time will tell......
 

6 2 8
Well time will tell if they were right to turn down the interview...cos a lot can happen in a week in politic's and even more in aviation....so in 10 yrs time if they passed the current 'dot to dot' test, who know's....to be offered a job, first you must get through the interview....then you are in a better position to make the call.... not before you have it...just ask my old m8 Austrian (From previous post's) now where has he gone...been a bit quiet recently...i'd have thought he'd have spouted his vast knowledge on this....he ho...
Hope it's locked !!
ND.

Speed alive:

To answer some of your questions.

Salary hasn't changed for many years except the increse of index from the Luxembourgish state. Per diem has technically increased (from USD to EUR).

After training you get about 4,200. As single you end up paying about 30% tax. About 800 tax free per diem is on top of that.

Roster still the same, 4 and 7 in every 28-days. 42 days vacation.

Average trip is about 7 days.

Hours flown is everywhere between 400 and 650 depending on seniority I would say. Some other guys would disagree. But it is a difference to always fly Shanghai and back or stay a week by the pool in Brasil.

Future outlook. Ah, now it gets interesting. Here probably some of my colleges will "correct" me. But whatever you hear the best answer is - nobody knows. The latest information in print is that in 2015 the company will have the same amount of aircraft as they have in one month (16). I fly more and more with guys saying they now expect between 15 and 20 years in right seat. Many have started to look for other jobs (not saying they will find something better). People, although small numbers, do resign for Air France and NetJets mainly.

Negotiations for a new CWA is coming soon. We all hope for some improvements, mainly regarding the rostering. Still one's private life is not always respected. For example they call you on your vacation or time off, they bring you home late (on off-days) etc etc. The whole operation is very tight. If something goes wrong (AOG, wx, overnight delay in LUX etc) the network (including the crew's rosters) is very easy distrubed.

CommitedToStay:

I am very well aware of business strategy and what goes in the press and what not. But the main point I was trying to make was, once again: "(...) whatever you hear the best answer is - nobody knows". A few chosen ones maybe do know, although I believe even our management doesn't know. They're too busy with all the court cases going on.

Now, having said that, I just informed about what was the latest in print. One should take it for what it is. Also, from a personal experience, I informed about that I fly with many (and I mean many) colleges that look for other jobs. That's fact. But again, if they find something better, who knows.

Also a personal opinion regarding an expansion. Cargolux have in total 25 747-8 aircraft on order (of which 12 options/purchase rights). If they elect to utilize these options it won't be in LUX. The cargo apron (the current and the who-knows-when-future one) and cargo center won't take it. Then Cargolux have to expand somewhere else.

Just my own guess.

Until then we all should hope that our management have a plan for us. :confused:

not to mention the new customer friendly airport taxes..
any movement 23-2400 standing landing fees doubled,any movement 2400-0600 standard landing fees trebled..got to pay for the new green house and park and ride somehow...

Hi CEJM,
I see that you have recently gone through the job application process, was just wondering whether you have accepted the job offer,if any?

Secondly, what can you tell about the second interview(with Chief Pilot/Manager recruitment)?

Many thanks!
Highflyer

Snorri still there? :}

From the A1/E44 highway take the exit (no 9 I think) signed to the Airport/Senningerberg follow signs to airport to next roundabout, continue via the second exit south-west (do not go round to airport terminal). Go straight through the next set of traffic lights with the Etap and Ibis hotels to your right to the next set of lights where you turn right into Rue Kilwee. Continue 100 metres and the entrance is on your left, a lifting barrier. Press the call button and the security guard will let you in, follow the road around to your left to the front of the building and you will see the door marked reception - enter there and the receptionists are straight in front of you and will tell you where to go.

Good luck.

P.S. If arriving by air walk out of the terminal to the main road and turn left. Keep walking past the first set of lights and as above, it will take about 20 minutes.

Oops, beaten to it!

you cant get past reception unescorted so you will be meet
and taken to the various offices

if you get lost once past the ibis remember on the main road igonore buildings on your left even though they display cargolux logo's this is the old main building and hangar..your target is the lorang building behind the cafe check inn which is on your right..

:ok:

Walk out of airport, turn left. Find pub on opposite side of the road. It's behind the pub. :} (Called Check Inn as acmi48 mentioned)

If the person you are looking for is unavailable, check pub :}:}

......whatever they told you about the working conditions is propably what is agreed upon between the pilots union and management. That is, however, a distant truth when you start. Then they will roster you in stark violation to the collective work agreement, they will tell you that you are expected to fly on your off days if they are short of crews, they will cut down on your resttime, crew control will monitor your every step, and report to the chiefpilot if you do not comply with what they want you to do, etc. etc.
Good luck though...

Hawkeye red

wow hawkeye; what company are you working for? Doesn't really seem like the Cargolux I know...

