I have lurked for too long, whilst seeing on PPRuNe, the disintegration of the HKAOA, and management's exploitation of your dysfunctional group. I am an HK expat with aviation interests, many decades Marco Polo member, but now choose not to fly CX because the product is not what it was.

The flight crew guys that I know are all on terms, with ARAPA and using the cash to buy investment properties in HK. All are reveling in CX's woes, with much ridicule of the late Anna, and now much denigration of the Jellyfish. Also, much criticism of SOs from Cadet intake. So workplace and cockpit morale are compromised. All are exuberant about the rate of resignations. When asked about training policy and their personal promotion, they become ambivalent.

When asked about moving on, all plead GOLDEN HANDCUFFS! So not underpaid.

Acceptance of "seniority" is an anachronism in today's world. Any true profession does not work like this.

No wonder you guys can't sort yourselves out. You get what you deserve.

Truly Cathay Pathetic.

I walked the talk and left Cathay.

It is that bad.

No I don't have kids. Yes I do have an eye on my retirement eventually.

Ever elusive airline job... Seriously? Start looking harder.

Sorry JA but that's factually incorrect. CX now make you pay upfront 50% and I believe that number is $700kHKD (happy to be corrected). This is repaid over 3 years, so $20kpm. deduct that from your Yr1,2,3 SO salary, tax rent, living costs and you are left with around $5000-$8000pm....assuming you has a wad of cash to start with to help with the setup costs!

Of course, we all started somewhere and in debt so this is no different, whoever is looking needs to take all those factors into consideration rather than looking for confirmation bias which seems to be the case most of the time.

So the way that CX are recouping that 50% of the training is by no longer paying the HKPA, I'm unsure if this applies to everyone on the new COS18 or just cadets. You are right of course that CX is now making cadets contribute to their training through salary deductions but as this is paid from salary deductions I wouldn't count this as up-front in the same way the BA or easyJet scheme runs where the money has to be found prior to training (so either rich parents, massive savings or a loan which you're going to have to pay a massive amount of interest on).

This salary reduction scheme is the same way that Air France's, Aer Lingus and Lufthansa's schemes work.

If you guys have any suggestions as to better ways to break into the industry then please let me know. I realise I missed off the military from my options (although pretty much all European airforces are being cut down atm) and instructing to build hours (although still leaves the initial investment and even though its not great, a CX SO lifestyle sounds better than an instructors, also progression is much faster and easier) but the state of the industry is pretty ****e for wannabes, even with a 'pilot shortage'.

CISTRS , seniority is very much an active part of aviation , The airlines love it because it keeps the pilots in line, so they would fight its removal with everything that they have . Trust me if there was no seniority and pilots were free to move to a like for like position or better in another company offering better perks , there would be a continual movement of pilots like most other professions. Sadly though even if one airline revoked seniority none of the others would so the workforce finds itself stuck with this system .This actively discourages pilots moving from one company to another . Who wants to move from a Capt position to second Officer at another airline . This is exactly why airlines love seniority it stops pilots taking their expertise and training costs to the opposition .

The difference between the 80's and today, is that in the 80's you only left Cathay for one of the following three reasons
1 Retirement
2 Ill Health / Death
3 Be Fired.

Thus they were not concerned about training costs back then . They knew that the workforce would, for the most part, be with them for 20+ years so it wasn't an issue . Plus everyone they recruited had thousands of flying hours
Today it's very different Cadets, and a lack of a long term career

No offence intended by what I am about to say, but it has to be said. In the current climate, if you are struggling to find an airline job then there is something seriously wrong with you. Either that or you are a fresh CPL holder punching above your weight?

Best of luck.

None taken!

Yes, my case is the latter, just another CPL holder. But hey, I was not punching above my weight. As I said, I never intended to offend anyone but I was just curious as to why there's a discrepancy b/w words (rant) and action (resignation)?!

The discrepancy is because life just isn't that simple. People have families, mortgages, etc. I wish I could resign right now, but I can't.

My advice to you is to get yourself into a legacy carrier in your home country and make a career of it. Sadly that is all that this industry has left to offer, the rest is hollow and meaningless. I understand you want to build hours, great. We have all been there and done that. When I finished my CPL I packed my belongings into a suitcase and moved between 3 different countries to build time. Now I'm sitting in a wide body doing what I had always dreamed of, but guess what? It sucks. I hate the country I live in, I have no work/life balance, and to top it all off my family is extremely unhappy here because of the reasons I just listed. Now I long to go back to my home country and to do so will cost me everything I have spent over a decade working towards. But it has to be done. Meanwhile, all of my friends who stayed put are now sitting nicely in a legacy carrier, have a great work/life balance and a rewarding career ahead of them. I'll most likely be flying a turbo prop in less than a year from now.

Unless you want to end up like me, and countless others in airlines like CX, EK, EY, QR, you name it, don't fall into the trap of the big shiny long haul gig. Get yourself into a company that offers a long and stable career path, not just a quick upgrade. Upgrades are usually quick for a reason, and that means you won't be staying long either. Where do you go after the shiny upgrade wears off? China? Remember; the higher you climb, the harder you fall.

At the end of the day, once you close the flight deck door, it is all the same. Just another aeroplane, airport, set of cabin crew.

Good luck, I hope you make the right choice.

Sir, thank you for the advice, really appreciate it!

As for legacy carriers in my home country (India), it is an absolute mess here, hence looking elsewhere!