West Atlantic 737-800 Freighters
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: UK
Posts: 8
West Atlantic 737-800 Freighters
With the announcement of the 4 new 800 freighters are West Atlantic looking to recruit DEC's? I am a 737 300 freight/737 800 experienced captain and like the idea of 7 on/off rather than the usual LoCo lifestyle carnage roster I currently endure!
Is the 737 contract as good as some make out? Take home £4500ish pm?
Is the 737 contract as good as some make out? Take home £4500ish pm?
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Essex, UK
Posts: 240
Yes they are looking for Captains Fred, and it is one week on, one week off. Youre not always away for the full week on your week on either. You also have your annual holiday to take as well, so by taking one week holiday you will be off for three weeks. Time off in the Summer is not an issue either.
They can use a maximum of 10 days of your week off period per year for training though (SIM's, CRM etc).
Take home for a Captain is around £5000.. You can earn more if you want by working a day or so on your week off.
They can use a maximum of 10 days of your week off period per year for training though (SIM's, CRM etc).
Take home for a Captain is around £5000.. You can earn more if you want by working a day or so on your week off.
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: The Pointy End
Posts: 32
Regarding Direct Entry Captains:
Is recruitment on-going at present?
Do they use their own recruitment department or an outside agency? So is their website the only way of applying?
When will the first -800 arrive?
How far apart will deliveries be of each of the 4 -800s?
How do they decide who flies the -800's ...meaning... is it decided by seniority or time on the -800, or to put it another way, would a DEC go straight to the -800 after coming from an -800 , or start at the bottom of seniority and be made go to the -400?
What are the chances of an EMA base - I have no interest in a Northern European base for many reasons including massive Scandinavian taxes.
Hoping someone can shed some light on these questions.
PS if you don't want to answer publicly please PM me.
EFISchap
Is recruitment on-going at present?
Do they use their own recruitment department or an outside agency? So is their website the only way of applying?
When will the first -800 arrive?
How far apart will deliveries be of each of the 4 -800s?
How do they decide who flies the -800's ...meaning... is it decided by seniority or time on the -800, or to put it another way, would a DEC go straight to the -800 after coming from an -800 , or start at the bottom of seniority and be made go to the -400?
What are the chances of an EMA base - I have no interest in a Northern European base for many reasons including massive Scandinavian taxes.
Hoping someone can shed some light on these questions.
PS if you don't want to answer publicly please PM me.
EFISchap
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: The Pointy End
Posts: 32
Hello guys,
What is the latest situation with West Atlantic recruitment?
They recently hired 6/7 ex-Monarch pilots so does that mean the end of recruitment for now?
Recently chatting to a colleague who was saying from an operations standpoint there is a lot of old 737's; some are very analogue and some are more glass...any first hand information on this from any active West Atlantic jockeys?
Is the roster stable????
Id also like to echo """"FREDTHEDOG"'"""s questions in the hope someone may answer!
Sincerely, EFISchap
What is the latest situation with West Atlantic recruitment?
They recently hired 6/7 ex-Monarch pilots so does that mean the end of recruitment for now?
Recently chatting to a colleague who was saying from an operations standpoint there is a lot of old 737's; some are very analogue and some are more glass...any first hand information on this from any active West Atlantic jockeys?
Is the roster stable????
Id also like to echo """"FREDTHEDOG"'"""s questions in the hope someone may answer!
Sincerely, EFISchap
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Cockbill Street
Posts: 2
Amber Alert
The shambolic introduction of one week on one week off is now starting to unravel as the company begins to realise it’s own incompetence because they have not adequately planned for the number of crews needed to operate the one week off. As the company continues with its year on year, loss making, business model the bean counters and operations management team have come up with a cunning plan to reboot the viability of their “lifestyle choice, nice little company” by getting us to hand back 14 off days and call it two weeks leave. At a time when it would make sense to retain the support of those at the sharp end, the company is now pursuing a management strategy that looks like it is headed for a formal grievance procedure.
Meanwhile the empty promises of early command continue, with the company littered with broken careers as a consequence of first officers being seduced by the offer of an early command only to fall foul of a high failure rate in the simulator.
