Beaver..you are s-o-o-o-o-o wrong and way behind. I am not wanting to stir the pot as you say but get what is due. Trust me, when this is arbitration is over the day I am off the forum at out of Atlas's life. Unless I get lucky enough (sic) to do an SAI in Purchase.

Crew Leasing
 

Nitty & DBW..

I would think that the Teamsters position would be the same as ALPA's. Representing a crew force from a crew leasing company with a contract that is not attached to any airline by scope would not be desirable. The contract is pretty much worthless without it.

I would also think that the Atlas crewmembers would want to get the best contract possible from this merger. By changing to the Teamster's representation for the merger, I believe we have played into the company's hands.

IMHO, I don't have big problems with being represented by IBT, as I already have been for about 15 years. They were mostly interested in collecting our dues, though. We have been better off with ALPA.

I know that the Atlas crews think they got a bad deal with ALPA. I don't think it was anything personal, ALPA just knew where this was all headed.

The best path for all of us is to merge under ALPA, then lets talk about changing to IBT at a later time. Cato is gone now. We don't have to do it his way.

BA,
I know you won't believe this because you've been told otherwise, but CATO HAD NOTHING to do with the Teamster's movement. In fact, when he found out, he called the Atlas MEC and asked what the heck was going on.

He knew ALPA, and had little or no experience dealing with Teamsters. He knew he could out do Pilot negotiators, but not the pro's that Teamsters will pay for.

Bottom line, Cato being gone changes nothing! Sorry.

Best Angle, first off I am a pilot nothing more nothing less. I will not nor will I ever claim to have the experience or the background to negotiate, that I will leave to a Proffessional Negotiator, Attorney and staff to determine the best way to position our group in contractual matters.

Much has been discussed but to what extent and the plan well that shall remain behind closed doors.

By the way those doors are open only to Atlas AND Polar crews who choose to be part of this solution...Interested?

Any Polar crewmember who wants to be involved is STRONGLY urged to contact the staff at www.atlasforteamsters.com and get in on YOUR future.

DBW

BA,

Here's another issue to consider. The word is out than your MEC is implying that if Polaroids vote ALPA and ALPA wins, he'll push to get an Polar LEC. Just what we need, more divisiveness. We would just get more of the fighting we've had since 2001. Good for management, bad for pilots.

I don't think most of us, Polar or Atlas would want to deal with that crap anymore. It's time to move on and join forces, in spite of the pi$$ poor timing.

"Sympathy"? Hardly. I'm just tired of your incessant "Everything Polar Bad, Everything Atlas Good" rhetoric. I don't feel like investing the time to go at it with you for REAL (I might as well try to turn you on your choice of Presidential candidate, religion, or abortion), so I appreciate it when someone else does. I'm shocked by anyone on EITHER side who can't EVER recognize that "the other guy" might even occasionally have a point, so you can shut your yap before you try to make the predictable non-point that I myself don't recognize that. Some people I've worked with at Polar are just as tiresome as reading YOUR tirades... I look forward to working with them again just about as much as I look forward to working with the likes of YOU.

Whale...
Since the company has decided to model their operation using Continental/Continental Air Micronesia as a template why shouldn't the union representation do the same?

Crew services
 

Belowmins..

The company is saying that the model will look like CO/AM, but thier intentions are clearly different. Continental does not LEASE crewmembers to Air Mike. Read the crew services agreement once again. Atlas intends to LEASE crews to the Polar certificate, post merger. The implications of this scam are huge.

Dealing with crap
 

quote:

"We would just get more of the fighting we've had since 2001. Good for management, bad for pilots.

I don't think most of us, Polar or Atlas would want to deal with that crap anymore. It's time to move on and join forces, in spite of the pi$$ poor timing."

Whale... we have not been fighting with you. A common misconception on this forum. And you are right, we don't want to put up with this crap, we have been forced into it.

Best Angle
Agree with you completely as to this being a scam. Since the company has publicly stated their intentention to use CO/AM as a model for their operation then the pilots should insist on a CO/AM type coverage in any SCBA. The scope, sucessorship and movement of pilots from certificate to certificate should follow at least the outline of CO/AM. The CO/AM model was not the pilots choice but the companys choice. We are going into this SCBA negotiations with no real idea of the companys intentions and no requirement they follow even their very vague stated intentions. It is sort of like buying a house and seeing it for the first time after you' ve signed all the papers.
Just sign on the dotted line and we'll work out the details later.

Furlough, how much do you think we will get out of this?

I hope some consideration can be made for those of us who were directly harmed: not some 6 month newbie getting a leg up while we got the boot.

:zzz::zzz::zzz::zzz::{:yuk:

Noted that ALPA National forced a signing of negotiation protocols for Polar. Circumventing your MEC. How is your group feeling about that?

How is commuting to your only base (ANC) looking like for your guys in November and the bid lines up there? It has been tough for Atlas guys with gateway airline tickets to get there, especially during the summer months. How many days off do you plan on having to burn per month commuting for your guys let alone hotels costs?

Anyhow, http://atlasforteamsters.com has a new message out.

Nitty
You enjoy other peoples pain way too much but then again it's Polar pain so they deserve it.

Quote:

---

so they deserve it

---

That was a below min's comment for airmen speak, Belowmins

As they say, "you reap what you sow" and Polar has planted plenty of pain. You just have a short and selective memory of it all and how it was used.

Anyhow, any answers? Any game plan other than the continued stalling?

Here was the Council 072 VARS Atlas Oct 26,2008

Noted that ALPA National forced a signing of negotiation protocols for Polar. Circumventing your MEC. How is your group feeling about that?

These protocols: Polar was keeping the strike option open but has now been forced by Atlas to accept binding arbitration over any open contractual items with the company. Do I understand this correctly?

N516MC went to its final resting place in Roswell today...

CR2, it's not final, just being parked until the Polar/Atlas merger is settled, one way or the other. Or until it is needed and Atlas is willing to deal with more arbitrations.

It will be going back to Atlas before too long. The merger is settled and there will be no more arbitrations.