get a reply that I match all requirements but the management prefers people with a higher education than I have (Dutch general higher secundary education, they prefered direct university entry high school level. Even though I was at that time senior FO on a regional jet with almost 3k hours on type). When I met more CLX crews there were very surprised how this was possible. Could you shed some light ECHIE?

Same thing happened to a buddy of mine, which makes me think that there may be such a pattern, sadly.

Hurdle,

Personally I think you should have gotten a shot with your experience.
But it's not a secret that you need a university entrance degree. It it's clearly stated on the website. We can agree or disagree about that requirement, but that's a other discussion.

@Hurdle, indeed as said above by Hank Moody, Cargolux has as requirement university entry level, equivalent to Atheneum or Gymnasium in the Netherlands. My excuses and maybe one day this will change.

Hi guys,

thanks for the reply, it is highly appreciated. Shame its like this, but it is as it is in this case. Better luck next time.

New info
 

Hi all,
I passed the MollyMawk and have been invited to the interview,
To any of the Cargolux guys and gals, is there any insider expansion or news that I could use at the interview to impress?

Or any other advice would be appreciated

Thanks in advance

AS

Who do you want to impress with your desire to work under the new CV T&Cs?

Flying longhaul you should ask yourself if it would be a pleasant experience for me to sit together with you in a cockpit for 11 hours.

Anyway, good luck to you! ;-)

Final06 is right, it's not pleasant to sit next to him for 11 hours.
You would be far better off sitting next to me ;)
Regarding the new T&C, a deterioration compared to the ones we have but an improvement for a lot of people coming from short-haul.
Don't compare them with ours but just accept them or stay where you are.
Besides, it's not just about money right?

Haha
 

Yes I can see that ^^

True the T&Cs have changed but haven't been given it directly so will make the judgement call when it comes. But would most likely be better than what I have now anyway,
I've been a contractor all my flying career unable to land a permanent contract, plus my wife works in lux so being based here would not only be a jump to the jumbo, but an opportunity to settle down too.
So let's see, I hope I'm Cargolux caliber and to see you all soon
👍

Aeroskizzle,
although I do not like the change of contract, there are numerous of
the new guys in a better spirit than some before and it's always what
you make of it for yourself.
As for the interview, be yourself, it's not rocket scientists that they are
looking for. You don't even have to sneak around the moving close to LUX
part since your wife is already working there!!!

It seems that as of yesterday, CLX is also accepting "school of higher general secundary education" as opposed to pre-University education. This has been sent by interpersonal to candidates who were not accepted to proceed earlier.

Good morning¡
Does anyone knows how long it takes for an answer (to proceed to the first step) since I applied?
Thnaks

Can anyone advice how long does it take to well prepare mollymawk test having a reasonable time to study?is about 20 days enough?
Thanks for your reply
H

For me, I had my application on file previously. And when the new requirements came, I up dated my info, and got a call about 3 weeks after.

MollyMawk was quite tough, 20 days should be fine. I had 2 weeks and it was enough for me.

Thanks for your the info Aeroshizzle!

Aeroshizzle,thanks for your reply

Recent article. People are hired and then just no-show training ?:

"Aircargoeye.com has learned that some potential first officers – scheduled to undertake the airline’s training ahead of being employed – simply failed to turn up for the course."

https://aircargoeye.com/cargolux-fly...lots-shortage/

Correct.

The article is spot on.

Just had GS-day and there were only 2 new F/Os scheduled for a type rating course A.
Normally it is 6.

The news has spread around that CLX management does not show ANY respect towards their pilots.

Why should someone sacrifice his entire private life, flying around the world in the shortest legally possible time, illegal back-to-back rostering, just fly, sleep, eat, sometimes not even having time for the gym, for 3000 € per month?

Why should someone fly longhaul for CLX without a chance to see the world anymore?

:ugh::ugh::ugh:

"Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and it never will. Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have found out the exact measure of injustice and wrong which will be imposed upon them, and these will continue till they are resisted with either words or blows, or with both. The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress."


Frederick Douglass

Douglass was addressing grander issues than the travails of airline pilots but the principle is exactly the same: if you'll agree to take a beating, all you can reasonably expect is further beatings. And you'll surely get them.