Meanwhile the empty promises of early command continue, with the company littered with broken careers as a consequence of first officers being seduced by the offer of an early command only to fall foul of a high failure rate in the simulator.
Last edited by Pointless Albatross; 9th Jan 2018 at 10:21.
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: N5552.0W00419.0ish
Posts: 88
The flying can be interesting, here. There's also the mundane.
Week on/week off to some extent helps with the impact on personal life. It will suit some more than others, much like any other operation. It's not perfect, but as seen in many threads, perfect jobs are somewhat rare.
Every company I've worked for has had some 'special' people develop some utterly stupid ideas. Thankfully, the majority of these are quashed before they get beyond the 'drawing board', but once in a while an idea will manage to survive and just end up costing the company. This bizarre idea to reduce the leave allocation should have been binned before HR presented it. It beggars belief that more than one 'responsible' person considered it a valid idea. It's akin to one of those daft comments people make without thinking, that leave them looking rather foolish. The fact that HR were still canvassing for more feedback suggests that they truly are divorced from reality.
At a time when there should be more effort made to strengthen the operation, bizarre schemes like this surely can only undermine it.
Week on/week off to some extent helps with the impact on personal life. It will suit some more than others, much like any other operation. It's not perfect, but as seen in many threads, perfect jobs are somewhat rare.
Every company I've worked for has had some 'special' people develop some utterly stupid ideas. Thankfully, the majority of these are quashed before they get beyond the 'drawing board', but once in a while an idea will manage to survive and just end up costing the company. This bizarre idea to reduce the leave allocation should have been binned before HR presented it. It beggars belief that more than one 'responsible' person considered it a valid idea. It's akin to one of those daft comments people make without thinking, that leave them looking rather foolish. The fact that HR were still canvassing for more feedback suggests that they truly are divorced from reality.
At a time when there should be more effort made to strengthen the operation, bizarre schemes like this surely can only undermine it.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: UK
Posts: 8
So are you guys saying that they are just taking 14 days of the annual leave off people or just asking people to give up 14 off days pa? Are those days paid accordingly with day off payments?
Like to hear more about these interesting employee policies!
My previous experience of short sector night freight was very positive ie it’s much easier on family and self than constant 4-5 hour sectors finishing at 2-3-4 am or 5 earlies getting up at 4am and lots of min rest with constant changes.
7 on 7 off certainly sounds far more appealing than 6 on 2 off to me but it sounds like this is not sustainable? Does it look like they will revoke the fixed roster? Surely that is the main reason people work there? Being able to plan ahead and have a life has got to be better than random rostering from one month to the next then the planned roster changes out of all recognition anyway?
Be good to hear more details on why they are so bad, pm if preferred!
Like to hear more about these interesting employee policies!
My previous experience of short sector night freight was very positive ie it’s much easier on family and self than constant 4-5 hour sectors finishing at 2-3-4 am or 5 earlies getting up at 4am and lots of min rest with constant changes.
7 on 7 off certainly sounds far more appealing than 6 on 2 off to me but it sounds like this is not sustainable? Does it look like they will revoke the fixed roster? Surely that is the main reason people work there? Being able to plan ahead and have a life has got to be better than random rostering from one month to the next then the planned roster changes out of all recognition anyway?
Be good to hear more details on why they are so bad, pm if preferred!
Last edited by fredthedog; 10th Jan 2018 at 22:38.
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Cockbill Street
Posts: 2
Yes Fred, they are trying to get us to sacrifice 50% of our leave entitlement, losing 14 days off a year. In terms of compensation, there is no compensation being offered for 7 of those days and a fixed payment for the remaining 7 days. At the moment it is unclear what they mean by this or how much. It is possible that it will be a one off payment not repeated in subsequent years.
