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-   -   CX requires a complete cleansing... (https://www.pprune.org/fragrant-harbour/631364-cx-requires-complete-cleansing.html)

AllWobbly 8th Apr 2020 09:25


Originally Posted by Freehills (Post 10743430)
Could all be moot unless Swire have got enough guanxi to get a major loan to keep CX afloat from the govt (like AF) Most likely this will come with massive strings attached, like handing control to Air China/ Beijing.

That might not be too bad. The KA crews did ok when they were owned mostly by the PRC

deja vu 8th Apr 2020 10:21


Originally Posted by Piet Lood (Post 10743298)
Ask me what happens when they do “whimper” and try to make a difference.

I doubt you can tell us what happens because it was never put to the test.
But by all means tell us what you think would happen.

Freehills 8th Apr 2020 10:33


Originally Posted by AllWobbly (Post 10743496)
That might not be too bad. The KA crews did ok when they were owned mostly by the PRC


good point, and the Chinese carriers paid well to expats

deja vu 8th Apr 2020 10:47


Originally Posted by AllWobbly (Post 10743496)
That might not be too bad. The KA crews did ok when they were owned mostly by the PRC

Wishful thinking I fear. KA crews established their lot well before any PRC involvement, coincidently it has deteriorated gradually from then.

FlyingNun 8th Apr 2020 10:52

The only point I agree with the Thread Starter is regarding the Jepp Rostering system.
The rest was unwarranted attack on a hypothetical Character ignoring the fact that it always takes two to Tango.
Putting a blame on one gender is sexist at best.
You also have to live with the fact that this company is part of a larger empire, and the puppet masters have the right to choose.
No matter who the CEO is, it is a fact that major decisions come from higher authorities.
Directors are just that “To direct”.
Swire, right or wrong, have managed to survive for decades.
They are also waiting for the “Who’s going to blink first” scenario along with other major airlines.

cabbages 8th Apr 2020 11:02

"Putting a blame on one gender is racist at best."

Que??

Piet Lood 8th Apr 2020 11:05


Originally Posted by deja vu (Post 10743540)
I doubt you can tell us what happens because it was never put to the test.
But by all means tell us what you think would happen.

They’d be ex-employees. Ask me how I know.

FlyingNun 8th Apr 2020 11:19


Originally Posted by cabbages (Post 10743579)
"Putting a blame on one gender is racist at best."

Que??

Sorry I meant sexist

Threethirty 8th Apr 2020 11:52

Are you sure?

Progress Wanchai 8th Apr 2020 12:20


Originally Posted by FlyingNun (Post 10743567)
The only point I agree with the Thread Starter is regarding the Jepp Rostering system.
The rest was unwarranted attack on a hypothetical Character ignoring the fact that it always takes two to Tango.
Putting a blame on one gender is sexist at best.
You also have to live with the fact that this company is part of a larger empire, and the puppet masters have the right to choose.
No matter who the CEO is, it is a fact that major decisions come from higher authorities.
Directors are just that “To direct”.
Swire, right or wrong, have managed to survive for decades.
They are also waiting for the “Who’s going to blink first” scenario along with other major airlines.

Swire is a minority shareholder.

Name one other airline where the major decisions are made by the board of a minority shareholder rather than by the airline’s board?

Slasher1 8th Apr 2020 12:56


Originally Posted by Progress Wanchai (Post 10743673)
Swire is a minority shareholder.

Name one other airline where the major decisions are made by the board of a minority shareholder rather than by the airline’s board?

Not to quibble, but I think this a bit misleading.

From what I understand Swire Pacific owns 45%, Air China 30% and Qatar 10%. Effectively making the airline a sort of partnership where SP has the overriding majority. So SP has the overall hammer with AC having a significant potential voice in the matter and Qatar getting a token opinion.

Progress Wanchai 8th Apr 2020 13:05


Originally Posted by Slasher1 (Post 10743715)
Not to quibble, but I think this a bit misleading.

From what I understand Swire Pacific owns 45%, Air China 30% and Qatar 10%. Effectively making the airline a sort of partnership where SP has the overriding majority. So SP has the overall hammer with AC having a significant potential voice in the matter and Qatar getting a token opinion.

There’s quibbling and then there’s being wrong.

By definition a minority shareholder is any shareholder that owns less than 51% of a company. Every single company on the planet has a largest shareholder. Yet it’s rare that the largest shareholder has management rights when they’re a minority shareholder.

My question still stands. Name one other airline that is run by the board of a minority shareholder. Particularly a minority shareholder that has numerous related interests.

A follow up question. When was the last time a decision made by the JSSHK management team at the airline was the subject of a conflict of interest review?

oriental flyer 8th Apr 2020 17:17

Everyone is tending to get bogged down in side issues , The initial thrust of Trafs brilliant thread is totally correct CX needs a spring clean .
There is a similarity between this and the Carrier captain that was recently fired for daring to care about his sailors . By drawing attention to the situation he embarrassed the high ups and had to pay . Well the navy secretary has now gone due to his Incompetent handling of this issue . So there is some justice elsewhere ,
But who at CX has been fired for the fuel hedging disaster ? Who decided that it was a good idea to alienate your workforce .?
Why Aren’t pilot managers held to the same rules as the rest of us ?
trafalgar is right Cx needs a clean sweep , employ someone who knows what they are doing , get the employees back on side and work for a well run company

Absolutely Fabulous 9th Apr 2020 02:23


Originally Posted by Progress Wanchai (Post 10743726)
There’s quibbling and then there’s being wrong.

By definition a minority shareholder is any shareholder that owns less than 51% of a company. Every single company on the planet has a largest shareholder. Yet it’s rare that the largest shareholder has management rights when they’re a minority shareholder.

My question still stands. Name one other airline that is run by the board of a minority shareholder. Particularly a minority shareholder that has numerous related interests.

A follow up question. When was the last time a decision made by the JSSHK management team at the airline was the subject of a conflict of interest review?

There's quibbling and then there's being wrong indeed.

Because of grandfathered B shares voting rights, Swire, the controlling shareholder has 29% of the equity but 52.2% voting control.

never ready 9th Apr 2020 03:27

https://www.fool.hk/en/2020/04/07/sw...buying-shares/

Flex88 9th Apr 2020 14:24

Changes, "a clean sweep" will NEVER occur... It's in the companies DNA ! So much so that Swires, being unable to source automatons closely aligned to their "management style", set up their own management training program in HK. This outlet continues to belch Swire management glad handers spewing pre programmed Swire propaganda with the built in "yes" response..

This "downturn" is NOT going to end, travel wise, for years.. I can't see anyone in the West being attracted to a China vacation for the next decade.. Be nimble


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