How strict is the requirement to reside within 2 hours of base/10 hours before duty? Are there any specifics (2 hours by train/car/bus etc)?. Do any of the faster trains like the ICE etc pass through or near LUX?

Cheers!

LP

It is just a requirement to be there, your mode of travel is your decision to make. If you don't make it, there's no excuse. But I suppose that's normal.
Regarding fast trains: you'll only have a TGV connection into LUX. From the German side everything goes via Trier. Not being familiar with the German part, I suppose you can go fast until Trier, and normal afterwards to LUX.
Mostly people drive from f.e. Cologne, and leave some time before their expected wake-up call. Mostly it's spot on, but if the wake-up call comes later than anticipated, they'll have to spend some hours in the crewroom.
Also in winter time they allow more time for travel, which can make it a pretty long day.
As alternative you'll find crewmembers sharing an apartment in Trier or surroundings, costing them maybe 150EUR all-in per person.

QUOTE]Chief pilot clearly said tha expecting 10yr for upgrade right now would be "very very conservative". Was he selling me the job?[[/QUOTE]

very conservative, as it will take 20yrs or 5?

call is yours...if you want variety...CV, if you want routine CX, you'll do Europe-DXB-HKG, with a PVG turnaround or something, and then same way back to europe, they say command in min 18 month's....if you get past the "Ayre's rock assain's", but then you'll get more days off at home with CX, and depending on how you pay your tax...slightly more $$$.... but if you want to know more ask me old mate Austrian 79 ( from previous post's) he seems' to be full of in depth knowedge of all things CV....now where has he gone....

ND.

I would say CV if you don't want routine, CX if you want routine and no fun at all.
Moneywise it's strongly depending on the US$ and where you're living as the HK$ is still somehow linked to the US one.
I don't see 20 years for the upgrade in CV but if that's your primary factor, stay away better opportunities out there those days, not in central Europe though!!! Unless you're 25 and qualified.
Good luck.

I hope the chief pilot knows more than we do... he should anyway. What we know is not too optimistic (no expansion for the next 8 some years). See previous posts.

Regarding CV or CX. I think one should think about having a European or Asian contract. I would prefer the first. A European contract is more regulated and one should be more protected in the long term. See what happened to the guys at Oasis, or what happened the the 49’ers at CX. And much more. I believe Asia is far away from Europe regarding the labor laws. As well is the States.

But yes, Luxembourg is very special. CV also had cases where people were unfairly dismissed. Guess it happens in Europe as well, but much much more in Asia and elsewhere.

And another good point with CV is that you have a European contract and homebase. What guaranties do you have that CX will let you stay at a base in Europe, or when you upgrade then might ask you to move all your family to lovely clean aired Hong Kong? With the Asians you have no guaranties.

I had quite a similar choice, and I went for CV rather than an Asian carrier. And I don’t regret it.

Just food for thoughts.

/jungleland

Ok, that's a good start. But I still think the Asian companies can do whatever they want with you. And doing that they would not consider local laws. They would simply offer you a new contract based in HKG, they won't fire you.

Hello,


CTS is pretty accurate with accommodation, but a wee OTT and something to consider: CV might be holding back expansion plans for obvious reasons, since a new CWA negs are coming up. This has happened before and the real head of the company is known to run the show this way...

This has of course impact on ugrades and should be of consideration when thinking about joining. Naturally it doesn't help anyone right now but might make a difference...

S

Accommodation
 

Alcione, not sure if you got my PM but may I suggest websites "athome.lu" or "fishbach.lu" failing that try asking someone in Personnel.

Maybe one should get the permanent contract (1 year after joining) before making too many changes in personal life, like moving there or moving your family to there etc. During that year it also gives you an idea of which areas you like and can afford ;).

But it's a nice company, easy to enjoy. Somewhat strange sometimes, but that's not the company, it's the business we're in.

/jungleland

Can Alcione or azdriver or others who have been hired recently talk about experience levels? Do most newhires far exceed the minimums or are they near the minimums? What about flight experience - are we talking about LCC, bizjet, military, regional jet? It would be helpful to know these things for people who are considering applying.

General question to the group: do newhires start as SOs (cruise pilots) or do they start as FOs on the line?

Cheers

Cargolux doesn't have SO's or cruise pilots. Everyone is being hired as FO (junior). Depending how you agree within the crew, you’ll be flying FO or operate as a relief pilot on that very sector. Sometimes even you fly with two captains, then one of them work as a relief pilot.

Cargolux is very easy going in that sense. It is not much of the hierarchy as in, for example, many Asian airlines like Cathay.

Just hired have to start the 10th of Nov.

TT 5500hr
1300hr as Capt on the BAe-146/RJ
1400hr as Capt on the ATR

Ciao AZdriver,
what' your final decision? CV or CX?