When we were recruited into the company, they were struggling to attract anything like the numbers required to fulfil their fleet expansion. The pay is more than 20% below parity and the work is not glamorous. Then they came up with the plan to sell Westatlantic as a “lifestyle” choice with one week on, one week off plus 28 days leave. This spin is turning out to be worthy of Alistair Cambell’s more colourful efforts to place Tony Blair in a positive light. Now that a successful recruitment campign has drawn people into the company, the reality of having to deliver on their promise is beginning to bite and the bean counters are seeking to claw back benefits.
You have to understand that since 2011, when Atlantic Airlines merged with Westair Sweden, the Group’s Earnings Before Interest have been in precipitous decline and 2017is on course to be the third year in a row that the group has increased the size of its losses . Last year, because the earnings to debt ratio breached a maintenance test as a condition of it’s Bond Covenant, the company was granted a waiver to its obligations. Whilst I am no accountant, I think that can be compared to a mortgage holiday on the money it has borrowed. How long the bond holders patience will last I have no idea.
Additionaly, a significant proportion of its business depends on cabotage rights, granted as a consequence of belonging to the EU. No one can predict at the moment how, for example the contract with French Post or DHL will be affected, post brexit. The company is highly geared, having borrowed heavily to fund its fleet expansion, which will leave it very exposed to any cancellation of European business should French Post return to ASL.
Therefore the company has more on its mind than our careers and job satisfaction. I read recently an obituary where a past Editor of the Guardian was described as being honoured to have serve his employer.This is not an airline that will attract that kind of memorial but then, as you know, no airline at this level is. On the other hand it allows me to pay my bills and fund a modest lifestyle, satisfy my first love (flying aeroplanes),visit interesting places around Europe and work with a great bunch of guys and gals. It is what it is!
Think of the recruitment process as Alistair Campbell’s spin and remember that, believable though he was, Tony Blair was not always telling the truth.
When we were recruited into the company, they were struggling to attract anything like the numbers required to fulfil their fleet expansion. The pay is more than 20% below parity and the work is not glamorous. Then they came up with the plan to sell Westatlantic as a “lifestyle” choice with one week on, one week off plus 28 days leave. This spin is turning out to be worthy of Alistair Cambell’s more colourful efforts to place Tony Blair in a positive light. Now that a successful recruitment campign has drawn people into the company, the reality of having to deliver on their promise is beginning to bite and the bean counters are seeking to claw back benefits.
You have to understand that since 2011, when Atlantic Airlines merged with Westair Sweden, the Group’s Earnings Before Interest have been in precipitous decline and 2017is on course to be the third year in a row that the group has increased the size of its losses . Last year, because the earnings to debt ratio breached a maintenance test as a condition of it’s Bond Covenant, the company was granted a waiver to its obligations. Whilst I am no accountant, I think that can be compared to a mortgage holiday on the money it has borrowed. How long the bond holders patience will last I have no idea.
Additionaly, a significant proportion of its business depends on cabotage rights, granted as a consequence of belonging to the EU. No one can predict at the moment how, for example the contract with French Post or DHL will be affected, post brexit. The company is highly geared, having borrowed heavily to fund its fleet expansion, which will leave it very exposed to any cancellation of European business should French Post return to ASL.
Therefore the company has more on its mind than our careers and job satisfaction. I read recently an obituary where a past Editor of the Guardian was described as being honoured to have serve his employer.This is not an airline that will attract that kind of memorial but then, as you know, no airline at this level is. On the other hand it allows me to pay my bills and fund a modest lifestyle, satisfy my first love (flying aeroplanes),visit interesting places around Europe and work with a great bunch of guys and gals. It is what it is!
Think of the recruitment process as Alistair Campbell’s spin and remember that, believable though he was, Tony Blair was not always telling the truth.
Last edited by Pointless Albatross; 11th Jan 2018 at 19:31.
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: N5552.0W00419.0ish
Posts: 88
Originally Posted by totty highflier
But, you also get 26 predictable weeks off per year......
Let’s not forget that minor detail.....
Let’s not forget that minor detail.....
There are 'training days' which are allocated in the off weeks. For certain, 2 sims per year, that's 2 weeks broken up. One two day recurrent, results in another broken week. It's not completely transparent when those weeks will be. So, in reality, it's up to 23 full weeks off, with some unpredictability.