Just had the long IAH layover twice in the last 2 months, once with new guys who wanted to see the world and it was a blast and once with older guys who didn't show up once because they stayed in LUX time.
Don't try to fight a war against people which are joining now about the fight you have lost against management. The reasons for joining CV might be different from when you did it and certainly it's not these persons fault what conditions are there now but rather ours.!
since we desperately need new colleagues I'd appreciate any motivated new hire over an overly frustrated old one which still doesn't have the gut to leave a situation he sees as unbearable, which doesn't mean I do support it, but it's the status quo we have to fight and it doesn't help to sit there and quote you did it all right and every body else does it wrong.
In the history of CV there have been numerous different contracts which where always leveled at one point. Was it only mr you which joined at the right point and were you always in the front line fighting for it???
I'd like to see that you are one of the guys which actively fight in the union, otherwise, what are you complaining about?
I will surely not join you in the bashing of young colleagues which do join for a reason that you can't judge.
Again this is not to support what is going on in the company, but to blame it to the new hires which do take an opportunity, is the wrong approach.
It is the current situation we do have to fight for all our well being, not the new members which are certainly not responsible for it.
Frustration will not bring you any further my friend, it might just impact your professional judgement.

And sorry to pick on your nick,
final 06 always was, and will be a pain in the a.. until they finally level the hill!
As much as I enjoy it with 10.000+ hrs there for a change!!!

@16down

Nice that seniority and companymindedness works for your.

However the forum is eager to hear your explanation why selected candidates don't show up for the type rating with no notice at all.

And why entry requirements are ridiculously low in these days.

And why the B-scalers tend to dine out in cheap hamburger eateries.

@16down, you're spot on. I totally agree. Some older colleagues lost complete reality.

@final06, there's always time to workout when you're on the road. Total nonsense. It's all about priorities.

A happy and fit pilot.

I've just received the fourth or fifth email asking me to chose a selection date for this psychometric testing in LUX.
So let me get this right, they want me to travel over there on my days OFF to take their mollymack whatever, to then have a shot at the interviews later on?
I wonder why people are not showing up for ground course!

Is it the first time you applied for any flying job? I asked for annual leave to do the entire process.
I want to fly for CargoLux, so isn't it fair that I have to go to their headquarters and meet them? The whole aviation recruitment world is to jump through hoops. BA, Easyjet, lufthansa, Norwegian . online tests/selection day, group assessment, interview, sim. Cargolux is no different.

Does that include the interviews or did you have to come back for them on a later date?

Needed a total of 4 days
I came 1 day for the MollyMawk. Then once passed they gave me about 7 options to come again . for a block of 3 days.
Group assessment, interview, sim. Once passed, we have to do medical, which I did after the sim, with company doctor.
After the all clear, they gave me 3 start dates and to work around my notice period.

Smooth recruitment, helpful and accommodating

Aeroshizzle....just out of curiosity, what is your aviation history, in terms of age, rating and hours ?

good evening,

apllied a few weeks ago, and got an invitation. Actually I am not desperate, but would be more than happy to move closer home. I would greatly appreciate any infos concerning roster (days off), also as pm.

Thanks, happy landings.

Some call it "race to the bottom".


For all new joiners (who are most welcome and desperately needed by the way :)) a little extract from our 2015-2018 Collective Work Agreement:

1.3.
The Parties recognize that the Company is operating in a cyclical and seasonal industry and that its results have recently been affected by an increasing difficult competitive environment as well as decreasing yields. Additionally, during the CWA period, the Company will face significant financial obligations related to committed investments necessary for the future development of the Company (such as the acquisition of new aircraft). If circumstances should warrant, the Parties agree to negotiate in good faith in view of adapting the CWA provisions to the change in circumstances. Any such review could include the working conditions and remuneration package foreseen hereafter.


May be you are also interested to know that CLX has some massive financial obligations (not only) regarding CV China coming up.

How about a scenario where Cargolux cannot pay in cash, but will transfer some aircraft to CV China?

The implication would be redundancies in LUX who will get laid off in a social plan, however will be offered a job in China next day.
Conditions "slightly" worse :}

final06
You seem to be one of those people who just love to listen to themselves.
Otherwise you would have read my comment instead of dropping as stupid a comment. Seniority and pink glasses don't work, because my schedule is as f...ed up as yours and if you had any adult insight you'd have recognized that in the first place.
I'm totally on you when it comes to why people turn down the opportunity but I'm fighting you on bashing young colleagues who do it. It's not their fault, rather ours, but you will probably never be in a position to understand that because you're to sorry about yourself while you are selling all your off days.
Sleep well and I do hope you will always find somebody responsible but yourself for your misery.
All the best....

@aeroshizzle...

Nothing personal...but wasn't the entry requirement 3000 hours..??

hello guys,

any chance to get a small insight into roster (off days) at cargolux.

highly appreciated

Well...I'm just one of the guys having to guide you and others with very limited experience around the world....

Hi

Could someone please tell me the approximate total take home pay for a new FO (salary plus flight pay/per Diems etc).

About the same I'm paying my cleaning lady !