Presently about 384 pilots and 16 a/c.
Capt/co approx. 50% so 12 captains and 12 co's per a/c.
Based on retirement at 65 and a steady expansion of 1 a/c per year up to a maximum of 25, the last one on the seniority list would get his/her upgrade in 2026.
To have an upgrade in 10 years 30 aircraft would be needed...

With the pension deal we have I don't see too many people leave before the age of 65.
If 3 pilots per year being higher on the seniority list would leave, a couple of eternal co's, then: max 25 a/c -> upgrade in 2022, max 20 a/c -> upgrade in 2027

CTS, maybe my math is not accurate but, between the day I joined and now we got 3 new aircraft.
With approx 24 crewmembers per aircraft I should have about 72 colleagues behind me right?
I think I'm FO 125 now and the last FO is 193 on my list so it looks like my math is not too bad :confused:
According to my calculation you need 24 new FO's for an extra aircraft as 12 FO's will be upgraded.

What is the Cargolux's pilot profile???
I have been applying for three years, JAR Frozen ATPL, FAA's ATPL,
4000 hrs SIC Heavy (more than 500 in B744), 6000 hrs total time and they
have always replied the same, KEEP TRYING!!!!

I don't speak German, maybe that's the reason...
There is any other way to send the CV than the interpersonal website:confused::confused::confused::confused::confused:

Howdy,
first of all a big thanks to all the contributors of this very informative post. I have read through it several times now in the last weeks and months in order to get a balanced picture of what's going on in cargoland.
I'm currently with a lowcost carrier based in the sunnier sides of western europe, but am finding out that I want something else in my career. I would like to return to my 'heimat' in the lower lands, and commute to luxembourg. So are there many commuters and does Cargolux frown upon that? how about the long run? do commuters eventually decide to move to luxembourg? I don't exclude a move to lux, however for now I prefer not to. I realize that this is a personal decision but I would appreciate to hear some experiences from other commuters, before I go to the screening.
thanks guys('n gals)

cheers

I´d say about 70% of us are commuters. As long as you can stand it and manage it reasonably - be there rested and on time - it´s o.k. Average twice a month.

Just be sensible in the interview.

Yea, I heard 80% commuters (living more than 2 hrs away). The fact is that the company don't find enough pilots in the Glorious Nation, why they hire people further away. But they can't force people to move. Again, they will ask you during your interview if you're willing.

And who isn't?! :ugh:

By the way, did we sort out how long the time to upgrade would be with the current known conditions?

I see they hire many new pilots now, several every month.

Thanks for the input guys,
I'll be discrete about it on the interview. I might want to move in a later stage, but now I just prefer a bit of stability( If I make it through ofcourse :-).
This approach seems a bit odd to me, talked to some other operators and they didn't have any problem with commuters. One of them was even proud of the fact that their pilots were living all over the place. One would think that for a long haul operator this wouldn't be an issue.
Can anyone explain what the thought behind this policy is?

Hard to say, depends on the age at which people retire, people leaving for various other reasons, eternal F/O's and fleet expansion.
Without fleet expansion, retirement at 65, 2 more senior extra leaving per year and 5 eternal F/O's it would be close to 2030.
Same numbers but expansion of 1 a/c per year up to 25 a/c it would be 2024.
1 a/c per year up to 30 a/c it would be 2020.

LBR, that doesn't look too promising...

Cargolux uptate need
 

I need updated info about Cargolux roster.

Thanks to all!!!

You mean: I would like to have ..........:=

Does anyone have some details about the first day in Saarlouis?
would be great.
Thank you....

First advice: Take a hotel and be there the night before, so you arrive well rested for the day.

On the day itself: First thing you have to do, is go to the doctor for a medical check-up.

After that you go to IBF itself on a different location. The atmosphere is quite relaxed I have to say. When I went, I was there alone. You sit in a room with 4 or 5 computers. The guy from IBF will explain you how to use the computer and then off you go!

There are many different tests, like multitasking, concentration, recognizing shapes etc...
Also personality tests have to be done.

All in all, I did not find the tests that difficult, and there is not really a specific preparation you can do. If you play a computer game from time to time, you should be fine. Only thing is that it takes a long time to complete all the tests, and you need to keep your concentration up at all times, so what I did was only eat little portions in between the tests and the break at noon to avoid that lazy feeling after dinner (I only ate bananas that day;-)

Once all the tests are completed you go for a chat with the psychologist, takes about 30mins, he will ask you how you think you did the tests, wants to know your motivation for joining Cargolux etc..., and that's it for the day.

I got a call from Cargolux 1,5 week later telling me I passed the tests, and I got invited for an interview in the next coming weeks.

If there is a Cargolux pilot who wants to share a few of his rosters with me, please feel free to PM me.

Good luck!

thank you Bae,
that gives me an overview. i try to ask you about
the interview if i get that far....