B747 Classic....getting recurrent?
 

Hi,

Any ideas on how and where to get recurrent in the 747 Classic?? How much do you think it costs?

Thanks

I heard tell United still has their classic sim in Denver. No idea on the cost.

The Evergreen guys lay claim to the old classic sim in Denver. Might have to go thru Evergreen to use it. One of the classic sims Atlas has in MIA is leased thru Pan Am. Might be an option there.

Aero Services in Miami also has a Classic sim.

call Pan Am International in Denver they will quote you a price.

CX has a classic sim, however don't do training on it, it's used for new pilot applicants. GECAS lease space in the same building for sim training, they may be able to lease it from CX.

EAAC training at Bournemouth I think still runs the old BA classic 200 sim, might be worth a try lookIng them up.

B747
 

Mineapolis Pan Am sim in Eagan, should be around $3-5K depending on the seat. Get on Pan Am website, I saw it there. Pan Am in MSP is desperate for people, might lower the price.

Great information. I really appreciate the details given! I will call all the places.

Aero Services in Miami...The rate is probably around $300 to $400 per hour for the box, then you add crew and instructor.

Talk to Air Atlanta Icelandic! You might even get a job...

I think maybe Uni Top have asked Uncle Wiggily if he is prepared to do his own recurrency. Got an email from them today as well asking the same.

Not sure where your from but it has to be either FAA approved or EASA/JAA, depending on your airmans cert.

The bournemouth one is great, there is one at Burgess Hill not too far from Gatwick that AAI have used and are using again shortly and one at Lufthansa in Frankfurt which apparently is a decent sim as well. Hope this helps.

ishe:

I did speak with the man mentioned in the other Uni-Top thread. I told them I wasn't current in several emails and they asked me if I would get current. I researched it and found out the cost would be around 5000 dollars. Not including hotel and transportation costs. So then, I get the call from Uni-Top and ultimately a combination of the threads on this forum and the actual conservation with the Chief Pilot...didn't give me that warm fuzzy feeling. Trying to get certain details from them was like pulling teeth. I can only imagine what communication is like once they got you stranded in Wuhan. 40 on/20 off. Sounds OK, but we all know they will probably not honor this. It would probably be an epic battle every time you try and organize your travel to and from your days ON.

In addition, say I get current on the 747 classic and then fail the infamous Chinese medical for some bull**** reason...great, I am current in an aircraft that not many people operate anymore.

In my opinion, if they need people then they can pay to get me current.

Very wise words, Wiggly!

I, too, am no longer current on type and there is NO way I would pay for a recurrent unless I was GUARANTEED a job, in writing, plus the terms & conditions as outlined in the original ad - incl. time on/off plus travel in their time, not your days off!!!:=

These so-called "wonderful" opportunities are all one-sided and as you say, if you flunk the Chinese astronaut physical, then you are screwed both financially and job-wise with a TOTALLY useless piece of paper.

I would hang tight if I were you.

Wait a month or two when they are desperate for crews and then you'll see the ****NEW & IMPROVED FLAVOR** ads come out with much better terms ...................seen it a dime a dozen with agency ads every week and on flightglobal.com It always means one thing - they had to improve the package considerably because no one was applying and taking the bait.

Besides, even if you got current, you will still have to go through their own course of indoc, SOPs, bits and bobs just like you do with every new airline you work for. This is only a means for them to save a bit of cash if enough people bite. Wait it out or choose an operator that values its crews with what they have brought to the table.

Also, ask yourself, why are they still operating a 747 classic freighter when most of their competition is now using 777, -400, 747-8 aircraft now. A lot can be told about a company before you even step on their soil.

Good luck on whatever you decide.

VP

Alexb757: Thanks. Yes, I think we are on the same wavelength concerning this matter. They told me that the Chinese CAA would not allow a non-current pilot to take the written exam, sim evaluation and medical exam. Fine, they can have their little weird rules if they wish. But, for me to get recurrent without a 100 percent guarantee of employment is poor decision making at the extreme. If the Chinese airline wants 747 Classic pilots (a vanishing breed), then they have to accomodate the reality of the situation in my opinion. Yes, you are also correct in having to ask the question of why are they still flying a jet that was put together in the early 1970s? Best of luck to them, but they have to understand that Chinese carriers are quickly gaining a non-favourable reputation in terms of contracts and wishy/washy communication with its contractors.

Classic 747's are still turning a tidy profit and doing a whirlwind business globally. Why are they still operating the 747? It's a good platform for international freight. That's why.

Vanishing breed? Hardly.

Why fly something that was built in the 70's? A LOT of aircraft are in service around the world of the same vintage. Some considerably older.

Just recently I've been ferrying older airplanes out of storage, to be put back in service. One of the types that's been put back in service by a major flag carrier are a fleet of DC-9's. The airline which bought them flies a number of more modern aircraft, but just bought a mothballed fleet of DC-9's. Simply because an airplane is a few years old doesn't mean it's not economically viable.

Sns3Guppy: I used to fly the Classic. I like the Classic. All I am saying is that if you look at the numbers and statistics of airlines operating newer equipment vs. those pulling out DC-9s and Classics from the boneyard (even including Kalitta buying some from Del Smith down in Marana), that a pilot has a far greater chance of employment if they are Typed in the B744 or something more modern than the Classic. I realize that Classic guys want to defend their aircraft...and hey it's a great airplane, but being current in the Classic vs the 744....chances of picking up employment are a hell of a lot better being current in the 744.

Honestly, I really don't envision aviation being dominated by the 747 Classic as you seem to believe.

Anyhow, I'm not looking to get into a pissing match. It's just my opinion.

Nobody, least of all me, said any such thing.

Classic pilots, however, are not a "vanishing breed," nor is the use of classics indicative of a poor operator, as you insinuate.

I have no intention of getting into a pissing match, either. To suggest that one ought to bypass classics because they say something untoward about the operator, however, is at best inaccurate.

I don't know that I'd agree that a pilot has a greater chance, though certainly one has more options to which one can apply.